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SM7B set-up
Old 18th September 2012 | Show parent
  #31
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🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenny Gioia ➡️
Who was dissing "people"?

Thanks to Mitt Romney I know that corporations are people but was unaware that microphones were as well.
I'm sorry but I'm not a native speaker of the English language so feel free to substitute 'folks' for the above term in question.

I was responding to Newton in Orbit who's post I found to be very arrogant and pointless.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenny Gioia ➡️
YMMV has been used many times in this thread.
Unfortunately not by you.
Old 18th September 2012 | Show parent
  #32
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🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by doorknocker ➡️
Maybe you DO need to treat your room (Kidding and hiding......... )

My experience is the polar opposite. With the SM7b I tend to use little EQ but it does that it well when needed.

Even though any good preamp will do, my faves for the SM7b are the Chandler LTD-1 and the UA 2108. Being able to drive the preamp a little (for euphonic response rather than actual distortion) has a lot to do with my LOVE for the SM7b. You just can't do that with Mackie-type preamps.
I think it's important to realize that we're all shooting at different targets here.

If you enjoy that mic with very little EQ than we definitely have different sensibilities.

Notice I said "different". Mine are no better. I just don't think we should have an issue with 10% of the forum not liking something. I just state my opinion so when someone buys this mic and hates it they could say "Maybe it's not just me. Kenny Gioia hates this mic too."
Old 18th September 2012 | Show parent
  #33
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🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by chk23 ➡️
Well as he/she already made his/her choice and was asking about how his/her (man, this gender neutral talk is annoying ) preamp setup performing together with the SM7b this thread is afaik not about what alternatives are out there...
Is that really what this thread is about? I thought the mic was the variable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by chk23 ➡️
You can do what you want in this forum, as long as it's not abusive,
Was I abusive? I thought I was being blunt. And honest.

Quote:
Originally Posted by chk23 ➡️
OK, agreed, your later comments in this thread clarified what you meant, while your first post was a bit provocative without offering much explanation, so maybe that's why I felt the need to comment it
Agreed. All is well in the GS jungle.
Old 18th September 2012
  #34
Here for the gear
 
🎧 5 years
I have read every reply and the only post I have seen mentioning or suggesting another mic is about an SM57.

My suggestion would be to constructively suggest another mic for this poor guy to audition against an SM57 and SM7b.

My suggestion would be to try a KSM32, which is in a similar price range to the one suggested. $300 second hand from GS classifieds approx.
Old 18th September 2012 | Show parent
  #35
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🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenny Gioia ➡️

YMMV has been used many times in this thread.
Quote:
Originally Posted by doorknocker ➡️

Unfortunately not by you.
How is this NOT YMMV?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenny Gioia ➡️
You shouldn't trust either of our opinions. You should try the mic yourself and draw your own conclusions.

Just because it works for Bruce, doesn't mean it will work for you.

Just because it doesn't work for me, doesn't mean it won't work for you.

Just make sure you buy with a good return policy.
Old 18th September 2012 | Show parent
  #36
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1 Review written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenny Gioia ➡️
I think it's important to realize that we're all shooting at different targets here.

If you enjoy that mic with very little EQ than we definitely have different sensibilities.

Notice I said "different". Mine are no better. I just don't think we should have an issue with 10% of the forum not liking something. I just state my opinion so when someone buys this mic and hates it they could say "Maybe it's not just me. Kenny Gioia hates this mic too."
Fair enough.

But I don't think that I ever 'hated' a mic I owned even though I came close to it with the Rode NTK. Some I found way more useful than others. I have no problem admitting that I changed my mind on quite a few pieces of gear over the years. Had a MD 441 lying around for years wondering 'what's the fuss about' because it sounded dull and flat on anything I tried it on.

Of course, it's one of my faves since about 2 months which may very well be due to more experience, a better sounding room or just the way the stars align. Big deal.

While I never had success with the 57 on vocals I never would diss that mic because I love it on so many other sources and know that so many great vocals were recorded with a 57. Two words: Paul Rodgers.

Genre certainly has a lot to do with it. Somebody doing mainstream modern rock or metal might hear things very differently than somebody trying to blend the Byrds and the Clash (hey, that's been on my mind lately).

YMMV (I'll say it once more just to annoy you ).

What bugs me a bit is the assumptions that 'folks' only love the SM7b due to GS or Michael Jackson hype or mere lack of experience.

I would love to own a U47 but I most definitely would keep my two SM7bs. In fact I wouldn't mind having a third one.
Old 18th September 2012 | Show parent
  #37
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🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenny Gioia ➡️
Was I abusive? I thought I was being blunt. And honest.
Off course you were not - maybe I was unclear. Just wanted to narrow my "you can do what you want" because in fact you can't, at least without being banned.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenny Gioia ➡️
Agreed. All is well in the GS jungle.
Old 18th September 2012 | Show parent
  #38
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🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by doorknocker ➡️

But I don't think that I ever 'hated' a mic
I don't usually hate gear. If it does nothing for me (Langevin ELOP) I send it back and forget about it. But when many people use a mic that makes your job (as a mixer) 20X harder than it needs to be, a hatred starts to grow. And you try to change the trend.

Quote:
Originally Posted by doorknocker ➡️
What bugs me a bit is the assumptions that 'folks' only love the SM7b due to GS or Michael Jackson hype or mere lack of experience.
Am I assuming that or are you assuming I assume that?

No doubt the success of this mic is based on hype. No one has time try out every vocal mic out there so people narrow the choices based on popularity and price. I'm trying to combat that. Just to annoy you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by doorknocker ➡️
I would love to own a U47 but I most definitely would keep my two SM7bs. In fact I wouldn't mind having a third one.
I wouldn't mind having one around as well. So I could stomp on it while I'm mixing vocals.
Old 18th September 2012 | Show parent
  #39
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Assuming that MJ really did use a SM7 on 'Thriller' well, according to Kenny and others here he (along with his engineer) would have made an uninformed choice.

Since the SM7b will make it so hard to mix a vocal, then I would certainly assume that an engineer who's also mixing what he recorded (remember those?) would be a masochist.
Old 18th September 2012 | Show parent
  #40
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🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by doorknocker ➡️
Assuming that MJ really did use a SM7 on 'Thriller' well, according to Kenny and others here he (along with his engineer) would have made an uninformed choice.
If that's what I said, why would you need to repeat it?

I love it when people try to summarize other people's posts.

As if everyone else reading this is too dumb to figure it out for themselves.

Your logical fallacy is strawman

By exaggerating, misrepresenting, or just completely fabricating someone's argument, it's much easier to present your own position as being reasonable or valid. This kind of dishonesty not only undermines rational discourse, it also harms one's own position because it brings your credibility into question - if you're willing to misrepresent your opponent's argument in the negative, might you also be willing to exaggerate your own in the positive?
Old 18th September 2012 | Show parent
  #41
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doorknocker's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenny Gioia ➡️
If that's what I said, why would you need to repeat it?

I love it when people try to summarize other people's posts.

As if everyone else reading this is too dumb to figure it out for themselves.

Your logical fallacy is strawman

By exaggerating, misrepresenting, or just completely fabricating someone's argument, it's much easier to present your own position as being reasonable or valid. This kind of dishonesty not only undermines rational discourse, it also harms one's own position because it brings your credibility into question - if you're willing to misrepresent your opponent's argument in the negative, might you also be willing to exaggerate your own in the positive?
I understand.

You are right as always.

Have a nice day.
Old 18th September 2012 | Show parent
  #42
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🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by doorknocker ➡️
I understand.

You are right as always.

Have a nice day.
I'm not always right. I have an opinion. I don't like this mic.

But I can do that without calling Bruce Swedan "uninformed".

He (like many engineers) simply has different taste than I.

And if I wasn't a mixer, I really wouldn't care what others use, but being that I spend a good portion of my life mixing, I wish engineers would use this mic less.

Have a great day as well.
Old 18th September 2012
  #43
Here for the gear
 
🎧 5 years
I go to college for a few hours and come back to see you guys arguing over absolutely nothing.

For mics I have a $350 budget, that is all. I would never buy another dynamic unless it was an sm7 as I've heard they do well in poorly treated rooms.

I simply asked if my setup would give me good sound and instead I got a forum full of team Jacob vs team Edward. GROW UP!

Oh and thanks to all of you for sharing your experiences with the mic. : )
Old 18th September 2012 | Show parent
  #44
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🎧 5 years
Honestly, man. Get a decent preamp and the sm7. You can make great, great vocal recordings with that combo. Just give the mic a few inches of space so you don't mud it up too much with proximity effect. Use the low-cut filter as well. For an untreated room, you can't beat this mic.
Old 18th September 2012 | Show parent
  #45
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🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by jrghetto602 ➡️

For mics I have a $350 budget, that is all. I would never buy another dynamic unless it was an sm7 as I've heard they do well in poorly treated rooms.
You would do well to trust your ears rather than what you read on forums.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jrghetto602 ➡️
I simply asked if my setup would give me good sound and instead I got a forum full of team Jacob vs team Edward. GROW UP!
OK. No. It won't.

Old 18th September 2012 | Show parent
  #46
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🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by guitarboy94 ➡️
For an untreated room, you can't beat this mic.
Good point. My issue was using it for vocals but if you're going to use it to record an untreated room, it might be great.

Alright. Enuff of me.



Enjoy.
Old 18th September 2012 | Show parent
  #47
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1 Review written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by jrghetto602 ➡️
For mics I have a $350 budget, that is all. I would never buy another dynamic unless it was an sm7 as I've heard they do well in poorly treated rooms.
No.

The SM7b is no magic weapon to bad room ambience, far from it.

While this mic has very good side rejection, the fact that you need a lot of gain level means that potential noise/traffic/unwanted room reflection will also be amplified.

Why are you so set on the SM7b? If the room is really bad then a 57 or 58 that you can also use live, etc may be a much better (and cheaper) investment.
Old 18th September 2012 | Show parent
  #48
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenny Gioia ➡️
So it's OK to mention that Michael Jackson and Bruce Sweden use it but it's not OK to mention a 47? Gotcha.

I'm sorry. I don't have that many sub $500 microphone stories.

I did say that I preferred the 57 to the SM7b. YMMV
I thought I did. Bruce Sweden chose the sm7 over a u47 on the King of pop. What's good enough for Michael, is good enough for me.
Old 18th September 2012 | Show parent
  #49
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🎧 5 years
Actually, the mic has extremely low output. All cranking the gain does is match the output level to any other mic. -10 db going into a computer from a super dose of preamp gain on an Sm7b is exactly the same as -10db coming out out of preamp on a high output condenser mic (provided you're using a good clean preamp on the sm7b). All db's are created equal, regarless of whatever gain it takes to get to that level. The SM7b has amazing room rejection, about as good as it gets for a mic. I've tried them all. What I like best about the SM7b is the big, fat dry vocal it produces. That vocal is like modeling clay. You do whatever you want with it at that point. I've yet to get that sort of fat, dryness out of a condenser. Maybe I'd feel different about condensers if I had a super dry soundbooth to record from. Until then, SM7b or other high end dynamics are king when it comes to tracking in untreated rooms.

Quote:
Originally Posted by doorknocker ➡️
No.

The SM7b is no magic weapon to bad room ambience, far from it.

While this mic has very good side rejection, the fact that you need a lot of gain level means that potential noise/traffic/unwanted room reflection will also be amplified.

Why are you so set on the SM7b? If the room is really bad then a 57 or 58 that you can also use live, etc may be a much better (and cheaper) investment.
Old 18th September 2012 | Show parent
  #50
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🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bradahman ➡️
What's good enough for Michael, is good enough for me.
Old 18th September 2012
  #51
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jrod9900's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Whatta thread. Intense... lol

JROD
Old 18th September 2012
  #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guitarboy94 ➡️
Actually, the mic has extremely low output. All cranking the gain does is match the output level to any other mic. -10 db going into a computer from a super dose of preamp gain on an Sm7b is exactly the same as -10db coming out out of preamp on a high output condenser mic (provided you're using a good clean preamp on the sm7b). All db's are created equal, regarless of whatever gain it takes to get to that level. The SM7b has amazing room rejection, about as good as it gets for a mic. I've tried them all. What I like best about the SM7b is the big, fat dry vocal it produces. That vocal is like modeling clay. You do whatever you want with it at that point. I've yet to get that sort of fat, dryness out of a condenser. Maybe I'd feel different about condensers if I had a super dry soundbooth to record from. Until then, SM7b or other high end dynamics are king when it comes to tracking in untreated rooms.
.... Unless you really crank it, and turn down the trim, right?
Old 18th September 2012
  #53
Here for the gear
 
🎧 5 years
I agree my ears are 10x better than the forums I used to find clips to use my ears to. -___-

I didn't choose the mic because it looks cool or "the thriller album was made with it"! I chose it because it sounded good and was highly praised while also being reasonably priced.

Now a lot of you say it sucked with your vocals and I take that into consideration but what does your voice have to do with me. Are you recording pop vocals or hip hop vocals?

What I'm asking is, if YOU hate the mic, why would I?
Old 18th September 2012 | Show parent
  #54
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🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by king2070lplaya ➡️
.... Unless you really crank it, and turn down the trim, right?
No. guitarboy94 has it correct.

The only way you'll get more ambience from a bad room is if the signal (the voice) is low and you have to crank the preamp to adjust that.

How hot the mic is will only be an issue with a noisy mic preamp but will not be affected by the room as the signal to noise (voice to ambience) will be consistent.
Old 18th September 2012 | Show parent
  #55
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenny Gioia ➡️
No. guitarboy94 has it correct.

The only way you'll get more ambience from a bad room is if the signal (the voice) is low and you have to crank the preamp to adjust that.

How hot the mic is will only be an issue with a noisy mic preamp but will not be affected by the room as the signal to noise (voice to ambience) will be consistent.
I can confirm that - I have a not very well treated room with two big windows that don't keep out the noise from the street below completely. And while some of my condensers pick up the coughs of the mice in neighbours basement, the SM7b is very insensitive to ambient noise, even with my preamp cranked up to max.
Old 18th September 2012 | Show parent
  #56
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🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by jrghetto602 ➡️

I didn't choose the mic because it looks cool or "the thriller album was made with it"! I chose it because it sounded good and was highly praised while also being reasonably priced.
If it "sounded good" to you that would mean you've already tried it.

So why are you asking us this:

Quote:
Originally Posted by jrghetto602 ➡️

Basically I'm wondering if this cheap set up will give off decent sound?
Quote:
Originally Posted by jrghetto602 ➡️
Now a lot of you say it sucked with your vocals and I take that into consideration but what does your voice have to do with me?
Nothing. Did you want to only hear from the engineers who have worked with you?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jrghetto602 ➡️
Are you recording pop vocals or hip hop vocals?
Pop and rock vocals.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jrghetto602 ➡️
What I'm asking is, if YOU hate the mic, why would I?
I have no idea. It's just my opinion. YMMV.
Old 18th September 2012 | Show parent
  #57
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🎧 15 years
I always ask the talent's opinion when doing vocals. Many times we start out with a SM7b and come back to it or sometimes don't even try other mics because it works great from the get-go.

There's no point in endless shootouts when things are rolling. And that's why I usually start out with the SM7b (LTD-1 and LA-3A are my other vocal go-tos) It always gives at least decent results. If the singer isn't too great then trying other mics is partly a way of trying to get better takes, looser vocal chords, etc.

So it's not only that I often prefer the SM7b but it's also the vocalists that think so and to me that's important. if a singer is happy with the sound then there's a high chance of getting a good performance.
Old 18th September 2012
  #58
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Sorry, I misread the intent: I supposed the talk about cranking the gain of a preamp was in regards to overdriving the amp for color. Yes, a mics sound is always a consistent balance dry and wet.
Old 19th September 2012 | Show parent
  #59
Here for the gear
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenny Gioia ➡️
If it "sounded good" to you that would mean you've already tried it.

So why are you asking us this:
Um...Im asking about the setup.....

Everyone usually has a very different setup. Some people use Blue icicles to power their mics while some use ISA Ones and PCI interfaces. I have heard the mic on other peoples voices doing pop vocals and it sounded amazing. Unfortunately i didnt know what setup they had. Not trying to be rude but did you even read the first post of this thread?(I know my second post seemed more about the mic than the setup)

I am trying to figure out if the GAP Pre73 partnered with the ART Dual Pre USB would give me enough output and still give me good audio quality.

As always thanks for all of you guy's opinion!
Old 19th September 2012 | Show parent
  #60
Gear Guru
 
Kenny Gioia's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
I'm not taking it as rude.

Here's what you wrote:

Quote:
Originally Posted by jrghetto602 ➡️
I really want a SM7b and I see in order to get one I am going to have to weaken the wallet.

Basically I'm wondering if this cheap set up will give off decent sound?

SM7B > gap pre73 mk2 > art dual pre USB > computer/reaper.
I read that as you already have the other pieces and you wanted to add the SM7b. So I thought that was the variable so that's what I commented on.

My apologies if I misunderstood.

I'd still recommend trying a few others in the same price range.
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