Quantcast
What DAW to switch to? - Gearspace.com
The No.1 Website for Pro Audio
What DAW to switch to?
Old 7th May 2003
  #1
Lives for gear
 
jeronimo's Avatar
What DAW to switch to?

Ok guys, I just need a few insights here.
I'll probably upgrade my studio 'till the end of the year.
I'm running PT LE 001 right now, and I do love the software but I don't like the 001, and I don't like how CPU hungry (let's say this) PT LE is.
The point is, now, all major DAWs are going X.
A full blown TDM is not a possibility.
I'm thinking about a MOTU HD192 w/ a rosetta or the lucids so I could track 14ch at a time.
And wich DAW will be the easier/most powerfull one to go from PT?
I love how easy is PT to edit, and mix... and I guess the best move would be DP 4 or nuendo right? wrong?
Help me here.
Old 7th May 2003
  #2
Mac Moderator
 
MCal27's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
jeronimo,
A second Hand TDM Mix system wouldn't be too much more than a MOTU 192 and Apogee Rosetta.... Not that there's anything wrong with either of the units you mention... I'm a massive fan of MOTU (Soft + Hardware) But if you really like the PT Software, then the only replacement is a bigger PT Rig I'm afraid...
Nuendo is very nice. Looks great, and is very versatile, but even though it looks pretty similar to ProTools, when you come to use it, its amazingly different!! I was lost for ages.... lol
Don't have DP4 yet, but it seems its very similar to DP3. It's audio side is quite close to ProTools, but again when you come to get a big session going.. feels different. I'd say DP is closer to PT than Nuendo.. so if you really don't want to get a TDM Rig.. I would go with DP + the MOTU 192.
I dont think there's a need for the Apogee Rosetta really. Apogee gear is great. But see (hear lol) what you think of the MOTU 192 before you look for a 'front end' for it.... after all it does use the same converters as Digi's 192, and I get no complaints from Clients about its sound...

Al.
Old 8th May 2003
  #3
Lives for gear
 
jeronimo's Avatar
Hey Mcal... I'm thinking about adding a rosetta or a lucid for extra 2 channels... not to be a "front end" to the HD192...
I just need around 16ch when tracking... so the closest I get to 16 ch, the better

And posterchild... I don't want to go back to a PC after I swichted to a Mac... I'm just tired of PCs... and my mac has treated me VERY, VERY well , but I'm checking the links right now.
Old 10th May 2003
  #4
Lives for gear
 
tunesmith's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
uuuuuh. Logic.

Scary good.
Old 10th May 2003
  #5
Lives for gear
 
jeronimo's Avatar
Did I miss anything?
Old 11th May 2003
  #6
Gear Addict
 
ExistanceMusic's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
tunesmith- PT to Logic transition = Just plain scary.....

Still trying to figure out that damn program! Chalk up another vote for Nuendo from a PC Protools and Nuendo user. .
I'm finding I use Nuendo more often now once the tracks build up because PT just cracks it on my PC.

I still use 'tools, but only because A. I work on it at school, gotta keep the chops up, and B. It has some plug-ins that I love, but can't get in VST version.
Old 12th May 2003
  #7
Lives for gear
 
jeronimo's Avatar
I've been trying DP 3 for a few days, and I must say it's a niiice software... let me get more used to it...
Old 13th May 2003
  #8
Lives for gear
 
pounce's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
my opinion is that the transition from PT to DP would be the easiest. i've messed with most daw programs. i own cubase, DP, and PT. i find going between them quite easy. DP4 seems cool and the hardware/software integration idea is kinda cool - except without the digi insistence on using thier hardware and software. with motu you can get it all there or mix and match as you'd like. i hear the 192 is very cool.
Old 13th May 2003
  #9
Lives for gear
 
jeronimo's Avatar
I've also heard very good stuff about the HD192... that's why I'm interested in using DP now... I'll just get one extra A/D/A to run to and from the HD 192 so I can have 14ch to use...
And as soon as I feel confortable with DP I'll make the switch
Old 13th May 2003
  #10
Lives for gear
 
jeronimo's Avatar
Hey pounce and everyone else... I need some help with DP 3...
In PT I can mark a selection using arrows down (in) and up (out) while playing... how do I do this?
And when I double click on a track at the sequencer window and I try to, let's say, command-c a kick and command-v it in somewhere else... it's not happening...
please help me with this problems...
Old 14th May 2003
  #11
Lives for gear
 
jeronimo's Avatar
Hey, someone that knows DP, help meeee!
Old 24th May 2003
  #12
Lives for gear
 
jeronimo's Avatar
What kind of plugins are missing from the PT LE PC side?
I've just tried Nuendo running on a G4 under 9 and I liked it... it seems fast, editing is easy and fast... I liked it...
How much Nuendo runs for $$ ?
I couldn't find DP 3 to be as easy to edit as nuendo or PT...
What do you guys think?
Old 24th May 2003
  #13
Lives for gear
 
XHipHop's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally posted by jeronimo
I'll just get one extra A/D/A to run to and from the HD 192 so I can have 14ch to use...
And as soon as I feel confortable with DP I'll make the switch
FYI, the HD 192 can only have 12 ins/outs total. That means if you want to use a digital connection, you are going to lose two analogue connections.

I just switched from a Digi 001 setup to a HD192 setup w/ Logic 6 and it's like a dream come true. They day i got Logic, i had a session where someone wanted me to track them live so I thought i'd just jump in and try it. I went to the musicplayer forums and looked up dansouth's getting started tutorials he posted and i was ready to record in about an hour. The only thing that confused me was that you had to use the "edit window" to edit and that you can't edit in the "arrange window". Honestly, it's not that tough!!! Once you figure out the environments, it's only harder than PT because there are more windows and functions. Most of the scary stuff is on the midi side of the program anyway.

When i was using PT LE, i hated the fact that there was so much software out there i couldn't use and it really affected my productions, i believe. Ever since i switched, I have no problem using Reason and hundreds of other plugins in ways i wish i could've with PT.

I'm also probably going to get DP 4.X when they update it a little and allow the use of Audio Units.

Switch, learn your program, and don't look back.
Old 26th May 2003
  #14
Lives for gear
 
jeronimo's Avatar
So, you do like Logic 6 huh?!
Are you running on Jaguar or 9?
Do you do A LOT of editing? I need to fix something almost ALL the time here in my studio (I had a post a few days ago about working w/ poor musicians ).
The only reason I'm afraind of leting PT LE go is editing and mixing... it's damn fast and easy!
Old 26th May 2003
  #15
Lives for gear
 
jeronimo's Avatar
Hey Xhiphop, do you think you could post the link to the tutorial?
Old 29th May 2003
  #16
Lives for gear
 
XHipHop's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Jeronimo,

I do a lot of editing and it's definitely very different than it is in PT. At this point i found PT easier but you can pretty much do anything you could do in PT in Logic as well. I guess it just takes some time and changing your mindset about how you do things. I am considering getting an MBox to fly over tracks and edit if i never need to, but at this point in time it doesn't look necessary.

Ok i found the two threads that helped me. Dan South is the guy with the answers.

This has a pretty good explanation of what you need to go through to set up an environment. If you follow this step by step it will get you to the point where you can start fooling around with recording some tracks and start getting hands on with Logic:

http://www.musicgearnetwork.com/cgi-...;f=17;t=002320

This one has some stuff worth reading as well:

http://www.musicgearnetwork.com/cgi-...;f=17;t=002336


What it comes down to is that i'm doing work with Logic, getting paid, using nice converters, and enjoying a massive ammount of audio tracks. That's why i chose it and it hasn't let me down.

Bob
Old 30th May 2003
  #17
Lives for gear
 
jeronimo's Avatar
I totally hear ya!! But here... I need editing and I need it fast and easy!!!
I'll try to find someone around here that have Logic 5 or newer to try it out... I tried 4.7 but didn't like...
I'm really liking nuendo 1.5
Old 1st July 2003
  #18
Lives for gear
 
jeronimo's Avatar
I don't know why I haven't checked those links before!?!??!!
Old 9th August 2003
  #19
Lives for gear
 
jeronimo's Avatar
What about the PC side sequoia/samplitude?
Old 9th August 2003
  #20
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
I use Sequoia here and love it... I'd highly recommend checking it or Samplitude out. It is very stable and the sound is excellent. To have CD burning/mastering capabilities is also a big plus.

If you need good editing, as far as I'm concerned, NOTHING touches Sequoia. The fade editor and the ability to do 4-point editing rocks! 500+ edits in a classical album doesn't make me think twice with Sequoia. With the exceptions of Sonic Solutions and perhaps Sadie and Pyramix, nothing else out there would give me that comfort for that kind of work. The fact that Sequoia is pretty much unlimited in tracks for editing makes things better. 48 track edits are not a problem and I have been able to adjust them in real time as it is playing back to tweak them.

The editing with time stretch and compression is also great for mutli-track produciton/comping work when a timeline must be kept. It is also great in post when hits must be preserved at a specific point in time.

--Ben
Old 11th August 2003
  #21
Gear Head
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally posted by XHipHop
Jeronimo,

This has a pretty good explanation of what you need to go through to set up an environment. If you follow this step by step it will get you to the point where you can start fooling around with recording some tracks and start getting hands on with Logic:

http://www.musicgearnetwork.com/cgi-...;f=17;t=002320

This one has some stuff worth reading as well:

http://www.musicgearnetwork.com/cgi-...;f=17;t=002336


hey guys. I couldn't get this links to work, then I realized that if you change the "musicgearnetwork" part of the link for "musicplayer", then they work;
http://www.musicplayer.com/cgi-bin/u...;f=17;t=002320
http://www.musicplayer.com/cgi-bin/u...;f=17;t=002336

Cheers, Andrés
Old 12th August 2003
  #22
Here for the gear
 
silversound's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Nuendo or Cubase all the way!
Old 7th September 2003
  #23
Lives for gear
 
jeronimo's Avatar
Quote:
Originally posted by fifthcircle
... The fade editor and the ability to do 4-point editing rocks! 500+ edits in a classical album doesn't make me think twice with Sequoia. With the exceptions of Sonic Solutions and perhaps Sadie and Pyramix, nothing else out there would give me that comfort for that kind of work. The fact that Sequoia is pretty much unlimited in tracks for editing makes things better. 48 track edits are not a problem and I have been able to adjust them in real time as it is playing back to tweak them...
--Ben
Ben, what do you mean, by 4 point edit? Could you break it down a little more?
Old 7th September 2003
  #24
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally posted by jeronimo
Ben, what do you mean, by 4 point edit? Could you break it down a little more?

4-point editing is an editing model that was originally developed by Sonic Solutions for their workstations. It is pretty much the standard for doing a lot of editing, especially in classical circles where many edits may be necessary.

It works this way:

You have tracks as a source and other tracks as a destination. In each, you can label a start and end point (in and out) for your edits. With one key, the audio marked in your source tracks can edit into the destination tracks. The audio will be put in exactly the area you labeled regardless of length (ie. 2 minutes in source could get edited into a 2 second destination and the audio past it will adjust as needed).

When used with the crossfade editor, you have an amazingly powerful editing interface.

There are also 2 point and 3 point variations with this-

3-point:

In a source or destination, you set an in and out point and in the other you just set one of the points (in or out). When you edit the source up into the destination, the audio will be replaced in the same amount of time as you specified. This can be handy, but if your sections aren't the same length, you can have difficulties finding your edit points.

You do this often when you are assembling takes for editing in classical music for your rough edits. Place source ins and outs and edit to a single in point. The in point in the destination will move to the end of the section and you can repeat.

2-point

In this way of editing, you simply specify a set of start points and
everything past it edits up to the destination start point.

Now, once all of your audio is assembled, you go into your crossfade editor and you can simply match up the wav representations... You slide the audio around and change the fades. With this, the most complex edits can take seconds to do. I have used it to clip the fronts of notes when attacks aren't together, edit inside notes, put words together in dialog editing,
etc...

4 point editing is considered by many (especially classical music editors) to be the only way to go... As I said, Sonic Solutions started it, but this workflow has also been adopted by Sequoia, Pyramix, and SADiE (in its most recent versions).



From the Samplitude/Sequoia webisite, there are some jpeg screen shots... http://www.samplitude.com/de/feat_seq_a.htm Here's a bit more info about exactly what you are seeing in these jpegs....

4 point cut prepared: The top panel is your destination and the bottom is your source. An in and out point is labeled in each. At the press of 1 button, the audio from the bottom will replace the audio in the top with a crossfade at each end.

Source/Dest. with markers: In your source section, you may want to take an entire session and drop markers as it loads. This makes it very easy to find your edit points. I would do this before the "4 point prepared"

Multi-channel: This source/destinatioin can work over as many tracks as you want. I have done 24 and 48 track edits with this model. (Try doing that in Sonic!!) It works the same way. (You have an option to specify the number of source/destination tracks used in the session)

Also, it is possible to use a variant of this model to edit within a multitrack project. For example, if you are doing vocal comps, you can set your raw takes/tracks as your source and edit up to your comp track (destination). By changing destination tracks, it would even be possible to construct multiple comps for comparing to each others... With the crossfade editor, editing sylables is easy when necessary.

Does this answer your question?

--Ben
Old 8th September 2003
  #25
Lives for gear
 
Alécio Costa's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Jeronimo, dá uma ligada pra Quanta ou pra Tecnologia e pega um mix core usado. Não gasta teu suado dinheiro nestes sistemas "alternativos". Os preços estão despencando. Eu devo vender meu PT Mix no começo do ano que vem .
Abraço
Old 8th September 2003
  #26
Lives for gear
 
jeronimo's Avatar
Thanks Ben, now I got it

Fala Alécio, qual teu mail pra contato? Vamos trocar umas idéias!
Old 8th September 2003
  #27
Lives for gear
 
Alécio Costa's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
beleza. clica na minha homepage que tem o endereço ou me mande uma PM. Abraço!
📝 Reply

Similar Threads

Thread / Thread Starter Replies / Views Last Post
replies: 72 views: 116233
Avatar for Nightshifter
Nightshifter 27th October 2015
replies: 185 views: 54327
Avatar for kalle789
kalle789 27th September 2012
replies: 577 views: 33082
Avatar for kdm
kdm 1st July 2009
replies: 192 views: 38371
Avatar for mgoorevich
mgoorevich 10th December 2019
Post Reply

Welcome to the Gearspace Pro Audio Community!

Registration benefits include:
  • The ability to reply to and create new discussions
  • Access to members-only giveaways & competitions
  • Interact with VIP industry experts in our guest Q&As
  • Access to members-only sub forum discussions
  • Access to members-only Chat Room
  • Get INSTANT ACCESS to the world's best private pro audio Classifieds for only USD $20/year
  • Promote your eBay auctions and Reverb.com listings for free
  • Remove this message!
You need an account to post a reply. Create a username and password below and an account will be created and your post entered.


 
 
Slide to join now Processing…

Forum Jump
Forum Jump