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You have 107 HP. Go!
Old 28th January 2019
  #1
Gear Guru
 
EvilDragon's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
You have 107 HP. Go!

At some point I am considering building a small Eurocrack system based around a Waldorf kb37. I was initially thinking about using Neutron as the basis for it, which leaves 27 HP for additional modules. Not perfect, but then again, it could be a good excercise in restraint

So, my question to all you good and (probably? ) crazy modular people here is - what would you go for in just 107 HP of space, and why? I welcome all options and opinions - a subtractive build, a West Coast build, a sequencer mayhem, a kludge of all sorts of modules from either coast and around the world...

What do you think would be the most interesting and flexible system you could do in 107 HP, while not breaking the bank terribly? Let's say we have about 1000€ for modules (kb37 not counted in).


Go!



(And thanks!)
Old 28th January 2019
  #2
Gear Guru
 
chrisso's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
The first IMPORTANT question is: what are your goals?

That's the thing that kind of freaks me out about all these type of threads. People feel the need to 'go modular', then ask complete strangers for a top 10 or top 20 module list, but never seem to have a goal in mind.
Do you need or want to go 'West Coast'?
Do you need or want another route to subtractive synthesis?
Do you want to process other audio (like drum loops or guitars)?

What do you want, other than to fill a Waldorf keyboard? That will focus people's recommendations for you.
Old 28th January 2019
  #3
Gear Guru
 
EvilDragon's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
That's why I asked for several examples of different setups

I'm a keyboard player so I'm pretty sure I won't want to do generative drone stuff - which is also why I had a thought of casing it all in kb37.
Old 28th January 2019 | Show parent
  #4
Gear Guru
 
chrisso's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by EvilDragon ➑️
That's why I asked for several examples of different setups
But you're just going to get a random list of everyone's favourite modules du jour.
ten different lists from ten different forums members.
In any case, my point stands. It might be unpopular, but the ONLY reason to get into modular is if you have a specific goal in mind.
Old 28th January 2019
  #5
Lives for gear
 
slaughtrhaus's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by EvilDragon ➑️
At some point I am considering building a small Eurocrack system based around a Waldorf kb37. I was initially thinking about using Neutron as the basis for it, which leaves 27 HP for additional modules. Not perfect, but then again, it could be a good excercise in restraint

So, my question to all you good and (probably? ) crazy modular people here is - what would you go for in just 107 HP of space, and why? I welcome all options and opinions - a subtractive build, a West Coast build, a sequencer mayhem, a kludge of all sorts of modules from either coast and around the world...

What do you think would be the most interesting and flexible system you could do in 107 HP, while not breaking the bank terribly? Let's say we have about 1000€ for modules (kb37 not counted in).


Go!



(And thanks!)
Hey Evil Dragon welcome to our little corner. The KB37 is a tight little package, isn't it. Very attractive to everyone in modular. But I'm afraid Chrisso is correct, you need a goal. Right now what I see is you spending a grand to house a 300 dollar synth and a few random modules (that could easily cost another grand). Honestly I see this ending in disappointment for you if you go this route. In 3 months time you'll wonder why you did this and start thinking how stupid modular is.

Fun Fact:
I had a ModularGrid layout called "KB37" for years and eventually deleted it because I cane to the conclusion that trying to fit anything reasonable in 107 HP just wasn't going to work for me, there was always something missing.

If the Neutron looks good to you, I say get it and plug one of your many MIDI keyboards first. Play with the patch points you get with it and figure out the next module you want organically. Find a limitation or a need and then augment it with a new module. Racking huge modules like that isn't necessary either, unless you buy it and then decide you definitely need to take it out of the house in a compact form. Even then you might be better off with a Midi keyboard and a TipTop Mantis or similar.

Besides, everyone knows that if your first module is a semi-modular your 2nd module should be Make Noise Maths. It is known.
Old 28th January 2019 | Show parent
  #6
Gear Guru
 
chrisso's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by slaughtrhaus ➑️
If the Neutron looks good to you, I say get it and plug one of your many MIDI keyboards first. Play with the patch points you get with it and figure out the next module you want organically. Find a limitation or a need and then augment it with a new module.
Exactamundo.
Old 28th January 2019 | Show parent
  #7
Gear Guru
 
EvilDragon's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by slaughtrhaus ➑️
If the Neutron looks good to you, I say get it and plug one of your many MIDI keyboards first. Play with the patch points you get with it and figure out the next module you want organically. Find a limitation or a need and then augment it with a new module. Racking huge modules like that isn't necessary either, unless you buy it and then decide you definitely need to take it out of the house in a compact form. Even then you might be better off with a Midi keyboard and a TipTop Mantis or similar.

Besides, everyone knows that if your first module is a semi-modular your 2nd module should be Make Noise Maths. It is known.
Yes, Neutron sounds great to me (looks not that much, I'd have to get an overlay from Heinakroon ). So yes, this was exactly my though - first having a play with Neutron alone.

And then of course, get Maths, because that's what everybody does. Or actually, get a miniaturized version of Maths, to save on HPs

I want to have something that I don't have currently. VCO - Neutron has it. Specific filter - Neutron has it. And from there, it might be a good idea to have a neat multi-function oscillator like Mutable's Braids or Plaits, to go through Neutron's filter. Maybe another specific filter if it fits (perhaps Polivoks or something, dunno)...


As far as semi-modulars, I suppose nothing can kinda beat Neutron purely on price vs features, but what would be other great options (sound and feature-wise) for not an arm and a leg?
Old 28th January 2019 | Show parent
  #8
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Coorec's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
If Neutron is set as base, I would add another filter flavor as well as a small Random/Sequencer thingy and a little more modulation.

So my choices for 27 HP would be:

Manhattan Analo MA35
Eowave Zone B.F.
Turing Machine mk 2
Old 28th January 2019 | Show parent
  #9
Gear Guru
 
Derp's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by slaughtrhaus ➑️
Honestly I see this ending in disappointment for you if you go this route. In 3 months time you'll wonder why you did this and start thinking how stupid modular is.
HUGE +1 to this. It sounds like you're wanting to use modular to build a fixed-architecture synth.

Quote:
Originally Posted by slaughtrhaus ➑️
Fun Fact:
I had a ModularGrid layout called "KB37" for years and eventually deleted it
I did the same thing on MG in response to a thread asking for suggestions, and I ended up deleting it just because it was no longer relevant. I'll be honest, thinking about what my dream KB37 layout would be now, I'd just be rebuilding what's in that new Micro Freak since it's based around a Mutable macro oscillator.
Old 28th January 2019
  #10
Gear Guru
 
Derp's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Just for laughs, I tried it anyway. Meet THE ANGRY DRAGON!!!



Went with uBraids to get a good macro oscillator for some digital flavor, Wasp filter because it's such a cool character, mixer just because mixing stuff is neato, and three 2HP Sequencers. The idea with the sequencers is to have them clocked with note triggers, and use them to modulate parameters like filter, PWM, etc kind of like an MS2000.

The thing of it is though, this is what I look at and think would be fun. This synth may not be for you, and if you're going to leap into modular, you need a better plan. Honestly, as a "keyboard player" I just don't think you'd be happy with modular anyway. Modular is a tinkerer's realm.
Attached Thumbnails
You have 107 HP. Go!-angry-dragon.jpg  
Old 28th January 2019
  #11
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mekanik's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
If I was starting out with the Neutron I would add an E440 or Rossum Evo filter, a147-2 LFO, WMD Amplitude VCA. Wmd wavefolder.

I was starting from scratch I would probably build something similar to the Neutron. But concentrating on really good sounding parts, also they should all be easy to understand/patch and have good room to manipulate, so no 2hp/micro modules or other ultra cramped ones.

Possibly malekko/ajh/bubblersound oscs. Maybe 2 different filters. Some good vcas, a double envelope like intellijell/Shapers, some VC lfos. Mults, attenuators like WMDs, maybe even a modulation osc like a a111-3, 1 or 2 mixers, maybe 1 clean one and 1 dirty (dtm/.mix), a wavefolder. I estimate it would cost maybe 2-2,5 grand or so.

Another route would be going mostly digital, like an e352 as base and then a multimode filter, vcas, several lfos/mod-oscs, mults, atts, wavefolders, rectifiers, vc-controlled crossfaders and so on. Basically really feeding that 352 with lots of stuff. That osc could be substituted with several other digital oscs though.

Maybe fill it up with complex osc stuff like complex oscs and low pass gates? Function generators. Clock sources.



There is so much stuff out today its insane, and only you can deciede on how to fill up a case with what you want. If you start from scratch it will become very expensive if you choose quality modules. I'm guessing between 1500-3000€.

The only thing I can say for sure is that I personally wouldn't fill it up with lots of Make noise/Mutable/Intellijel since I'm not really attracted to the sounds these modules usually aim to make or think they look good (intellijel) or are good enough quality (intellijel). But thats just me, and many other people think just the opposite of these modules.

So to concluse this post. Get whatever you want
Old 28th January 2019
  #12
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mekanik's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Another "complete voice" module to use as a base could be Intellijel Atlantis and Tonestar 8106 or the Arp model. And those are a fair bit more compact.
Old 28th January 2019 | Show parent
  #13
Gear Guru
 
EvilDragon's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Derp ➑️
The thing of it is though, this is what I look at and think would be fun. This synth may not be for you, and if you're going to leap into modular, you need a better plan. Honestly, as a "keyboard player" I just don't think you'd be happy with modular anyway. Modular is a tinkerer's realm.
Yeah, looks fun for sure!

BTW, I am also a tinkerer, but I like melodies more than chirpy noises and somesuch. I do have experience with Reaktor and VAZ Modular, and recently also dabbled a bit with VCV.

Who knows, maybe that is what will end up being enough for me. But curiosity got the better of me and I posted this question here.
Old 29th January 2019
  #14
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Mefistophelees's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
I don't agree you have to know what you want. Modular is such a big area that's it's pretty much impossible to know what's possible without a serious amount of research.

Starting with a synth voice like the Neutron is a good start, and it's cheap. I'd keep it external then fill the rack space up over time. I did that here:

Multiple
Maths (it's really 4 modules in 1 so it's not that big considering that).
Plaits - oscillator
STO - Makenoise oscillator
DTM - Moog mixer clone.
A-137 1 Wavefolder (there are far smaller ones but this is cheap).
Polivoks filter.
Ripples - A Rolandish sounding filter.
Geiger counter - multifunction module with bit crushing and wavetable converter (changes the input waveform into something else).
Clouds - I think there's a law that says you have to have this one.
Mix 4 - a spare mixer to fill the last 3hp

You can do the main east and west cost things with those and a whole lot more besides.
There's FAR more than east and west coast in Eurorack.
Attached Thumbnails
You have 107 HP. Go!-screenshot-2019-01-29-03.24.39.jpg  
Old 29th January 2019
  #15
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uptheoctave's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
I don't know too many people that can keep a Eurorack to only being 100hp or so.

I went from this:



to this:



in under 6 months... and I've just started tower 2.

What I thought I wanted from a modular has massively changed in that time and I don't think it is really possible to forecast your use because once you get to grips with what it can do then what you want it to do will really change.

That said- get an oscillator or two (AJH are good for this), a filter, a VCA, envelope, some sort of output module and go from there.

Oh and Maths.

Last edited by uptheoctave; 30th January 2019 at 04:08 AM..
Old 29th January 2019 | Show parent
  #16
Gear Guru
 
chrisso's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mefistophelees ➑️
I don't agree you have to know what you want. Modular is such a big area that's it's pretty much impossible to know what's possible without a serious amount of research.
.
It's really not that hard to have some kind of goal. It helps stop you waste a lot of money.
Does one want to be more experimental? Dip a toe into Buchla/Serge style synthesis? Have the ability to process audio?

Without some kind of goal in mind you are just buying modules blind, and on the say so of people you don't know.
Old 30th January 2019 | Show parent
  #17
Lives for gear
 
Mefistophelees's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisso ➑️
It's really not that hard to have some kind of goal. It helps stop you waste a lot of money.
Does one want to be more experimental? Dip a toe into Buchla/Serge style synthesis? Have the ability to process audio?

Without some kind of goal in mind you are just buying modules blind, and on the say so of people you don't know.
I actually thought that, after posing of course

I guess octatonic put it better by saying the goals can change as your system grows and you learn more. That's what happened with me.

I started with a sound processing system but rapidly got bored of it. I got a Kraftzwerg with 3 oscillator outs and that made it really come to life.

Then I got into oscillators and made it into a full synth. Then I got into aggressive modules, then digital oscillators, then aggressive digital, then drums then weird stuff etc... It just grew and grew!
Old 31st January 2019
  #18
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bkbirge's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Obviously what you need is a Metasonix based build, clearly nothing else will do.

The 2hp osc gives you a nice basic stable oscillator that you can use on its own and also feed into the cv in of the metasonix so you get stable tracking.
2 Metasonix VCO's, an LPF and a VCA, they all sound great.
2hp Arp so you can get some nice triggered arpeggios, use one of the lfo's as the clock.
Dual LFO can also be set to one shot so that's another envelope generator.
Double Andore, 2 loopable envelope generators and vca's.
MVP for the utilities you definitely need, mults, attenuverters and mixers.
Glide and output are handled by the kb37.
Some might say ring mod and noise are missing but with the way you can abuse the Metasonix you won't need them.
Old 31st January 2019
  #19
Gear Guru
 
EvilDragon's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Nice, that's slightly different! There's arpeggiator on kb37, though, so that's 2 HP saved (lol).

Doesn't have Maths!
Old 31st January 2019 | Show parent
  #20
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bkbirge's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by EvilDragon ➑️
Nice, that's slightly different! There's arpeggiator on kb37, though, so that's 2 HP saved (lol).

Doesn't have Maths!
Cool, didn't know that. I might still keep the Arp though, trigger a faster arp off of a slower one would be very cool, or run two in parallel with different patterns, etc. Or maybe put a 2hp sequencer in there to do basically the same thing but with a little more flexibility. Or store some crackers in the empty slot for those mid-set munchies.

Yeah if you want a Maths replace the Double Andore with it. Having had both I much prefer the DAII for all the i/o + normalled vcas. Also I'm not big on the cryptic for being cryptic's sake panels Makenoise likes but I know some people love them.

There are lots of dual env options out there.
Old 31st January 2019
  #21
Gear Guru
 
EvilDragon's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Any great oscs that don't take as much HP? Those Metasonix sound great but man, knob per area ratio is kinda criminal on them.
Old 1st February 2019
  #22
Gear Guru
 
chrisso's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
I’ve found most of the Metasonix stuff unusable.
Also, very small modules with fewer controls are hard to dial in accurately. I had a whole Pico system, couldn’t remember any of the hidden menu functions and couldn’t get anything to play in tune.
Old 1st February 2019
  #23
Gear Nut
 
i would start very slow...morphagene and maths or batumi.
Old 1st February 2019
  #24
how about something with an appropriate colour scheme?

My turbid Eurorack - Eurorack Modular System from Maffez on ModularGrid

Since you've dipped into vcv/reaktor etc, an expert sleepers might just save you a variety of vcos and modulators, which you could do in software. the rest above would be a mix of vco, digital, different filters for different colours and a good ole classic in between if you just want a straightforward monosynth jam
Old 1st February 2019
  #25
Gear Guru
 
EvilDragon's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quite an interesting setup there! Pretty flexible, too. I'd probably still go with Neutron, tho (I'd get a different overlay, of course).

Those Pico modules are cute!

What does O&C do?
Old 1st February 2019
  #26
Gear Guru
 
chrisso's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Multi-function module. Excellent.
ornament & crime

Quantising, sequencing, random, complex envelopes and much more.
Old 1st February 2019
  #27
Gear Guru
 
EvilDragon's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Whoa.
Old 1st February 2019 | Show parent
  #28
Quote:
Originally Posted by EvilDragon ➑️
Whoa.
O_C is open souce, afaik, so in constant development

weird modulation options, sequencing, chiptune audio source, quad-envelope (based on MI Peaks), and, recently quad usb-cv interface

ornament & crime
Old 1st February 2019
  #29
Gear Addict
 
Torn n Frayed's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
I'd suggest a Disting Mk4 as well.
Old 1st February 2019 | Show parent
  #30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maffez ➑️
O_C is open souce, afaik, so in constant development

weird modulation options, sequencing, chiptune audio source, quad-envelope (based on MI Peaks), and, recently quad usb-cv interface

ornament & crime
Also, when chosing the Neutron over the Boog, I'd chuck out the Expert Sleeper's since you can always get a second hand motu or Alesis I/O 6 for DC coupled outputs (should you have 8 channels adat spare on your soundcard). Maybe even also instead of the dual lpg an Antumbra DVCA, whcih can work as mixer and vca; since teh Neutron has an inverter on the patchbay you could easily create more filter types by mixing and inverting existing ones
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