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Unity Rock vs. Egg vs. S1X vs. Twins vs. ME Geithain RL 906 vs. KH 120
Old 7th May 2013
  #541
Listening experience with 2108 convinced me to trip to Jablonec. Velvet is actually centre of hardware actions lately, at least for me. With most of what has been described in Ivo thread I agree, but I like to brought something controversional!
Maybe that 2108 and 3110 sound completely different than you expect. Hmm .. I thought it would be a bit better 7r and less 3110 .. But the nature of this monitor is quite different. When I first heard 7R, I was impressed with their performance, and a by very truthful (world-like) reproduction. But it is not perfectly flat monitor with great depth and detail like PSI. To me, 7r are little vintage souding.. same as Manley mastering monitor. Large 3110 remained the favorite work tool, ie monitors, on which I can joy to listen to and identify cons as well as bad nuances of a mix. No lies and other shenanigans - this how can be characterized Quested.

Good room would open all the differences in monitors. After the first moment of listening to 2108 I was very surprised by the balance and accuracy. Higher band is very similar to 3110, but significantly faster than 7r. Mid-range is bit drowned, but still detailed and accurate. Can not say that this is a drop in frequency or corssover, but rather a decent sound of two-way. I mean slightly mumbled midrange in comparison with really huge 3110. In this regard, in 2108 reminded me Geithain, therefore nothing for what might be ashamed of. On the other hand, after listening to dozens of recordings I found a pleasant little surprise. I heard a clear errors in some commercial masters which, although they wereon the big brother much "bigger" .. but equally noticable in 2108. Working with these monitors make me thinking all the time - they are perfect for mixing. Have to say that I am just very impressed because it is great sound, which linkes me to modern studio format. Characterized by its full, clear, and deep tone. Monitor are inspiring and musical, they motivates to listen music and while staying transparent and detailed. Transients are very fast and space (3D) is as large as the PSI. Now I understand why Zimmer chose this model for their studios. Once you start making music in 2108, you feel that you are in a big cinema. It helps to set volume ratios of instruments especially in the mid. Unmentioned bass is fantastic. There's more than enough even for big room and wave is strong and stable. Not once I heard monitor somehow overwhelm or limping at higher volumes.

My love for 3110 is infinite, the reason why I am still more into them - and expecially for maximum dryness and truthfull space. But I bet 2108 will choose 90% engineers, because sound is totally reliable and solid. You have full control of performance and inspirational sound that lets KHO300 go for a walk. Musician, producer and sound engineer get exactly what they need. When I think about this, we're talking about an exceptional format of monitors.

However, I was quite surprised by PSI A17, which after two weeks burn-in given me a new breath. They started playing different than new, and much fuller and transparent. This time I got a bug in my head - now the first time I was sure they are suitable solution even for middle room as near field and can be used also as a reference monitor - which is fantastic given the size. I guess I'm a bit off 7R now .. but for now it's a monitor, where professional league begins.
Old 7th May 2013
  #542
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ckett's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Anghello,

Thank you for sharing your experiences with these monitors. I am currently looking into replacing my K&H O300s with either the Quested V2108s or the PSI A21s. While the K&Hs are very good, I have trouble with very defined imaging. It may be my room. Also, after hearing Ivos description of them sounding "chemical" I would like to move to something more lifelike, less synthesized if you know what I mean.
Old 7th May 2013 | Show parent
  #543
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckett ➑️
Anghello,

Thank you for sharing your experiences with these monitors. I am currently looking into replacing my K&H O300s with either the Quested V2108s or the PSI A21s. While the K&Hs are very good, I have trouble with very defined imaging. It may be my room. Also, after hearing Ivos description of them sounding "chemical" I would like to move to something more lifelike, less synthesized if you know what I mean.
Yes. I know and understand.

The goal of O300 is that its a 3-way monitor. But definition and depth of high-end is poor. It was great a decade ago but today.. technology moved forward. If you are looking for crystal clear speaker you should get PSI. I can't say nothing about A21, but A17 was amazing last time I heard them. I would say A17 are better then 7r. But only con of PSI is that they sound huge-finished. I think your "change" would be more pleasant with PSI.. while Quested would make you feel you listen to new format of sound. PSI is more colorful and crisp while quested 2108 are bit dark. Just imagine a sound of 2108 as modern cinema sound (imax etc).. while PSI has that definition + more headroom + show you more detail. 7R are warm sounding and bit more to O300 but they are very different in comparison to "bit frozen" 2108, they lack that detail in top-end.. easy, 2108 has a faster amp. I would like to add that I am talking about newest version of these speakers. So tests done a decade ago should not be accurate. If you wish to hear more and get a better job done - get PSI. But if you want a better job done - get 2108. I highly recommend 3110. 2108 sounds fantastic in comparison to 3110.. but for professional use you would gain your results with 3110. You should choose between good reference sound or better translation. Both of them are much better then O300 (with all do respect to that legend).
Old 7th May 2013
  #544
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ckett's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Anghello,

Were you in the room when the O300s were brought over to hear along with the Questeds and PSI with Ivo?

I prefer having the detail but sometimes that can lead your mix/master decisions sounding not as clear on consumer grade listening speakers/headphones. I am wondering if having the slightly darker Questeds would force one to create clearer mixes that translate better to more speakers.
Old 8th May 2013 | Show parent
  #545
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Karloff70's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckett ➑️
Anghello,

Were you in the room when the O300s were brought over to hear along with the Questeds and PSI with Ivo?

I prefer having the detail but sometimes that can lead your mix/master decisions sounding not as clear on consumer grade listening speakers/headphones. I am wondering if having the slightly darker Questeds would force one to create clearer mixes that translate better to more speakers.
Or you could just stick a pair of littlepapercones next to the PSI......zoomed out view included, case closed.
Old 9th May 2013 | Show parent
  #546
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🎧 10 years
Hey guys,
I've been following this thread with great interest..
Haven't heard much about Focal SM9 by comparison to Quested SR7, V2108, and PSI A17, A21. Any thoughts?
I own the Twins and it's easy for me to like them without having compared them to "subjectively" better stuff.
Old 10th May 2013
  #547
Gear Guru
 
Jeezo's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Andrey , try the quested calbrated with aRC 2 ...and dark , you will not found them !!

Gutr2 i tried the SM9 and they kill the twin in all areas if it's your question , but if you have room and budget : Quested all the way 3110 or 2108 ...
Old 10th May 2013 | Show parent
  #548
nms
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2 Reviews written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by gutr2 ➑️
Hey guys,
I've been following this thread with great interest..
Haven't heard much about Focal SM9 by comparison to Quested SR7, V2108, and PSI A17, A21. Any thoughts?
I own the Twins and it's easy for me to like them without having compared them to "subjectively" better stuff.
S7R and A17 are nowhere near the league of the SM9.

Asking for opinions on monitors in an internet forum is honestly a crap shoot for several reasons. There's SO much room for error depending on the room geometry, acoustic treatment, speaker positioning, EQ'ing, burn in, and test content. Then once you get past all that there's personal preference according to what we're each after for our particular music styles and needs.

For my needs (dance music) I don't regard the PSI A21M or Quested V2108 as having a realistic chance of being better suited for my needs than the SM9. One small but relevant part of that being how precisely I'd be able to directly eq the SM9 drivers to my taste & room which is a big plus and can be done better & more conveniently than messing with digital EQ's on the outgoing audio.

Focal Twins (when setup right) sound great and many owners can attest to that better than people with very minimal & limited experience with them. You can find many polarized opinions on them here though.

Nothing beats being able to try monitors in your own room but that can be a geographic impossibility a lot of the time.

I like my Twins enough and trust in the design & what I've heard of the SM9 to buy them without demoing first, but they're the only monitor on my radar I'd take that risk with.
Old 10th May 2013 | Show parent
  #549
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Karloff70's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by nms ➑️

For my needs (dance music) I don't regard the PSI A21M or Quested V2108 as having a realistic chance of being better suited for my needs than the SM9.
I take it this is based on trying them all out?
Old 10th May 2013
  #550
nms
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Karloff70 ➑️
I take it this is based on trying them all out?
If you didn't read my post then sure lol.

Aside from the typical things most of us want from a monitor, specifically I want my next monitors to be flat to 40hz within 1db. Absolutely no perceivable port noise at any volume with bass heavy dance music. I don't want to ever have an issue with how loud the low end can be cleanly reproduced with utmost detail. Nice linear response at quiet volumes as well as loud. Ability to tweak them precisely via driver EQs to tune to my room is also a big bonus.

With that in mind, can you or anyone else here honestly say that the A21M or V2108 have a realistic chance of being better suited for what I'm after?

The A21 are a ported 2-way with no EQs, low end is 6db down at 38hz and amp power is 120w +50w. The SM9 an unported 3 way with all the EQ options you could want, 400w+100w+100w amp power and only 1db down at 40hz. Those are some very different monitors.
Old 10th May 2013 | Show parent
  #551
Gear Guru
 
Karloff70's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by nms ➑️
Aside from the typical things most of us want from a monitor, specifically I want my next monitors to be flat to 40hz within 1db. Absolutely no perceivable port noise at any volume with bass heavy dance music. I don't want to ever have an issue with how loud the low end can be cleanly reproduced with utmost detail. Nice linear response at quiet volumes as well as loud. Ability to tweak them precisely via driver EQs to tune to my room is also a big bonus.

With that in mind, can you or anyone else here honestly say that the A21M or V2108 have a realistic chance of being better suited for what I'm after?
Speaking for the A21m's, with the 1dB, no. Nor the eq, as all they have is a bottom rolloff best left alone. With the other points it hits the ball out of the park however. Way out of the park. Personally I find the request of within 1 dB of no real value though, as in reality what the A21m's give me is just as practically useable. But I am not going to tell you what you want, only that you might miss out by not trying what you think won't be right based on rationale constructions as opposed to trying them out. This goes for the Quested's too.......
Old 10th May 2013
  #552
nms
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🎧 10 years
I just really don't want to have any need for EQ correction upstream on my next go and it's a very risky move hoping to be able to just drop in a pair of monitors as is and be perfectly satisfied with no chance of tailoring them to my room or taste. I definitely want something that'll extend lower than my Twins as well but tightly and cleanly. I work really loud at times and house music is very taxing on the low end drivers. Before my Twins I tried a pair of Adam A7X that were put up for sale the same day they arrived due to low end issues.

I have no doubt whatsoever that the V2108 and A21M are fantastic monitors.. just probably not the best next move for me personally. I won't be able to demo any of them in my studio. There's a chance I might make it by VKLA before I buy but I might end up having to just roll the dice.

You guys have mentioned differences between the V3110 and 2108 as well as PSI A21M and A25M. The 3 way design & extended frequency response has a hand in that.
Old 10th May 2013
  #553
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🎧 15 years
I would find it hard to impossible to justify buying any monitors in this price range not being able to try them at mine first.

Sent from my GT-I5800 using Gearslutz App
Old 10th May 2013
  #554
nms
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🎧 10 years
If you had the room, budget, and wanted to upgrade to midfields would it really be much of a risk picking up the A25 given your love for the PSI sound?

I would love to listen to those. Same with the V3110. Too big for my needs though. I will most likely fly out to VKLA before buying, but still.. I didn't buy my Twins from how they sounded in the showroom. I bought them for how I hoped and suspected they'd sound in my studio. They ended up being exactly as I hoped when setup right and fed from my Hilo.
Old 10th May 2013
  #555
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🎧 10 years
disclaimer: I'm not a mastering engineer, I'm just some dude with a home studio, producing techno and have nothing better to do right now than to hang around on gearslutz.

I personally bought the A21-M without listening first. I could have sent them back if I didn't like them, but they are great so I kept them. It was a leap of faith, and I'm ok with that. Trying out monitors in my studio here in Iceland means I have to spend a ridiculous amount on shipping or have a very limited collection of brands to choose from.

PSI A21-M with the A225-M sub is really good. I don't believe they are better than SM9, but I don't think they are worse either. (but of course I haven't heard SM9, the icelandic store didn't have them in stock. they actually had a guy from focal bring a pair for show and tell (one time event) a few weeks before I went looking for them. but he took them back to france... )

I believe when you have quality speakers you have to have a good room. I mean, if the speaker has +/-1db down to 40hz and your room has +/- 20db nulls and peaks, what good does it do?

And you have to learn how to use the monitor, so even if it does have EQ settings you have to listen to reference tracks anyway and learn their balance and how to use them. (I have to have a reference track when mixing in A21-M, else the balance goes out the window. perhaps it's related to how transparent they are, there isn't a lot of masking happening even if the bass is way too loud.)

once you get to used to them and learned their strength and weaknesses, the bottleneck probably isn't if you have SM9, A21-M or some other high quality monitor, or if it has EQ settings or not. It's more about you, your room and how much work you put in to the project. so in that sense I don't think it's absolutely crucial what brand of monitors you have as long as they are of high calibre, like the ones that are being discussed in this thread.

perhaps I'm stating the obvious but : The proof is in the pudding. If you make great mixes on your monitors then it doesn't matter what you use (SM9 or A21). and both are certainly capable of helping you do that.

that said I'm still obsessed by reading about monitors and am constantly dreaming about trying out Quested, Unity Audio, ATC, Spiral Groove and others... keep it going
Old 10th May 2013 | Show parent
  #556
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🎧 10 years
Hey man, thanks so much for sharing your thoughts.

I'm strongly considering upgrading to SM9 from Twins. But am also considering Quested and PSI. As you know, here in BC, it's a real mission to have them all to try. So I HAVE to consider internet opinions. As fallible as that is.
Thanks

Quote:
Originally Posted by nms ➑️
S7R and A17 are nowhere near the league of the SM9.

Asking for opinions on monitors in an internet forum is honestly a crap shoot for several reasons. There's SO much room for error depending on the room geometry, acoustic treatment, speaker positioning, EQ'ing, burn in, and test content. Then once you get past all that there's personal preference according to what we're each after for our particular music styles and needs.

For my needs (dance music) I don't regard the PSI A21M or Quested V2108 as having a realistic chance of being better suited for my needs than the SM9. One small but relevant part of that being how precisely I'd be able to directly eq the SM9 drivers to my taste & room which is a big plus and can be done better & more conveniently than messing with digital EQ's on the outgoing audio.

Focal Twins (when setup right) sound great and many owners can attest to that better than people with very minimal & limited experience with them. You can find many polarized opinions on them here though.

Nothing beats being able to try monitors in your own room but that can be a geographic impossibility a lot of the time.

I like my Twins enough and trust in the design & what I've heard of the SM9 to buy them without demoing first, but they're the only monitor on my radar I'd take that risk with.
Old 10th May 2013 | Show parent
  #557
Gear Guru
 
Karloff70's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by nms ➑️
If you had the room, budget, and wanted to upgrade to midfields would it really be much of a risk picking up the A25 given your love for the PSI sound?

I would love to listen to those. Same with the V3110. Too big for my needs though. I will most likely fly out to VKLA before buying, but still.. I didn't buy my Twins from how they sounded in the showroom. I bought them for how I hoped and suspected they'd sound in my studio. They ended up being exactly as I hoped when setup right and fed from my Hilo.
I certainly wouldn't buy them unheard. In fact likely wouldn't buy them at all as I am not really into 'the PSI sound' on a larger scale than my A21m's as a concept anyway. I prefer the idea of Quested sound for larger things, like a big "velvet 3D world". And the PSI "full definition, phase correct world" on a smaller scale. And then the pair of littlepapercones, to avoid accidental balancing issues as mentioned by Yagya. That would be me in monitoring heaven. One bigger room and a pair of Questeds away for now.....
Old 11th May 2013
  #558
nms
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2 Reviews written
🎧 10 years
I guess if you're spending $5k+ on monitors and want to play it safe and get exactly what you want it's worth the cost of flying somewhere that you can demo all options in a suitable environment. You should know your room well enough to have pretty good idea of how it'll affect the low end which in my experience is the biggest thing that changes.

I'm used to buying gear I've not laid hands on beforehand and just selling off what doesn't fit my needs (hence my itrader rating), but that's not so convenient with items costing that much especially if buying new.
Old 22nd May 2013 | Show parent
  #559
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Arksun's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by nms ➑️

The A21 are a ported 2-way with no EQs, low end is 6db down at 38hz and amp power is 120w +50w. The SM9 an unported 3 way with all the EQ options you could want, 400w+100w+100w amp power and only 1db down at 40hz. Those are some very different monitors.
To me it sounds like you're making major assumptions about the A21 based on written specs and behaviour of other ported monitors alone. Bass is super clear with no port chuffing with the A21. As for amp specs, the PSI amps are unbelievably efficient and do not sound underpowered in any way. You crank the volume up and there is no audible compression, it just sounds louder.
There is some seriously clever electronics in the PSI range.
Old 1st July 2013 | Show parent
  #560
Deleted #245032
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeezo ➑️
F....k you !!! look what you did !! lol (joke here)

First 2108 say hello to my hernia Bi profenid during dayz now !!

first i can't do a side by side test (switch a/b) but what i can tell after calibration : HIGHS are here and here !!

Details : impressed , i mean impressed ...

Medium : they rules some 3 way i tried

Hot : they get super hot damn my 15 m2 room is a dungeon now ...

Natural ?: what can i say so natural that i'm scared to other treat things ...

Strenght : felling of ambience, rooms , space : incredible ...and full

Cons: maybe bass precision versus the s2x and transient response great but not as fast BUT the balance between low and medium +high seems in phase !! weight one tone ....

Also i don't have that sensation of space around each instruments ....reminds me the focal sm9 ...


Build quality : i will die before them maybe ....


Not yet sure about the left right precision , also as they're big i need to push them (volume) to really feel that front to back field while on the s2x at low volume i got it ..the crazy stuff is that i don't feel it and bamm i'm listening loud while it's seems way les that adam (but same spl) strange ...

stay tune

but all i can say is that as i said yeturday to my student , the best buy under 1000 euros for real ...(s7r)

i really discovered a brand thks to you guyz ...

Hey jeezo, what did you mean about the highs? I finally tested v2108 and loved them, planning on ordering them soon but i do feel that the highs roll off a bit even with +1.. were you somehow able to fix this? Is it a placement issue maybe?
Old 3rd July 2013 | Show parent
  #561
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Fleaman's Avatar
 
🎧 20 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by nms ➑️
The A21 are a ported 2-way with no EQs, low end is 6db down at 38hz and amp power is 120w +50w. The SM9 an unported 3 way with all the EQ options you could want, 400w+100w+100w amp power and only 1db down at 40hz. Those are some very different monitors.
The SM9 maybe 'unported' in a literal sense, but a ported monitor and a passive radiator monitor are BOTH acoustic resonator designs, so they both share very similar traits (vs a sealed design).
Old 28th December 2018 | Show parent
  #562
Gear Addict
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by FoxMulderFBI ➑️
I tried Egg's and not impressed at all. KH's destroyed them in every way.
I have the KH120's and I am not satisfied by them, are you the Eggs are worse?
Old 20th October 2020 | Show parent
  #563
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dotl's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deleted #245032 ➑️
Hey jeezo, what did you mean about the highs? I finally tested v2108 and loved them, planning on ordering them soon but i do feel that the highs roll off a bit even with +1.. were you somehow able to fix this? Is it a placement issue maybe?
All thread bump but I’m also interested in this! I’ve read multiple times that the v2108 are dark, with rolled off highs.
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