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DAW software with Playlists like PT
Old 9th May 2006
  #1
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espasonico's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
DAW software with Playlists like PT

Hi, I´m really interested in doing multitrack recordings and I love the playlist function in PT but I don´t wanna use Digidesign hardware for the recording.

My idea is to use a card with ADAT ( 1 or 2 ), and use some external pre´s and converters to record on location and don´t want to spend money in 002r or M-Audio stuff ( i´m thinking RME here )

So I´m looking for software that allows me to record several takes and do some edits between them if needed ( that´s why I want the playlist option ) and also it will be nice if also have the time stamp function.

Any ideas ?

P.D.: I´m planning using a PC so no DP or MAC software.

Thanks.
Old 9th May 2006
  #2
Gear Nut
 
Dan DeTora's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
just record to the same track and drag each take to an open audio track (muted, of course). then comp when you're done.

i personally never got into playlists in PT.
Old 9th May 2006 | Show parent
  #3
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espasonico's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Thanks for the reply but that´s what I used to do in Logic for PC and that is also why I´m looking for the Playlist thing ( when multitracking can be a PITA ). Once you get used to the playlist thing is difficult to forget it.

Thanks.
Old 9th May 2006 | Show parent
  #4
Gear Addict
 
🎧 15 years
SAWStudio has "Layers"

Rail
Old 10th May 2006 | Show parent
  #5
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
Pyramix also has playlists...

--Ben
Old 10th May 2006 | Show parent
  #6
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espasonico's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Thanks guys !!

I have seen and correct me if I´m wrong that Pyramix Native only allows you to track 8 inputs.

ALso, I´ve seen that the different versions of SAWstudio allows you different numbers of layers. If a "Layer" in SAW is the same concept as Playlists in PT this means that I can only have 8 layers if using SAW Full, it´s that right ?

Does Sequoia have something like playlist ?

Thanks
Old 10th May 2006 | Show parent
  #7
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by espasonico
Does Sequoia have something like playlist ?

Thanks
Not really... There is a take manager that can help when you do multiple takes over each other, but it isn't a playlist like in PT.

--Ben
Old 10th May 2006 | Show parent
  #8
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espasonico's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by fifthcircle
Not really... There is a take manager that can help when you do multiple takes over each other, but it isn't a playlist like in PT.

--Ben
Thanks.

Is anybody using Sequoia that way ?
Old 10th May 2006 | Show parent
  #9
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
Sure. There are a few folks using it for production out there. There are more that use Samplitude and that has the same audio engine and a good portion of the same features. Sequoia just has more bells and whistles, better editing, more mastering capabilities, etc...

--Ben
Old 10th May 2006 | Show parent
  #10
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tamasdragon's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
With nuendo you can record several takes, and you can organize and edit them as event or regions. You can make serious editing even between the takes. I may miss the point but what I figured out that you need something like this. After you're done with it use the play order function in nuendo.
Regards Tamas Dragon
Old 10th May 2006 | Show parent
  #11
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espasonico's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Yeah !

In fact, what I actually need it´s a Native software that allows me to do multitrack recording, do several multitrack takes and allow me to edit between them as fast as with PT using their playlist system.

I need something really fast for doing a NEW multitrack take. No more than a couple of seconds ( in PT is like 0.5s ). I hate when musicians have to wait if I have to create new tracks for a new take .

I´m very used to PT and I´m basically searching for something that allows me to substitute PT for doing on-location 24 tracks recordings ( no concerts ) and allows me to composite a good take quite fast.

Wich one would you choose ? Nuendo, Sequoia, Samplitude, SAW ? Wich is the fastest for doing that ?

Thanks again.
Old 10th May 2006 | Show parent
  #12
Gear Head
 
🎧 15 years
In Cubase/Nuendo that needs no time at all. Just press record again and there will be a new lane containing the take. Don´t know the possibilities of the other mentioned programs, though.

Michael
Old 10th May 2006 | Show parent
  #13
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
In Cubendo, you just hit record again which takes about a nanosecond.

The most recent take will be played out of all the old ones when you playback. You can do this many times and in the audio tracks, lanes are displayed of all the takes. You can then edit them as required.

You can do this whilsts looping so you get several takes worth of recording without touching anything other than record the first time.
Old 10th May 2006 | Show parent
  #14
Gear Guru
 
theblue1's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Sonar implements multiple takes in a somewhat similar fashion to the others.

You can record one take right after another automatically. The takes are 'stacked' in layers in the track -- but with a click you can display them side by side, making comping super fast. (You can also change the default loop-take behavior to put the clips in separate tracks.)

One nice feature in Sonar is that when you drag a clip over another clip the top clip turns 'transparent' so you can see the wave form underneath as well as that in the clip you're moving. That's not that big a deal for conventional multitrack comping where you're locked into the 'time grid' of your other tracks. But I find it INVALUABLE for comping spoken word -- and especially comping acoustic guitar parts (performed in free time)... you can drop a transient DEAD ON the underlying transient quickly and easily.
Old 10th May 2006 | Show parent
  #15
Gear Maniac
 
billwarner's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Unfortuneately I can't add any additional plylisting DAWS to your search, but I have to concur with your opinion. I am a Nuendo guy that works a lot in Pro Tools and have found the PT playlist function by far the best for comping and editing. Playlisting is also killer for tracking multple takes of a band when you copy the count-off and click of the original pass. Super fast indeed.

Bill

www.warnerworks.net
Old 10th May 2006 | Show parent
  #16
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espasonico's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
It´s nice to have feedback from somebody who has worked with PT and other programs.

You all have been very helpful and I think the best I can do is download some demos and try all the programs you have suggested to see wich I suit my needs better.

I´m sure all of them are good and it´s just a preference kind of thing.

It´s a pity that I have to check other programs for being able to record 16 tracks thru ADAT. I wish I could do that with PT LE.

Thanks again folks !!
Old 10th May 2006 | Show parent
  #17
Gear Guru
 
theblue1's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
I was intrigued -- so I just got done reading this tutorial on editing and the edit playlist in Pro Tools:

http://www.prosoundweb.com/studyhall/bp/pt/edit.php

... and I have to say that, by and large, I don't see that many huge differences between what's described and what I'm used to in Sonar.

There are a couple of diffs, of course. Working in Sonar is more like using the 'smart tool' in PT... it tries to guess what tool mode you want to be in depending on where you are. You kind of have to watch the mouse cursor to be sure what you're doing at times.

The destructive pencil tool disappeared out of Sonar a while back. Don't know why. It's replaced by extensive envelope editing tools, including an envelope draw tool with a bunch of modes, as you'd imagine.

Sonar's stretch-to-time uses a dialog box... I don't think there's a straight graphical mode where you can just 'tug' the end of a clip to stretch it -- which I'd think would be worth implementing. But Sonar's stretch does have formant shaping options, and so forth.


Hmmm... what else is missing or different?
Old 11th May 2006 | Show parent
  #18
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nikki-k's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Hi!
Not sure if some are missing the point...

I use both PT and Nuendo. Each have ONE piece of the two piece feature I want. The original poster wants the piece PT has: playlists

With playlists, one can set regions (clips and such in other apps) up the way they want (on a single track), save as a playlist, and then: A) Move on, who cares about editing; or, B) duplicate playlist, allowing the user to now make ANOTHER arrangement for the regions on that track, and effortlessly switch between them with a click; or, C) start fresh, and build another arrangement of regions on that track, and then switch between them with a click.

Other apps have either Lanes (Nuendo/Cubase) or something similar, which allows building comps and such, especially with multiple takes/looped recording. Pro Tools is VERY clumsy in this aspect IMO (others have found alternate ways to work; I have not found oen as nice as Lanes). BUT! These other apps do not allow multiple arrangements of the clips on these Lanes to be saved individually, such as Playlists in PT.

So, currently, if one absolutely requires one of these editing features, they kinda have to select an app that has the ONE they want- no one offers both...at least none I have seen, and none that implement both as well as these apps do for the ONE piece they do have.

Using multiple tracks to accomplish what each of these two features affords just seems incredibly sloppy and unnecessary once one has experienced BOTH features. (IMO at least). Work with playlists, and get used to them. Now hop on CUbase or Nuendo, and work without them. Ugh. Then, get used to using Lanes on Cubase or Nuendo...and hit Pro Tools. Ugh, once again.
Old 11th May 2006 | Show parent
  #19
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espasonico's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
In fact I don´t really mind to learn new software. Once you know one it´s not that hard to learn another. In fact I use Logic 5.5 for PC when I´m programming and I´m quite comfortable.

I don´t need to learn all the features of new software, just the basic things that I know I want to do but the most important thing is to know if I can do them easly.

For what I´ve read in this thread it looks like no program does the playlist thing in a PT manner. I think DP ( MAC ) does it but I don´t need a MAC, so maybe, if I can´t find anything that suits my needs I´m gonna use Logic and avoid the extra cash for a new software that it´s not 100% what I need because it will be cheapier and more useful to buy a 2nd hand MIX system and a ADAT bridge. ( uhm... that sounds good !! heh )

Thanks once more
Old 11th May 2006 | Show parent
  #20
Gear Guru
 
theblue1's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by nikki-k
Hi!
Not sure if some are missing the point...


... With playlists, one can set regions (clips and such in other apps) up the way they want (on a single track), save as a playlist, and then: A) Move on, who cares about editing; or, B) duplicate playlist, allowing the user to now make ANOTHER arrangement for the regions on that track, and effortlessly switch between them with a click; or, C) start fresh, and build another arrangement of regions on that track, and then switch between them with a click.

...
Yeah... I was missing the multiple playlist aspect, thanks. (The tutorial didn't hit hard on that aspect.)

It wouldn't be hard to develop a comping style that accomplished the same thing -- in fact, I do, sometimes, but, yeah, it's not as direct. It's a good feature.

In fact, another thing I overlooked above was the LOCK feature in Pro Tools.

My DAW, Sonar, has fairly sophisticated and 'intuitive' (hate that misuse of the word) folders and track hiding -- but it doesn't really have a way of locking a clip. I'm always a bit leery of accidentally moving a clip or trimming an envelope with a clumsy mouse move...

Last edited by theblue1; 11th May 2006 at 04:04 AM..
Old 11th May 2006 | Show parent
  #21
Gear Guru
 
🎧 15 years
Before I got Pro Tools I used Digital Performer which had a "takes" feature that was like playlists.
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