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Tyler Acoustics MM5X Speaker Experience
Old 17th June 2020
  #1
Here for the gear
 
Tyler Acoustics MM5X Speaker Experience

Greetings, I'm new to this forum, though have visited it regularly to glean information. I'm a singer/songwriter and I'm building a very simple home studio to record my music. I recently bought a couple of Tyler Acoustics MM5X speakers to use for mixing. I wanted to address the membership regarding the best placement of these speakers in a studio, in terms of height, distance from the walls, etc. I was hoping there would be some forum members who had experience with MM5X's and could let me know what had worked for them. I'd be grateful for any info you share.
Thank you in advance!
Roi James
Old 18th June 2020
  #2
Gear Head
 
nick b's Avatar
 
I love my mm5x’s for mastering, but I’m not sold on them as mix monitors. I rely on a pair of near-fields for that.

Location is the same as you’ll find in any speaker placement guide. You’ll need to experiment to find the best spot for both you and the speakers.

I’d recommend trying sorbathane isolation pads between the speaker and stand to tighten up bass response and overall clarity- they made a big different in my room. Room treatment is also a must.
Old 18th June 2020 | Show parent
  #3
Here for the gear
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by nick b ➡️
I love my mm5x’s for mastering, but I’m not sold on them as mix monitors. I rely on a pair of near-fields for that.

Location is the same as you’ll find in any speaker placement guide. You’ll need to experiment to find the best spot for both you and the speakers.

I’d recommend trying sorbathane isolation pads between the speaker and stand to tighten up bass response and overall clarity- they made a big different in my room. Room treatment is also a must.
Thanks for the feedback. I'm looking into all of your suggestions. It's good to know that they can work right against a wall in the corner because that would be the best place for them in my studio. Also, looking into Sorbathane pads.

Got a question regarding something you said. On your preference in using them for mastering but not mixing. What is the difference between the two that would require a different speaker for each process? I have some experience but still learning. I assumed mastering would demand a speaker that gives a very flat response to get an honest representation of the recording.

Thanks!
Old 18th June 2020
  #4
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Verified Member
🎧 5 years
I find it easier to mix on nearfields too. Nearfields put you in the music, far field full range monitors put you in the audience.
Old 18th June 2020
  #5
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I use them every day for mastering and I had great results when I used them for mixing. Last year I upgraded the tweeters to seas millennium and the other drivers to paper and they sound incredible.
Old 18th June 2020
  #6
Gear Head
 
I mix on them sometime cause i've just the Tylers but i don't like...
Old 18th June 2020 | Show parent
  #7
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nick b's Avatar
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by roijames ➡️
Thanks for the feedback. I'm looking into all of your suggestions. It's good to know that they can work right against a wall in the corner because that would be the best place for them in my studio. Also, looking into Sorbathane pads.

Got a question regarding something you said. On your preference in using them for mastering but not mixing. What is the difference between the two that would require a different speaker for each process? I have some experience but still learning. I assumed mastering would demand a speaker that gives a very flat response to get an honest representation of the recording.

Thanks!
I have my speakers up near a wall out of necessity. The front porting lets me get away with this to an extent but there’s still SBIR (a reason I’m looking into Trinnov). If possible I would recommend giving them some more space. But experiment and see where you get the most honest representation (maybe with a buddy since they’re so heavy)

For mastering speakers yes flat is important but so is translation and range and a number of other things. I like Conunra’s analogy, and to add, nearfields are usually focused more on the midrange. Personally I work quicker that way.
Old 18th June 2020
  #8
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4 Reviews written
🎧 10 years
I have a pair of these but they are custom Horizontal, not vertical. Speakers are personal preference I guess. These speakers are ridiculously flat and sometimes can sound boring. The MM's can deceptively make everything sound good at first, After you use them for a while you can hear how hard they make you work in a mixing environment to really get the EQ or levels right. I think argument here is that, if you have ever used a pair of Adams, or a more mid range speaker like that you'll understand the difference in mixing "sound". There is something unique about a midrange speaker that somehow lets you hear things that occasionally these really expensive speakers takes a trained ear to understand. That being said, I still get good mixes on the MM's and its nice to turn them up and feel the full force if needed. That was the one thing I disliked about my Klein hummels, they puked when the volume was medium or slightly higher.

If you are just mixing the Nuemann or Adam type speakers are pretty nice to work with.
Old 18th June 2020 | Show parent
  #9
Gear Head
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Razik ➡️
I use them every day for mastering and I had great results when I used them for mixing. Last year I upgraded the tweeters to seas millennium and the other drivers to paper and they sound incredible.
Can you tell me more about the MM5X mod please? Technically and sonically...

It's my second room with this speakers and i have a dip between 100 and 200 Hz with all the room.
This room are very similar on size and material so i don't know if the dip come from the speakers or the room...

Thanks!
Old 18th June 2020 | Show parent
  #10
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1 Review written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cassar Audio Lab ➡️
Can you tell me more about the MM5X mod please? Technically and sonically...

It's my second room with this speakers and i have a dip between 100 and 200 Hz with all the room.
This room are very similar on size and material so i don't know if the dip come from the speakers or the room...

Thanks!
Google "Floor Bounce"
Old 19th June 2020 | Show parent
  #11
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Razik's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cassar Audio Lab ➡️
Can you tell me more about the MM5X mod please? Technically and sonically...

It's my second room with this speakers and i have a dip between 100 and 200 Hz with all the room.
This room are very similar on size and material so i don't know if the dip come from the speakers or the room...

Thanks!
The drivers that I used are made by the same manufacturer, same size as the stock and they fit perfectly, RS180P-8 for 7" and RS270P-8A for 10". The only difference is that these are paper cones instead of aluminum (stock). However, I installed two 4 Ohm 20W resistor on each 7" cone to recess the mids. I have also replaced the tweeters with seas millennium and the stock 5 Ohm resistor on the tweeters with 8 Ohm. I kept the same crossover and I did not have to replace it per Tyler. Now the mids are not pronounced as they were with the stock cones and they sound much better and smother. If you are buying a new set, I am sure that Tyler can build yours the exactly the same way. It will probably just cost you a bit more for the upgrade.

Below is the link to the measurement of the MM5X in the room with the help of VENU360 that I use to address some issues that I have within the room.
https://we.tl/t-YVLGCnJ5DZ

I hope this helps!

Last edited by Razik; 20th June 2020 at 12:14 AM..
Old 20th June 2020 | Show parent
  #12
Gear Head
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruairi ➡️
Google "Floor Bounce"
Yes you're right, the wood floor, that's i was suspected also...

Thanks.
Old 20th June 2020 | Show parent
  #13
Gear Head
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Razik ➡️
The drivers that I used are made by the same manufacturer, same size as the stock and they fit perfectly, RS180P-8 for 7" and RS270P-8A for 10". The only difference is that these are paper cones instead of aluminum (stock). However, I installed two 4 Ohm 20W resistor on each 7" cone to recess the mids. I have also replaced the tweeters with seas millennium and the stock 5 Ohm resistor on the tweeters with 8 Ohm. I kept the same crossover and I did not have to replace it per Tyler. Now the mids are not pronounced as they were with the stock cones and they sound much better and smother. If you are buying a new set, I am sure that Tyler can build yours the exactly the same way. It will probably just cost you a bit more for the upgrade.

Below is the link to the measurement of the MM5X in the room with the help of VENU360 that I use to address some issues that I have within the room.
https://we.tl/t-YVLGCnJ5DZ

I hope this helps!
Thanks for this detailled informations!
Old 20th June 2020 | Show parent
  #14
DAH
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Razik ➡️
The drivers that I used are made by the same manufacturer, same size as the stock and they fit perfectly, RS180P-8 for 7" and RS270P-8A for 10". The only difference is that these are paper cones instead of aluminum (stock). However, I installed two 4 Ohm 20W resistor on each 7" cone to recess the mids. I have also replaced the tweeters with seas millennium and the stock 5 Ohm resistor on the tweeters with 8 Ohm. I kept the same crossover and I did not have to replace it per Tyler. Now the mids are not pronounced as they were with the stock cones and they sound much better and smother. If you are buying a new set, I am sure that Tyler can build yours the exactly the same way. It will probably just cost you a bit more for the upgrade.

Below is the link to the measurement of the MM5X in the room with the help of VENU360 that I use to address some issues that I have within the room.
https://we.tl/t-YVLGCnJ5DZ

I hope this helps!
What sub?
Old 20th June 2020 | Show parent
  #15
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Razik's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by DAH ➡️
What sub?
The MM5X are three way speakers the specs are 26-20k at 8 Ohm, but in my room they go down to 22 Hz, so I don't need to add a sub.

One think that I would like to point out to anyone who's ordering a new set, is to ask Tyler to build the stand for the speakers to your specifications as the standard stand that comes with them will put the tweeters way below the ear level if you are working from a console.
Old 20th June 2020 | Show parent
  #16
DAH
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Razik ➡️
The MM5X are three way speakers the specs are 26-20k at 8 Ohm, but in my room they go down to 22 Hz, so I don't need to add a sub.

One think that I would like to point out to anyone who's ordering a new set, is to ask Tyler to build the stand for the speakers to your specifications as the standard stand that comes with them will put the tweeters way below the ear level if you are working from a console.
Nice then, impressive. does the DSP do a lot of work below 400 Hz? Thanks for sharing the graph.
Old 21st June 2020 | Show parent
  #17
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Razik's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by DAH ➡️
Nice then, impressive. does the DSP do a lot of work below 400 Hz? Thanks for sharing the graph.
My room is well treated, but I had some peaks from 1k to 400 Hz that I had to fix with the VENU360. The VENU360 has an auto EQ plus an additional 8 bands Eq, see below the video by someone else for PA2 that does almost the same thing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uAEtrYNPByM
Old 22nd June 2020
  #18
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Thanks to everyone who shared on this thread. Got some useful info.
Roi
Old 22nd August 2020
  #19
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3 Reviews written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by nick b ➡️
I love my mm5x’s for mastering...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Razik ➡️
I use them every day for mastering...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Strobian ➡️
I have a pair of these...
Hey Guys,

I'm considering replacing my B&W Matrix 802 S2s with Tyler MM5Xs.

Anyone have insight on how they compare?

I've been using the 802s for about a year and clients have been really happy, but I'm feeling like the 802 midrange character is a little unusual and the high end is a bit harsh.
Every time I switch from the 802s to my familiar old Genelecs it takes my brain a couple minutes to reorient. Different worlds.
The 802s measure flat enough in my room yet the tone is colored in a way that has me thinking about alternatives.
MM5X looks attractive but I've never heard them myself so I'd be taking a leap of faith.

Any opinions are welcome. Thanks!
Old 22nd August 2020 | Show parent
  #20
Gear Head
 
nick b's Avatar
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trakworx ➡️
Hey Guys,

I'm considering replacing my B&W Matrix 802 S2s with Tyler MM5Xs.

Anyone have insight on how they compare?

I've been using the 802s for about a year and clients have been really happy, but I'm feeling like the 802 midrange character is a little unusual and the high end is a bit harsh.
Every time I switch from the 802s to my familiar old Genelecs it takes my brain a couple minutes to reorient. Different worlds.
The 802s measure flat enough in my room yet the tone is colored in a way that has me thinking about alternatives.
MM5X looks attractive but I've never heard them myself so I'd be taking a leap of faith.

Any opinions are welcome. Thanks!

I’m very happy with my MM5Xs. No plans to upgrade unless my business really leaps and I can afford / justify Kiis.

I didn’t test speakers extensively like I probably should have, but am happy with where I landed. The translation is much improved from my barefoots, and I think the highs are more natural than the nautilus 803s I demo’d.

Mine are completely stock (except for the isolate it pads I mentioned before). I also recently added a trinnov system which really helped translation and clarity, mostly due to my weird room.

Ty was very pleasant to work with and his turnaround was short- 3 weeks I believe from purchase to arriving in New Jersey. I’d recommend, especially if your budget is sub-$10k.
Old 23rd August 2020 | Show parent
  #21
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Verified Member
1 Review written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trakworx ➡️
Hey Guys,

I'm considering replacing my B&W Matrix 802 S2s with Tyler MM5Xs.

Anyone have insight on how they compare?

I've been using the 802s for about a year and clients have been really happy, but I'm feeling like the 802 midrange character is a little unusual and the high end is a bit harsh.
Every time I switch from the 802s to my familiar old Genelecs it takes my brain a couple minutes to reorient. Different worlds.
The 802s measure flat enough in my room yet the tone is colored in a way that has me thinking about alternatives.
MM5X looks attractive but I've never heard them myself so I'd be taking a leap of faith.

Any opinions are welcome. Thanks!
Hey Trak,

Disclosure - I worked part time for PMC for 10 years commissioning big rigs (Trent Reznor, Skrillex, Capitol, Diplo, Blink 182, Neil Young, Timbaland, Dr Luke etc etc).

Despite my past work with PMC I am not wedded to the brand, I have heard/tuned many good systems and use ATCs daily in a Northward room and like them, have used and liked Grimm and Kii, B&W at the old Sterling rooms etc etc.

I've only heard two sets of Tylers ever. I don't know the model numbers but both were large WMTMW designs. One set was in a very poor John Brandt designed room and it was in 10 years in LA and literally thousands of studios, the worst "pro" speaker I have ever heard. As bad as the room was replaced the rig with PMCs and the room became workable. Side by side comparison with the Tylers was baffling.

The other set was in an excellent room, I was able to verify using speakers I know well. Again, the Tylers were just shockingly bad in every respect.

Bad luck? Definitely possible. But be sure you can demo before committing.
Old 23rd August 2020 | Show parent
  #22
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Razik's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trakworx ➡️
Hey Guys,

I'm considering replacing my B&W Matrix 802 S2s with Tyler MM5Xs.

Anyone have insight on how they compare?

I've been using the 802s for about a year and clients have been really happy, but I'm feeling like the 802 midrange character is a little unusual and the high end is a bit harsh.
Every time I switch from the 802s to my familiar old Genelecs it takes my brain a couple minutes to reorient. Different worlds.
The 802s measure flat enough in my room yet the tone is colored in a way that has me thinking about alternatives.
MM5X looks attractive but I've never heard them myself so I'd be taking a leap of faith.

Any opinions are welcome. Thanks!
Before the mod that I did, the mids on the MM5X were very pronounced and forwarded as well. I believe that is due to the very solid wood the cabinets are made from. I understand why some people might found them to be strange because they don't have that smiley curve. However, they sound very natural and pleasing now. Flat mids, no harshness, very good representation of the low frequencies and the sub extends to 22Hz in my room. Plus they translate great and the clients are very happy. I will be replacing the Emotiiva XPA-2 amplifier with Parasound A21 in the near future and see if anything will change. Statinski mastering had MM5X's without the mod that I did, but he replaced them recently with B&W 800D.
Old 23rd August 2020 | Show parent
  #23
Gear Head
 
nick b's Avatar
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Razik ➡️
Before the mod that I did, the mids on the MM5X were very pronounced and forwarded as well. I believe that is due to the very solid wood the cabinets are made from. I understand why some people might found them to be strange because they don't have that smiley curve. However, they sound very natural and pleasing now. Flat mids, no harshness, very good representation of the low frequencies and the sub extends to 22Hz in my room. Plus they translate great and the clients are very happy. I will be replacing the Emotiiva XPA-2 amplifier with Parasound A21 in the near future and see if anything will change. Statinski mastering had MM5X's without the mod that I did, but he replaced them recently with B&W 800D.
Highly recommend the a21 with the MM5Xs. I have the a23+ which sounds fantastic but I do wish I had a little more headroom. I’ve been considering adding a class d amp to handle the LF drivers, maybe lessening the load on the parasound.

In terms of forward mids, I haven’t noticed that with mine. But I’m still very intrigued by the mod.
Old 23rd August 2020 | Show parent
  #24
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scraggs's Avatar
 
4 Reviews written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trakworx ➡️
Hey Guys,
I'm considering replacing my B&W Matrix 802 S2s with Tyler MM5Xs.
Never heard the Tylers so I can't comment on them, but the Matrix series is pretty old tech. Years ago, TW Walsh brought his pair of Matrix 805s over to my place and we a/b'd with my newer 805S. The differences were obvious, mine had a flatter midrange (the Matrix seemed to have a gentle, wide boost around 500), more extended low and high ends, better imaging, just better in general.

Pretty sure there'd be a similar difference between the Matrix 802 and the later Nautilus series, and I think you can find those used for a pretty reasonable price, if it was me that's where I'd be looking.

FWIW I've never found the top on my B+W's harsh at all. They certainly reveal harsh high end if it's there, but nice top always sounds nice.
Old 24th August 2020 | Show parent
  #25
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Verified Member
3 Reviews written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by scraggs ➡️
FWIW I've never found the top on my B+W's harsh at all. They certainly reveal harsh high end if it's there, but nice top always sounds nice.
Yeah, there's merit in the notion that bright monitors help prevent over-bright masters. I think the 802s make me work harder on the top end which is a good thing. The downside is ear fatigue.

FWIW, old tech or not, the imaging on the Matrix 802 S2s is stunning, the transients are vivid and the punch is kind of unbelievable. I think I'm probably best off sticking with what I have and playing with the placement/angling a little more. Dropping 4K on monitors I've never heard seems a bit risky...

Thanks!
Old 31st August 2020 | Show parent
  #26
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Strobian's Avatar
 
4 Reviews written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trakworx ➡️
Hey Guys,

I'm considering replacing my B&W Matrix 802 S2s with Tyler MM5Xs.

Anyone have insight on how they compare?

I've been using the 802s for about a year and clients have been really happy, but I'm feeling like the 802 midrange character is a little unusual and the high end is a bit harsh.
Every time I switch from the 802s to my familiar old Genelecs it takes my brain a couple minutes to reorient. Different worlds.
The 802s measure flat enough in my room yet the tone is colored in a way that has me thinking about alternatives.
MM5X looks attractive but I've never heard them myself so I'd be taking a leap of faith.

Any opinions are welcome. Thanks!

I have had a lot of speakers over the years. I have a B&W home theater system and I have always liked them. The Tylers are flat, but not soft like others I've tried. They are not my favorite listening speaker, but they do make you work a little harder to get the overall right. Its hard to tell someone switch to these, if you have been using something with great results for so many years. I think the frequency range is the most attractive at the price point. If you listen to a bunch of reference material on them and then use them in a studio application, I can't see why you wouldnt be able to get good results. They are not a hyped speaker at all, even flatter sounding to me than the original K&H speakers I used to have. I think some people will love that while others can't figure out why the bass doesn't jump out at them.
Old 27th March 2021 | Show parent
  #27
Gear Maniac
 
AudioKemestry's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trakworx ➡️
Hey Guys,

I'm considering replacing my B&W Matrix 802 S2s with Tyler MM5Xs.

Anyone have insight on how they compare?

I've been using the 802s for about a year and clients have been really happy, but I'm feeling like the 802 midrange character is a little unusual and the high end is a bit harsh.
Every time I switch from the 802s to my familiar old Genelecs it takes my brain a couple minutes to reorient. Different worlds.
The 802s measure flat enough in my room yet the tone is colored in a way that has me thinking about alternatives.
MM5X looks attractive but I've never heard them myself so I'd be taking a leap of faith.

Any opinions are welcome. Thanks!
Hey Justin did you ever get a pair of MM5Xs, or did you end up sticking with the 802s (or went in an entirely different direction)? [Looking to upgrade my monitors soon and the MM5Xs are on the list...along with a few other active monitors]. Thx
Old 27th March 2021 | Show parent
  #28
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Verified Member
3 Reviews written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by AudioKemestry ➡️
Hey Justin did you ever get a pair of MM5Xs, or did you end up sticking with the 802s (or went in an entirely different direction)? [Looking to upgrade my monitors soon and the MM5Xs are on the list...along with a few other active monitors]. Thx
I stuck with the 802s. I still have never heard the MM5Xs. Best of luck with your upgrade!
Old 28th March 2021
  #29
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thermos's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 15 years
Still selling mine if anyone is looking in the nyc area. I used them with an adcom gfa 555 modded by Jim Williams (also for sale).
Old 28th March 2021 | Show parent
  #30
Gear Head
 
nick b's Avatar
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by thermos ➡️
Still selling mine if anyone is looking in the nyc area. I used them with an adcom gfa 555 modded by Jim Williams (also for sale).
Hey, if you don’t mind me asking, why’d you decide to sell? And what are you using instead?
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