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Cytomic "The Glue" Bus Compressor Effect Plugin
Old 24th May 2015
  #2551
Lives for gear
 
Glamdring's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Any more news on the site Andy? I really want to buy your plugin!
Old 27th May 2015
  #2552
Lives for gear
 
shatz's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Sorry to hear about the site. Anyway to get a hold of the latest Windows AAX installer? I only have the beta but it's working fine, just curious.
Old 27th May 2015 | Show parent
  #2553
Deleted e71ab78
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by Glamdring ➑️
Any more news on the site Andy? I really want to buy your plugin!
It's up and running again. Really pleased as I have been waiting to buy the drop whilst the sites been down. Glad it's sorted out for you Andy.
Old 28th May 2015 | Show parent
  #2554
Cytomic
 
andy-cytomic's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
News update: the web page is back up and running as usual with all accounts as of 10th May restored (which is when the outage started). There are 2 people that managed to buy plugins in the narrow gap when the web page needed to be in off-line mode, I am emailing them now to restore their accounts. Sorry for the delays and hassle the outage caused, I am sorting out a new web hosting service so this will not happen again.
Old 28th May 2015 | Show parent
  #2555
Gear Addict
 
🎧 10 years
What a nightmare. Really sorry you had (and are still having) to deal with all that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by andy-cytomic ➑️
News update: the web page is back up and running as usual with all accounts as of 10th May restored (which is when the outage started). There are 2 people that managed to buy plugins in the narrow gap when the web page needed to be in off-line mode, I am emailing them now to restore their accounts. Sorry for the delays and hassle the outage caused, I am sorting out a new web hosting service so this will not happen again.
Old 22nd July 2015
  #2556
Gear Addict
 
🎧 10 years
Any update on new features in Glue?
Old 22nd July 2015 | Show parent
  #2557
Cytomic
 
andy-cytomic's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Methull ➑️
Any update on new features in Glue?
Nothing doing so far, been busy with lots of admin stuff and home stuff.

I want to get VST3 support done before the end of the year, and also add a few other small workflow improvements if possible. Was there anything in particular you were after?
Old 22nd July 2015
  #2558
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
Any chance for complete circuit/saturation emu on The Glue...or this stuff is already in?
Old 4th August 2015 | Show parent
  #2559
Cytomic
 
andy-cytomic's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by FoxMulderFBI ➑️
Any chance for complete circuit/saturation emu on The Glue...or this stuff is already in?
Right now all the non-linearities are in the envelope follower section only, the main signal path is clean. I would love to add a full non-linear mode for The Glue, but I can't promise it will happen.
Old 4th October 2015 | Show parent
  #2560
Gear Addict
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by andy-cytomic ➑️
Nothing doing so far, been busy with lots of admin stuff and home stuff.

I want to get VST3 support done before the end of the year, and also add a few other small workflow improvements if possible. Was there anything in particular you were after?
Sorry Andy, I somehow missed your reply to my post. I hope you have more time now to add new features to plugins

I don't remember what I was wanting when I posted my question, but now:

1. After KClip release I wonder if OS in Glue can be better, or it's as good as in KClip? Also any other possible improvements to sound quality (less distortion/aliasing with OS turned off, etc) if that's possible.

2. I'd like more options in Attack - zero and 50.

3. More Ratio options (3, 6, 8).

4. 50 MS Release will also be useful.

5. Dual mono and MS would be amazing option.

6. Coloring options.

If these options are impossible to add to Glue, I'd buy other compressor from you with these options.
Old 4th October 2015
  #2561
Lives for gear
 
Glamdring's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Great suggestions.
Old 5th October 2015 | Show parent
  #2562
Cytomic
 
andy-cytomic's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Methull ➑️
Sorry Andy, I somehow missed your reply to my post. I hope you have more time now to add new features to plugins

I don't remember what I was wanting when I posted my question, but now:

1. After KClip release I wonder if OS in Glue can be better, or it's as good as in KClip? Also any other possible improvements to sound quality (less distortion/aliasing with OS turned off, etc) if that's possible.
The oversampling in The Glue linear phase and very high quality, and you can run it up to x16 realtime and x64 render. I do not know of any way to improve the oversampling otherwise I would have already done it! If you have some miraculous new method I have not heard of then please let me know.

If you run a 10 kHz sine wave with +12 dB gain into the Peak Clip of The Glue you get this spectrum, which has an aliased peak of -60 dB (ps: the Peak Clip in The Glue has a very fast but smooth transition between not clipping and hard clipping, it is not a trivial "hard clip" because they don't sound so good even in analog):

http://www.cytomic.com/files/forums/...x16os-48sr.jpg

Which if compared to this spectrum done by the authors of the KClip software with its hard clip you can see the aliasing peak level of -38 dB, which is 22 dB worse than The Glue:

http://www.kazrog.com/site/wp-conten...7/aa_KClip.png

But it doesn't stop there, The Glue has options to oversample even higher on render. Here is the spectrum with The Glue rendered with x64 oversampling, the highest aliased tone is at -108 dB, which is -120 dB below the sine wave, so your sound card will have more distortion and noise than this:

http://www.cytomic.com/files/forums/...x64os-48sr.jpg

There are methods other than oversampling that could reduce distortion from wave shapers even further, but they introduce a 1/2 sample delay to the signal, and also require a minimum of x2 oversampling, so I have chosen not to use them for The Glue. These other methods can reduce the maximum oversampling needed for a certain amount of anti-aliasing, but oversampling is still always needed for non-linear processing of sampled signals, there is no avoiding it.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Methull ➑️
2. I'd like more options in Attack - zero and 50.

3. More Ratio options (3, 6, 8).

4. 50 MS Release will also be useful.
The Glue won't have any further attack / release / ratio settings added, the workflow is great how it is and people like the simplicity of the options, but for future products that are more complicated it is possible.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Methull ➑️
5. Dual mono and MS would be amazing option.
Dual mono is being added, with a continuously variable knob between linked and dual mono. MS would require two entire sets of knobs, and also require running two instances of The Glue internally to the plugin, which is quite complicated and possibly confusing for a majority of customers. It may be possible to add an option to process only the mid or only the side signal in a single instance of The Glue, you would then need to add two instances of the plugin to process both the mid and side signals.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Methull ➑️
6. Coloring options.

If these options are impossible to add to Glue, I'd buy other compressor from you with these options.
The Glue adds colour from non-linear side-chain processing, the main signal path is clean apart from the Peak Clip.

I hope that helps answer your questions!

Last edited by andy-cytomic; 5th October 2015 at 04:11 AM..
Old 6th October 2015 | Show parent
  #2563
Gear Addict
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by andy-cytomic ➑️
I hope that helps answer your questions!
Thanks Andy! Great news about dual mono! As for OS, I did not say that Glue audio quality is not enough for me. I think it's the best sounding compressor out there. I just wanted to know if it can be even better.

If you going to make new compressor, please consider more options for attack, release and ratio. You said we won't see it in Glue cuz you like it simple, but I don't want any of your plugins to be not simple. More options for these parameters should not make plugin less simple if I see it right in my mind)))
Old 9th October 2015 | Show parent
  #2564
Cytomic
 
andy-cytomic's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Methull ➑️
Thanks Andy! Great news about dual mono! As for OS, I did not say that Glue audio quality is not enough for me. I think it's the best sounding compressor out there. I just wanted to know if it can be even better.

If you going to make new compressor, please consider more options for attack, release and ratio. You said we won't see it in Glue cuz you like it simple, but I don't want any of your plugins to be not simple. More options for these parameters should not make plugin less simple if I see it right in my mind)))
For a "complicated" compresser I will most likely have continuous controls for as many parameters as possible. Another request from people is to have a BPM sync options for attack and release times.

Complexity isn't just to do with how many knobs there are on a plugin. Having a handful of fixed settings for attack, release, and ratio helps limit options, you flick the knob between the two closest settings to what you want, A/B compare those two choices and can quickly pick which one you like best and then move on to more important creative decisions to do with the big picture of the song. With continuous knobs people are tempted to fiddle more and try and fine tune things, which isn't so good for staying in a creative flow.
Old 9th October 2015 | Show parent
  #2565
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by andy-cytomic ➑️
Complexity isn't just to do with how many knobs there are on a plugin. Having a handful of fixed settings for attack, release, and ratio helps limit options, you flick the knob between the two closest settings to what you want, A/B compare those two choices and can quickly pick which one you like best and then move on to more important creative decisions to do with the big picture of the song. With continuous knobs people are tempted to fiddle more and try and fine tune things, which isn't so good for staying in a creative flow.
I completely agree with this and that is much of the reasoning I love the plugin so much. I would add, though, that for many people 50 ms release could be the difference between not having to use any other compressors period. It is one of the most, if not the most, common default setting for ITB compressors. It's a huge part of the much sought-after 1176 sound. The Glue already has the fast attack times, and 50 ms release would really open up the 1176-style possibilities without taking away from the SSL-style applications. The Glue would actually be superior to other 1176 emulations IMO not only because of the oversampling but because it doesn't have that huge spike on the front end of hyper-compressed material. I use The Glue on the mix bus but would ditch all other compressors for individual tracks as well if it had this capability. I don't know how popular of an opinion mine is but I've seen this feature requested quite a few times on this forum. Just a thought.
Old 9th October 2015 | Show parent
  #2566
Lives for gear
 
Keith Moore's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Hey Andy,

I feel I heard a rumor somewhere that you were planning to port to AAX-DSP. Is this true?
Old 9th October 2015 | Show parent
  #2567
nms
Lives for gear
 
nms's Avatar
 
2 Reviews written
🎧 10 years
Andy, going back to something that's been mentioned before a few times.. would it be difficult to add a meter range toggle function to make the meter more useful in a mastering setting or general use for those not abusing the gain reduction? Being able to change the meter to a 5dB range with marked 1dB increments would be awesome. You could add the option to the menu, add a toggle button for it, or just allow a right click menu when clicking the meter?

Also, I know trying to add a bunch more attack/release settings could be getting carried away, but a big vote here for a 50ms release time! If there's one additional time setting to add, that's the one.
Old 9th October 2015 | Show parent
  #2568
Gear Addict
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by andy-cytomic ➑️
Another request from people is to have a BPM sync options for attack and release times.
That's interesting. But I don't fully understand the concept. Can you give any details?
Old 9th October 2015 | Show parent
  #2569
Lives for gear
 
21 Reviews written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Methull ➑️
That's interesting. But I don't fully understand the concept. Can you give any details?
I think the idea is that you'd use syncable attack and release times to try and sync things like the pumping effect of compression. So for instance, if you wanted a buss compressor pumping your drums, you'd sync the release time to the BPM of your track and the "point of most pump" would fall squarely in between the beats.

I'm not sure how well it would actually work in practice on a compressor, especially once program dependency and non-linear attack and release shapes come into play, but it's an interesting idea.

Now, reverb's a whole different story. I totally want to be able to BPM sync reverb pre-delay and tail length, but I don't have any reverbs that do it automatically.
Old 18th October 2015 | Show parent
  #2570
Gear Nut
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by andy-cytomic ➑️
Dual mono is being added, with a continuously variable knob between linked and dual mono.
Nice; well done on the new GUI btw
Old 5th April 2016
  #2571
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
Allow me to add my voice to the chorus of voices who would love to see the glue add a non-linearity option to the main signal path.

Apart from that, I think the product is great as it is.
Old 5th April 2016 | Show parent
  #2572
Cytomic
 
andy-cytomic's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by icecoolpool ➑️
Allow me to add my voice to the chorus of voices who would love to see the glue add a non-linearity option to the main signal path.

Apart from that, I think the product is great as it is.
Yep, it would be great to have a full non-linear signal path. Since I launched The Glue around 7 years ago computers have come a long way, and so has the tech I've developed to tackle this kind of thing efficiently so I'm hopeful I'll be able to deliver this in an update. Until I do though I can't officially commit to anything.
Old 5th April 2016 | Show parent
  #2573
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by andy-cytomic ➑️
Yep, it would be great to have a full non-linear signal path. Since I launched The Glue around 7 years ago computers have come a long way, and so has the tech I've developed to tackle this kind of thing efficiently so I'm hopeful I'll be able to deliver this in an update. Until I do though I can't officially commit to anything.
Great to hear, thanks Andy. Still, astonishing that's it's been seven years, the code's held up remarkably well.
Old 5th April 2016 | Show parent
  #2574
Lives for gear
 
Ragan's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Still probably my favorite ITB bus comp.
Old 11th April 2016 | Show parent
  #2575
Gear Addict
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by andy-cytomic ➑️
Yep, it would be great to have a full non-linear signal path. Since I launched The Glue around 7 years ago computers have come a long way, and so has the tech I've developed to tackle this kind of thing efficiently so I'm hopeful I'll be able to deliver this in an update. Until I do though I can't officially commit to anything.
Would be great if you do!
Glue was on my master channel since 2009. From time to time I try to swap it for something else, but most of the time I find that Glue is the only plugin compressor which produces "robust" results all the time. I.e. sometimes other plugins may sound more "interesting" on the first listen, but over time I find that they pump too much or that they work smoothly only on certain tempos or certain types of program material.
If non-linear signal path (with an option to go to fully transparent) would be added I'm sure it would make Glue even better and there would be even less incentive to try something else.
Old 19th May 2016 | Show parent
  #2576
Here for the gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by andy-cytomic ➑️
Yep, it would be great to have a full non-linear signal path. Since I launched The Glue around 7 years ago computers have come a long way, and so has the tech I've developed to tackle this kind of thing efficiently so I'm hopeful I'll be able to deliver this in an update. Until I do though I can't officially commit to anything.
Hey Andy,

Any word on the VST3 version of The Glue? I know it's quite a workload, but I saw you mention working on it last year, so I'm curious.

Thanks for the great plugin!
J
Old 16th June 2016 | Show parent
  #2577
Lives for gear
 
superburtm's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
I Love this Plug


Quote:
Originally Posted by andy-cytomic ➑️
The oversampling in The Glue linear phase and very high quality, and you can run it up to x16 realtime and x64 render. I do not know of any way to improve the oversampling otherwise I would have already done it! If you have some miraculous new method I have not heard of then please let me know.

If you run a 10 kHz sine wave with +12 dB gain into the Peak Clip of The Glue you get this spectrum, which has an aliased peak of -60 dB (ps: the Peak Clip in The Glue has a very fast but smooth transition between not clipping and hard clipping, it is not a trivial "hard clip" because they don't sound so good even in analog):

http://www.cytomic.com/files/forums/...x16os-48sr.jpg

Which if compared to this spectrum done by the authors of the KClip software with its hard clip you can see the aliasing peak level of -38 dB, which is 22 dB worse than The Glue:

http://www.kazrog.com/site/wp-conten...7/aa_KClip.png

But it doesn't stop there, The Glue has options to oversample even higher on render. Here is the spectrum with The Glue rendered with x64 oversampling, the highest aliased tone is at -108 dB, which is -120 dB below the sine wave, so your sound card will have more distortion and noise than this:

http://www.cytomic.com/files/forums/...x64os-48sr.jpg

There are methods other than oversampling that could reduce distortion from wave shapers even further, but they introduce a 1/2 sample delay to the signal, and also require a minimum of x2 oversampling, so I have chosen not to use them for The Glue. These other methods can reduce the maximum oversampling needed for a certain amount of anti-aliasing, but oversampling is still always needed for non-linear processing of sampled signals, there is no avoiding it.





The Glue won't have any further attack / release / ratio settings added, the workflow is great how it is and people like the simplicity of the options, but for future products that are more complicated it is possible.


Dual mono is being added, with a continuously variable knob between linked and dual mono. MS would require two entire sets of knobs, and also require running two instances of The Glue internally to the plugin, which is quite complicated and possibly confusing for a majority of customers. It may be possible to add an option to process only the mid or only the side signal in a single instance of The Glue, you would then need to add two instances of the plugin to process both the mid and side signals.


The Glue adds colour from non-linear side-chain processing, the main signal path is clean apart from the Peak Clip.

I hope that helps answer your questions!
Old 16th June 2016 | Show parent
  #2578
Lives for gear
 
Bouroki's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by superburtm ➑️
I Love this Plug
The Glue is, to borrow a popular poker term, "the stone cold nuts"
Old 16th June 2016
  #2579
Lives for gear
 
guavadude's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
I wish I could unlink the left and right channels.
Old 16th June 2016 | Show parent
  #2580
Lives for gear
 
superburtm's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
just a note.... I know there are some additional features to this comp... to be honest I don't use the sidechain or any of the other features that aren't on an ssl except the release times I like the faster release. The SSL comp sound is not unlinked.... just to be fair this is a ssl model.

Anyhow... put it up against the UAD SSL today, again. I Like it better. More open, sounds bigger and a bit brighter and doesn't eat as much Low end as the UAD, sounds less pinched.
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