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A&H Zed R16 Firewire Mixer
Old 14th January 2022 | Show parent
  #6331
Lives for gear
 
augustusarnone's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by bill robin ➡️
As the drivers are open source wouldn't it be cool to find a way to put together some funds and get a skilled programmer to update the code to get it working on the latest Mac OS? Maybe some kind of crowd funding? I could ask around a few friends who work for music software companies to see how feasible it is and roughly how much time/money it would involve. Maybe others here have connections too? Best of all would probably be a Zed R16 user who also has the necc programming ability... I don't know how that works when something is open source but I def would be ok paying them for their time...
That would actually be awesome. I guess the only problem is I'm hearing that there's definitely a finite lifespan of that firmware chip itself. Even with fully supported drivers a lot of users had to have it replaced and it's not cheap.
Old 17th January 2022 | Show parent
  #6332
Quote:
Originally Posted by bill robin ➡️
As the drivers are open source wouldn't it be cool to find a way to put together some funds and get a skilled programmer to update the code to get it working on the latest Mac OS? Maybe some kind of crowd funding? I could ask around a few friends who work for music software companies to see how feasible it is and roughly how much time/money it would involve. Maybe others here have connections too? Best of all would probably be a Zed R16 user who also has the necc programming ability... I don't know how that works when something is open source but I def would be ok paying them for their time...
Hi,
That would be very cool!
I did some research while ago, I even looked at the option to replace TC Applied’s DICE I Digital I/Os firewire card with brooklyn dante card but with no luck...
Reply from A&H went something like this
"We can't do much about future driver support because TC Applied Technologies has been acquired by our direct competitor (Behringer) and they stop support driver development for all lines of our products."

From what I understand, new apple M1 chip doesn't support Dice I chip because it's 32 bit technology, hope I'm wrong.
The good news is that new Dice lll chip is out

https://www.profusionplc.com/news/dice-iii-tc-applied/

It can be USB, AVB or Firewire so it probably can run on new apple M1 chip.

TC Applied’s DICE III USB TCD3020 chip 18×18-channels looks like our candidate (No driver required for OSX).

https://mediadl.musictribe.com/downl...TCD3020-CG.pdf

manual
https://manualzz.com/doc/7491001/use...d-technologies

here you can order the TC Dice lll chip
part no. TCD3020-CG
https://www.coolaudio.com/buy.php


Fingers crossed this works out!
Old 27th January 2022 | Show parent
  #6333
Here for the gear
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sound Arch ➡️
Hi,

You can use ZedR16 without computer sync in ADAT mode.
ZedR16 needs to be master clock in your setup, 16 strips channels are routed to ADAT I/O at 48kHz sample rate. 2 master bus channels are not routed to adat, you can route master bus to 2 free inputs on console to print mix or you can use external AD converter.
I can confirm that RME digiface is rock solid for ADAT setup, im sure any RME interface with 16 adat I/O will do the job.

If ADAT setups is not working for you you can do direct out modification and use ZedR16 with any converter.

Good luck
Cheers
So the Zed needs to be connected and recognized always by a computer via Firewire? It Won't work only via ADAT out?
Old 28th January 2022 | Show parent
  #6334
Quote:
Originally Posted by borgass ➡️
So the Zed needs to be connected and recognized always by a computer via Firewire? It Won't work only via ADAT out?
Hi,

Zed will work only via ADAT out for channels 1-16 without computer. To do it you have to flip the switch at the back of ZED to Adat.

What's your setup?
Old 5th March 2022 | Show parent
  #6335
Gear Head
 
Zed R16 Midi

Hi, forgive me if this has been mentioned/discussed but is there a way one can use the midi faders or rotary knobs to send signal to outboard effects? Would the Zed need to be connected to an interface for this to happen?
Thanks in advance
Old 28th March 2022 | Show parent
  #6336
Here for the gear
Zed R16 Adat

I'm pretty sure this has been discussed here before, but I still see a lot of people claiming that running the Zed R16 through ADAT will only work if it's set as the master clock. That is not true.

First and foremost: the firewire driver works in Big Sur too, I'm not entirely sure about Monterey because I had problems with this OS for other reasons, so I went with Big Sur stable.

Now, the way you set R16 as the Adat Slave and not Master is as follows:
1: Plug in your Zed R16 as a FIREWIRE interface, the switch on the back of the mixer has to be set to FIREWIRE;(You need a firewire input/pcie for this). Plug in the firewire cable from the mixer to your card.
2: Open the driver, set clock source to: ADAT;
3: Switch it off, unplug Firewire cable, set the switch on the back to ADAT.
4: Plug in the 4 ADAT I/O cables on the back of the mixer, connect the other ends to your ADAT I/O.
5: Turn it on and it will clock from your main interface, which has to be set to INTERNAL.
6: Enjoy.

Now, for my question: Can anyone who's already modded this mixer let me know if it made a difference in summing? I'm interested in getting a bit more of a hi-fi cleaner sound to it rather than the standard dirtier sound?
Old 7th April 2022 | Show parent
  #6337
Here for the gear
 
YourMusic.Pro's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Finally FireWire broke...

Hey all,

it has happenened...
Finally, after 9 years of faithful service, my ZED R16 has succumbed to modernity...
As in: It doesn't connect to FireWire anymore.

I recently upgraded my studio computer, and with the new motherboard (ASUS Z690), after having tried two different PCIe FireWire cards (one TI chip, one VIA, both "supported" according to the list), I give up.

The FW cards get recognized fine, it's just that the ZED doesn't want to work with them. Interestingly enough, the VIA card used the exact same chip as on my old motherboard, but still, no dice (pun intended...).

I even had successfully upgraded my old computer (Z77 with an i7-3770K...) to Windows 11, and it was still working, so it is not likely to be an issue with the OS, just a bunch of factors coming together in the new machine.

Time to say goodbye to FireWire, but I'm saying Hello to ADAT!!!

Thanks to this thread, I'll use an RME Digiface USB, and if all goes according to plan, I can largely keep my workflow, except printing to disc back through the master bus. This won't be possible without sacrificing 2 channels elsewhere, but I might still do this if I absolutely have to.
And due to the massive connectivity of the Digiface, I can also connect my Behringer 8200 unit alongside the desk.

Playback through the masters will still be possible, since the RME unit has a dedicated line-out to feed the inserts on the desk!

So, I'm looking forward to another couple of good years with the ZED and some good music (hopefully...)

Cheers,
Benji
Old 7th April 2022
  #6338
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Ah, sorry to hear that it no longer works.

I just got an Orion Studio to move away from Firewire, and I also got a cheap Soundtracs Topaz locally. So I'm hoping to sell the Zed R16 and mix through the Soundtracs from now on. Before I do that, though, I want to compare the two desks to see if I like the sound of the Zed R16 more. If so, I guess I'll keep it and mix through that instead.

ZED R16 firewire is still working great for me on Windows 10. I wonder if there might be a driver that you could use to get it working with your new setup? I assume you are already using legacy firewire drivers?
Old 7th April 2022 | Show parent
  #6339
Here for the gear
 
YourMusic.Pro's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Well, yeah, but I have really great expectations for the ADAT and RME combo, the latency there might be even better than before...
And as far as I understand the information in the manual correctly, there might be almost no change in workflow, since the routing buttons next to the faders are supposed to work just the same with ADAT.

And yes, I think I've tried every conceivable combination of drivers and cards. The legacy driver had even issues seeing the PCIe card properly.

Cheers,
B.
Old 7th April 2022 | Show parent
  #6340
Here for the gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by YourMusic.Pro ➡️
Hey all,

it has happenened...
Finally, after 9 years of faithful service, my ZED R16 has succumbed to modernity...
As in: It doesn't connect to FireWire anymore.

I recently upgraded my studio computer, and with the new motherboard (ASUS Z690), after having tried two different PCIe FireWire cards (one TI chip, one VIA, both "supported" according to the list), I give up.

The FW cards get recognized fine, it's just that the ZED doesn't want to work with them. Interestingly enough, the VIA card used the exact same chip as on my old motherboard, but still, no dice (pun intended...).

I even had successfully upgraded my old computer (Z77 with an i7-3770K...) to Windows 11, and it was still working, so it is not likely to be an issue with the OS, just a bunch of factors coming together in the new machine.

Time to say goodbye to FireWire, but I'm saying Hello to ADAT!!!

Thanks to this thread, I'll use an RME Digiface USB, and if all goes according to plan, I can largely keep my workflow, except printing to disc back through the master bus. This won't be possible without sacrificing 2 channels elsewhere, and I might still do this if I absolutely have to.
And due to the massive connectivity of the Digiface, I can also connect my Behringer 8200 unit alongside the desk.

Playback through the masters will still be possible, since the RME unit has a dedicated line-out to feed the inserts on the desk!

So, I'm looking forward to another couple of good years with the ZED and some good music (hopefully...)

Cheers,
Benji
have you tried downgrading the ZED driver to the previous version ? It worked for me. Although it's not a long term solution to the FW support issue, it does seem to work pretty well and it's free.

cheers
tim
Old 8th April 2022 | Show parent
  #6341
Here for the gear
 
YourMusic.Pro's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by timryan257 ➡️
have you tried downgrading the ZED driver to the previous version ? It worked for me. Although it's not a long term solution to the FW support issue, it does seem to work pretty well and it's free.

cheers
tim
Hehe, I know, I'm this guy:

A&H Zed R16 Firewire Mixer

Tried it all and lost patience. The RME unit looks great and since I use the desk professionally, I can justify the expense... ;-)

Cheers,
Benji
Old 19th April 2022 | Show parent
  #6342
Gear Maniac
 
1 Review written
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by CeZar ➡️
I'm pretty sure this has been discussed here before, but I still see a lot of people claiming that running the Zed R16 through ADAT will only work if it's set as the master clock. That is not true.

First and foremost: the firewire driver works in Big Sur too, I'm not entirely sure about Monterey because I had problems with this OS for other reasons, so I went with Big Sur stable.

Now, the way you set R16 as the Adat Slave and not Master is as follows:
1: Plug in your Zed R16 as a FIREWIRE interface, the switch on the back of the mixer has to be set to FIREWIRE;(You need a firewire input/pcie for this). Plug in the firewire cable from the mixer to your card.
2: Open the driver, set clock source to: ADAT;
3: Switch it off, unplug Firewire cable, set the switch on the back to ADAT.
4: Plug in the 4 ADAT I/O cables on the back of the mixer, connect the other ends to your ADAT I/O.
5: Turn it on and it will clock from your main interface, which has to be set to INTERNAL.
6: Enjoy.

Now, for my question: Can anyone who's already modded this mixer let me know if it made a difference in summing? I'm interested in getting a bit more of a hi-fi cleaner sound to it rather than the standard dirtier sound?
Yes, I've modified the summing. And yes, really the only way to go with this mixer is cleaner / bigger. You will not get a good overdriven sound from this design.
Old 4 weeks ago | Show parent
  #6343
Here for the gear
-10dbv vs +4dbu (Master inserts & 2tr2 out)

Hi all,

1.> I am wondering if anyone has experience of using an 'unbalanced to balanced converter, and vice versa' on the -10dbv master inserts of the zed r16.

I recently purchased a bus compressor which requires balanced +4db at input, and +4dbu at output. I am wondering if a converter can be added to the master insert send and receive to change it from -10dbv to +4dbu at send, and +4dbu to -10dbv on receive, to get the most out of the compressor.

2.> I am also wondering if anyone has sent +4dbu balanced out from 2tr1 out (which can accomodate max +27dbu, which is +6dbu more than the other outputs, and the stereo bus itself) into external +4dbu device, then returned it via a +4dbu to -10dbv converter into the master insert receive. Again utilising a 'balanced to unbalanced and vice versa' converter.

I would really like to use the zed with a +4dbu feed to and from from the bus comp, but I am uncertain if it's possible or worth it. If anyone has any experience with this, then I would be very interested and greatful to read about it.

I have searched the forums but not found answers.

Thanks!
Old 4 weeks ago | Show parent
  #6344
Lives for gear
 
James Lehmann's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by endesimor ➡️
I am wondering if anyone has experience of using an 'unbalanced to balanced converter, and vice versa' on the -10dbv master inserts of the zed r16.
You can buy Ebtech Line shifters that will convert balanced +4dBu to unbalanced -10dBV and vice versa.

But the ZED R16 inserts are not -10dBV - they're listed in the manual at 0dBu. You might find -10dBV on the Tape Returns, but in all other respects it's a home stereo standard and should be avoided in the studio.

So by all means convert unbalanced to balanced if you wish, but taking the levels down to -10dBV is not what you want to do to interface those inserts to a +4dBu bus comp.

In theory you lose a few dB of S/N-R if your comp can handle +26dB or more max level but in practice I wouldn't worry - I'd leave the insert I/O levels as is.

Personally I don't bother converting my insert send/returns to balanced, but I do RTFM of the balanced processor I'm planning to use and make up some appropriate cables to operate it correctly unbalanced. Drawmer always helpfully tell you what to do in this regard.

Last edited by James Lehmann; 4 weeks ago at 08:21 AM..
Old 4 weeks ago | Show parent
  #6345
Here for the gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by James Lehmann ➡️
You can buy Ebtech Line shifters that will convert balanced +4dBu to unbalanced -10dBV and vice versa.

But the ZED R16 inserts are not -10dBV - they're listed in the manual at 0dBu. You might find -10dBV on the Tape Returns, but in all other respects it's a home stereo standard and should be avoided in the studio.

So by all means convert unbalanced to balanced if you wish, but taking the levels down to -10dBV is not what you want to do to interface those inserts to a +4dBu bus comp.

In theory you lose a few dB of S/N-R if your comp can handle +26dB or more max level but in practice I wouldn't worry - I'd leave the insert I/O levels as is.

Personally I don't bother converting my insert send/returns to balanced, but I do RTFM of the balanced processor I'm planning to use and make up some appropriate cables to operate it correctly unbalanced. Drawmer always helpfully tell you what to do in this regard.
Thank you for your reply.

You are quite right- after checking the zed r16 manual yet again I can also confirm the master inserts operate at 0dbu (not -10dbv), which is great to know. Thank you for bringing that to my attention.

Does anyone have any experience using the 2tr1 to send to external equipment, then returning on the master inserts?

Would there be any noticeable audible/sonic difference/benefit in running a +4dBu gbus clone with a +4dBu signal, as opposed to the standard 0dBu=+4dbu Allen & Heath signal?

The 2tr1 out is +4dBu with +27dBu maximum, whereas all other outputs, and the main inserts are 0dBu with +21dBu max. Furthermore the 2tr1 outs are placed after the main faders, unlike the inserts which are pre master fade. However I don't know if such a chain is possible or worthwhile.
Old 4 weeks ago | Show parent
  #6346
Linear Power Supply Mod

Hi,
for all of you interested in modifying and improving a performance of ZEDR16 my advice is to start from Power Supply.
I recently finished External Linear Power Supply mod and couldn't be happier with outcome.
You can find out about all details and instructions how to do it here
Allen&Heath Zed R16 Linear Power supply Upgrade/Modification

If you need more info be free to drop me PM.

Cheers
Attached Thumbnails
A&H Zed R16 Firewire Mixer-psu-mod-completed.jpeg   A&H Zed R16 Firewire Mixer-psu-mod-under-hood.jpeg   A&H Zed R16 Firewire Mixer-yamaha_pw8.jpeg  
Old 3 weeks ago | Show parent
  #6347
Gear Maniac
 
1 Review written
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nen'O ➡️
Hi,
for all of you interested in modifying and improving a performance of ZEDR16 my advice is to start from Power Supply.
I recently finished External Linear Power Supply mod and couldn't be happier with outcome.
You can find out about all details and instructions how to do it here
Allen&Heath Zed R16 Linear Power supply Upgrade/Modification

If you need more info be free to drop me PM.

Cheers
Nice, what changes did you notice?
Old 3 weeks ago | Show parent
  #6348
Quote:
Originally Posted by rjb5191 ➡️
Nice, what changes did you notice?
Hi,
Unfortunately I don't own audio precision measuring tools to share graphs of before and after PSU mod, just two subjective ears

For sure I can tell that board now has better isolation from mains, random pops and clicks caused by dirty AC are gone, that alone was worth the mod.
The board is not dead quiet after PSU mod, there is still some hiss when all channels are in L/R path but nothing tragic, definitely less than with SMPS.

To me Zed R16 always sounded clean and touch warm, to describe changes with new linear PSU... words that comes to my mind are better definition/separation... present but not harsh...maybe pre mastered mixes now sound more radio ready.
Overall there is an impression of improvement on all levels, AD/DA, monitoring, EQ's.... or it's just my mind trying to justify the mod, hard to tell without audio precision measuring tool

Last edited by Nen'O; 3 weeks ago at 12:22 PM..
Old 3 weeks ago | Show parent
  #6349
Here for the gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by endesimor ➡️

Does anyone have any experience using the 2tr1 to send to external equipment, then returning on the master inserts?

Apart from increased signal to noise ratio, would there be any noticeable audible/sonic difference/benefit in running a +4dBu gbus clone with a +4dBu signal, as opposed to the standard 0dBu Allen & Heath signal?

The 2tr1 out is +4dBu with +27dBu maximum, whereas all other outputs, and the main inserts are 0dBu with +21dBu max. Furthermore the 2tr1 outs are placed after the main faders, unlike the inserts which are pre master fade. However I don't know if such a chain is possible or worthwhile.
bump
Old 3 weeks ago | Show parent
  #6350
Lives for gear
 
augustusarnone's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by endesimor ➡️
bump
I think you're overthinking this. Unbalanced is generally only a problem with long cable runs, 5 or even 10 foot Y unbalanced insert cables are not going to pick up noticeable noise. And if you're worried about headroom with the insert jacks consider that the R16's converters are calibrated to -16dbfs = +4dBu, which is a little hotter than the more typical -18dbfs calibration. So that +21dBu ceiling is more like +23dBu. Which is moot anyway because you can add more gain with the master fader if you need to go higher for some reason.
Old 1 week ago | Show parent
  #6351
Zed R16 - Stock PSU for sale

If anyone interested, here is my listing for A&H Zed R16 stock power supply.
Be free to send your best offer

Allen & Heath ZED R16 Power Supply


Cheers
📝 Reply

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