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BombFactory Policy!!??
Old 20th March 2003
  #1
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Messiah's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
BombFactory Policy!!??

This is a copy and paste from daw-mac that I thought might interest some here in the light of recent debates.

I'm posting this for 2 reasons, firstly so maybe Erik could be good enough to sort this situation and policy out, or secondly, to highlight Erik's company policy to people who may be considering purchasing BF plugins....

Basically, the background is Gina's iLock went down and she had to get a new one, only to find that her BF plugs were no longer authorised.

Quote:
I can't believe the hell I'm in. According to Bombfactory the ONLY way to
get authorizations and registration from them is to use the number on the
back of the large credit card that holds the license cards. I threw these
away. The woman, DIANA, at Bombfactory said I had to re-buy all the software
if I wanted to register it and get authorization for my newly replaced ilok
after the first one died (which is authorized...)

I just bought Classis Compressors, Fairchild and Pultec!! $$$$$$$ And
because I threw away a little credit card I have to buy this AGAIN??? I told
her I have my receipt and the license cards and the original ilok with the
authorizations. She said, "Sorry, company policy! Without the registration
number on the cards, I can't help you!"

What the heck do I do?????

Someone help!!!

Gina


Gina Fant-Saez
Owner, Blue World Music, Inc.
Old 20th March 2003
  #2
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CrazyBeast's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Yeah- my BF Fairchild authorization just ran out, even though it was supposed to be good through 4/13/03 and the same person told me I would "just have to wait until the expiration date" and then I could get a new authorization!! Of course I'm in the middle of a ton of projects that used it and that's still almost a month away!

I have to use manual authorization (I don't have USB thus no ILock) and they'll only give me 180 day authorizations each time.

I've always been pretty happy with the Fairchild and said so, but this has really torqued me off. I don't pirate software but when [em]existing customers[/em] get treated like this you have to wonder...
Old 20th March 2003
  #3
SC
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
This is, unfortunately, a very common subject. BF's customers support is downright adversarial.

Some of their plugins are ok, even decent, but there is no way I will ever buy any of their stuff again. I have enough problems in my life.
Old 20th March 2003
  #4
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toledo3's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
C'mon. SHE threw the cards away. You guys are really getting ridiculous with this bombfactory beat down. When I first started hearing about Erik's negative tactics, I was totally on the side of most of you. But the more time that goes by I think it's all getting a little out of hand and people are being very hypocritical.

Ah, I just need to stay out of this, b/c it's the first thing that has really irked me at Gearslutz, an other wise fine bb.
Old 20th March 2003
  #5
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🎧 15 years
I never had any idea that Bomb Factory was a controversial company until I saw some threads here a couple of weeks ago.

My one experience with the company was when I bought some Bomb Factory software on e-bay which was supposed to include all the authorizations. Unfortunately, I could not get the authorizations to work.

I called BF customer support and even offered to pay some additional money, or purchase some other software if they would bundle it with the working authorizations that i needed, but the rep was not the least interested in bargaining or negotiating with me in any way. Their only response was i had to buy all new software at full price.

Now, I don't hold BF responsible for my getting burned on e-bay. But most companies in my experience are usually willing to work with me at least a little bit in return for my loyal patronage.

It didn't occur to me to make any generalizations about the company based on my one experience, but having read some of these recent threads, perhaps I was, in fact, part of a larger phenomenon.
Old 20th March 2003
  #6
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e-cue's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
This is why hotline is so popular... Imagine if you had to go through this everytime you wanted to play your favorite CD, or if you were a fisherman everytime you used a certain lure. Ridiculous.
Old 20th March 2003
  #7
jho
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🎧 15 years
BF Bashing or Defending aside -

It would be fine if BF customers (myself included) were told in advance as policy to save the plastic that is left after installing the ilok smartcard, but I for do not recall that I was.

Were any of you?
Old 20th March 2003
  #8
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🎧 15 years
I'm not indescriminately bashing here - I have no comment on the whole UA thing, etc. I'm only commenting on my own situation which happened this week, and I think it - and the way it was handled - sucks!
Old 20th March 2003
  #9
jho
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🎧 15 years
What page in the manual was that ? heh

I did save the smartcard, just not the plastic shell around it where it popped out. Is that good enuf?
Old 20th March 2003
  #10
jho
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🎧 15 years
Thanks, helpful Erik, for clarifying!

I upgrade mine to HD over the phone so I must be registered...

jho
Old 20th March 2003
  #11
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Messiah's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Well, it seems like Erik has come to the rescue and has another satisfied customer.
From daw-mac again;

Quote:
Yesterday, no one would help and they wanted me to send back my ilok to Pace
and wait for an indeterminable amount of time until Pace could look at my
ilok, verify my BF plug authorizations, get BF to send out new license cards
etc... And I couldn't be down without BF plugs for a week... I hope that
makes sense.

Erik did come through in the end but with insults and attitude and threats
of legal action. Now I understand why DAW-MAC is so anti BF.
Good work Erik, keep it up.
Old 20th March 2003
  #12
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Steve Smith's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Interesting... As much as I bitch at Eric for his general attitude on the net, I gotta say that for a software company to give out auths with no proof that the user isn't trying to replicate ( the lady with the ILOK who did not send it back) or pirate would just be stupid.

the auth is the only thing they have to insure payment ( and with so many cracks floating around that is little insurance indeed) and I suspect that they gaurd them with everythig they have.
Old 21st March 2003
  #13
Gear Addict
 
🎧 15 years
Yes I'm a ProTools user and have invested tens of thousands of dollars on plug-ins and don't I feel like a fool for continuing to do so.

Initially I wasn't that bothered with copy protection but I do find it a little strange that the legitimate users who actually purchase the software end up being inconvenienced and charged money for the companies product protection. In my opinion, a software company should provide me free of charge an ilok or whatever other nonsense they choose to protect themselves with at their own expense.

I also believe that because you don't actually purchase anything but a license to use the software, it is an absolute scam. When you factor in the cost of all the computer hardware necessary to run the plug + the plug-in itself and all the continual upgrades along the way (both hardware and software) and divide it by the amount of instances you get to use on any given session with other plugs, it's a royal rip-off. Now this is all not to mention that the company doesn't actually go belly up or drop the product from its line (Digi's Masterlist CD and Soft SampleCell come to mind as recent examples).

For my hard earned money, I feel much more secure in the purchase of an actual hardware LA2A than any plug-in. This is not to say that a plug-in doesn't have its merit but I sure as hell wonder what all my plug-ins will be worth if ProTools ceased to exist.
Old 21st March 2003
  #14
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🎧 15 years
Ouch! Digi dropped masterlist CD???

I gotta get out more often!

I know they haven't had an upgrade in a couple of years - and that it's a little buggy. For instance, it never recognizes my CD Burner when I boot it up. I have to save it and reopen it, and only then will the little green CD icon show up.

But, damn, I didn't know it went belly up.

So, what are the best options for alternatives? What are other Mac/Pro Tools people using instead?
Old 21st March 2003
  #15
jho
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🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally posted by littledog
Ouch! Digi dropped masterlist CD???

I gotta get out more often!

I know they haven't had an upgrade in a couple of years - and that it's a little buggy. For instance, it never recognizes my CD Burner when I boot it up. I have to save it and reopen it, and only then will the little green CD icon show up.

But, damn, I didn't know it went belly up.

So, what are the best options for alternatives? What are other Mac/Pro Tools people using instead?
Waveburner Pro
Old 21st March 2003
  #16
There is only one
 
alphajerk's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally posted by denial
For my hard earned money, I feel much more secure in the purchase of an actual hardware LA2A than any plug-in.
thats the real truth... and why i bought 6 moogerfoogers instead of wasting money on "non-existant" plugins. plus, they sound better and are more versatile than the plugin.

i think the ONLY plugin worth the money right now is altiverb.
Old 21st March 2003
  #17
jho
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🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally posted by alphajerk
thats the real truth... and why i bought 6 moogerfoogers instead of wasting money on "non-existant" plugins. plus, they sound better and are more versatile than the plugin.

i think the ONLY plugin worth the money right now is altiverb.
I would still want my Pitchblender and Virus Indigo plugs even if I had every piece of outboard known to man!

Of course since I don't own one of 'everything, I can only speculate and make such bold remarks !! grggt
Old 21st March 2003
  #18
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Messiah's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally posted by alphajerk


i think the ONLY plugin worth the money right now is altiverb.
I totally agree.
Old 22nd March 2003
  #19
Gear Addict
 
🎧 15 years
With the economic crippling times that exist and continue to lie ahead, any software is a risk to the purchasing consumer. Of course this does not even take into account the fierce competetion in a small market place such as Pro Audio.

I wonder how many instances I'll get with a Bomb Factory LA2A if the company goes belly up. I know how many my hardware unit will get.

Note: This is not a personal attack on Erik and his company but rather a question put to all software companies in general. I'd certainly like to hear Erik's take or anyone elses for that matter . If Universal Audio one day decide to drop the process card, the software will be as useful as tits on a bull.

The software you own is dead, you just don't know it yet.
Old 22nd March 2003
  #20
Gear Addict
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally posted by denial
The software you own is dead, you just don't know it yet.
Pardon me, my last statement was totally incorrect. Let me rephrase that:
The software you own is dead, they just haven't announced it yet.
Old 22nd March 2003
  #21
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Curious G's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
gearsluts' chant:

HARDWARE!HARDWARE!HARDWARE!HARDWARE!HARDWARE!HARDWARE!HARDWARE!HARDWARE!HARDWARE!HARDWARE!HARDWARE!HARDWARE!
Old 24th March 2003
  #22
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mixer's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
i own registered bf products i recieved as part of the hd package i got when i purchased my hd system...trying to authorize the new versions has been a living hell...with no help from the company. finally they are working on the system but still show as demos on the ilok site...a real mess,these plugs are the only upgrade problem i have encountered. and the company never returns messages. to bad they make a good product.
Old 24th March 2003
  #23
Gear Addict
 
🎧 15 years
Yeah, I thought I heard the Bomb Factory LA2A on Dark Side of the Moon. Didn't Led Zeppelin use it on Stairway to Heaven too?

So what's with the BS in having the customer pay for your copy protection. It seems like that's something you should pay for BombGuy. Somehow I'm sure you are going to try and convince us that we need copy protection and paying for it is just like having our own personal bodyguard.

ilok is a scam and totally unecessary to the legitimate owner. If you want protection, then you pay for it.

There will come a day when each person will get burned with software companies going broke or dropping a product from their line. On that day they will think twice in investing further in plug-ins.
Old 24th March 2003
  #24
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e-cue's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally posted by bombguy
A lot of people don't understand the "license" thing. A license simply specifies what you're allowed to do.

When you buy a Dark Side of the Moon CD, you're not buying the masters, and you're not allowed to start selling it through Denial Records, Inc.

The same is true for a software license. If you want to "buy" Tel-Ray, which would include the source code, copyright and trademark rights, it's going to cost you a lot more than $129.
--Erik
When I buy DARK SIDE OF THE MOON, I don't need an Ilok to play it from CD player to CD player, nor do I have to jump through hoops to get it to play any cd player the 1st time I want to hear it.
Old 24th March 2003
  #25
Gear Addict
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally posted by bombguy

Beyond that, it's pretty simple: we supply the software, you supply the hardware. The $30 iLok is such a tiny fraction of the cost of a studio computer that I don't see the point in arguing over it.
--Erik
Well, last time I checked with my dealer it was 120 Australian Dollars and regardless of the cost, it is for your protection, not mine. When will you understand this?

I use other software that doesn't require an ilok at all. Truth be told, it doesn't matter how much you believe ilok will work for your company protection because there are kids out there who'll bust it just for kicks. Here's a thought, how 'bout charging a reasonable price for the product in the first place. For Christ sakes it's not like I'll own it even if I buy it. Software depreciates quicker than my d#@k after I've blown my load.

Either way Erik, I respect that you're here to debate about it no matter who's right or wrong.
Old 24th March 2003
  #26
Gear Addict
 
mixer's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Drop the ball

"BF plug-ins received with the HD package are supported exclusively by Digidesign (not Bomb Factory). Per contract, we promptly refer anyone who asks straight to Digi, although we remain available to solve any problems in the event of 'big company drops the ball' syndrome."

Hi Erik.thanks for the response. I realize that digi sold me the plugs as part of a discount..When i had the problem upgrading to pt6 .they refered me to your company then i was refered to ilok and pace. the plugs are working on my system but the ilok registration is still wrong showing as demos..ilok has no idea why and think its someone elses problem ...well it is ...mine. at some point we all have to take responsibility for our work..i appreciate your position and enjoy your product . hopefully this is just a painful part of the birth process into os10.
Old 20th May 2003
  #27
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
So what's with the BS in having the customer pay for your copy protection. It seems like that's something you should pay for BombGuy. Somehow I'm sure you are going to try and convince us that we need copy protection and paying for it is just like having our own personal bodyguard.
How much extra money do you think software manufacturers have to spend protecting their software? Do you think when you write the code for a plugin you just check a box and it's suddenly protected?

Quote:
ilok is a scam and totally unecessary to the legitimate owner. If you want protection, then you pay for it.
Well, if it weren't for copy protection the "legitimate owner" would either pay much more for their software since so many less people would pay for it, or most of the plugin manufacturers would have gone out of business or ceased production because they couldn't make any money on it.

I'm sure copy protection is a much bigger pain for software developers than it is for end users. This thread is a perfect example of that.

-Duardo
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