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Mics Don't Excite Me
Old 29th March 2021
  #331
Here for the gear
 
umbral's Avatar
 
help...

Quote:
Originally Posted by rorohello ➡️
As someone who has dabbled for years but has just come into the opportunity to have a room that is properly treated and some nice middle of the road gear, I have to say that microphones are the least exciting part of all of this.

When I listen to shootouts on vintage king or on this forum... I honestly cannot hear a single difference between Mic's that cost $10,000 and something like a Miktek.

Why isn't there more discussion about this on this forum?

It seems idiotic to spend more than $1500 to $3k all in on mics.

If I plug an old AKG dynamic into the Chandler germanium preamp, it will make anything sound like gold... And again one Miktek (CV4 or 3) has you covered for LDC
Can you help me with this one topic ?
Everyone, i need some info and suggestions from people with knowledge.

Thank you very much !

Rational List of Good Microphones 34mm LDC or smaller / Ribbon / Tube for Vocal in Home Recording !!
Old 29th March 2021
  #332
Gear Addict
 
Classic's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
I can see where just a standard mic shootout with no additional processing (just preamp in the chain) can seem kinda samey.

The money is really in how well a mic can handle the mixing process (commercially-speaking “squashed”).
Old 31st March 2021 | Show parent
  #333
Gear Head
 
🎧 10 years
This whole site is about gear. If you’re not interested in that, why are you here?
Old 1st April 2021 | Show parent
  #334
Gear Nut
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by troxelj ➡️
This whole site is about gear. If you’re not interested in that, why are you here?
Who says you have to like it all?
Is that a rule?
Old 1st April 2021
  #335
Lives for gear
It's a long and sometimes stupid thread but the OP eventually admitted that the title and start of this was all simply about getting attention.

As this is the 335th post here it certainly accomplished that goal.

There is some good info and discussion by a number of people here in spite of the original trollish intent that was eventually walked back on by the OP when called on it.
Old 4 weeks ago | Show parent
  #336
Gear Maniac
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JLast ➡️
It's a long and sometimes stupid thread but the OP eventually admitted that the title and start of this was all simply about getting attention.

As this is the 335th post here it certainly accomplished that goal.

There is some good info and discussion by a number of people here in spite of the original trollish intent that was eventually walked back on by the OP when called on it.
OP still loves you all. Despite your lack of faith, and unwillingness to participate in any kind of meaningful comparisons.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #337
Gear Guru
 
Sounds just like one (or two-or three) of my ex-girlfriends.
Usually mad at me, or mad about me.

Sometimes at the same time.
Downright scary, but occasionally exciting!
Chris
Old 4 weeks ago | Show parent
  #338
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by rorohello ➡️
OP still loves you all. Despite your lack of faith, and unwillingness to participate in any kind of meaningful comparisons.
A lack of faith in someone who who starts off a conversation on a recording forum claiming that "mics don't excite them" I'd say is pretty reasonable.

Actually I think I have "contributed" a bunch to this discussion. You might want to reread my posts here.

I'm excited by all kinds of mics but frequently promote the use of dynamic mics and am probably one of the biggest defenders of the SM57 that you will find which actually makes me a supporter of some of your claims here.
Old 4 weeks ago | Show parent
  #339
Gear Maniac
 
Which is why I still love you Jlast
Old 4 weeks ago | Show parent
  #340
Gear Maniac
 
My SE2200 "Vintage Edition" hasn't shipped yet from Sweetwater :(

And no one is wowing me with sound samples of snare/acoustic guitar with their $10k mics, so I'm still falling in the "unexcited" realm these days.

I ordered an Erica Synths Zen Delay.

I think that will prove to be a far better use of funds than placing it towards a boring old mic!
Old 4 weeks ago | Show parent
  #341
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by rorohello ➡️
Which is why I still love you Jlast
I certainly won't be getting rid of my 57's or my 545 but hopefully you will still love me if I buy an expensive condenser mic.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #342
Gear Addict
 
🎧 5 years
Wait -

so a vintage Bentley is not 300.000 EUR better / faster / more comfortable than a Volkswagen Beetle? Also has 4 wheels ony, one steering wheel, and it does actually need a similar time to get where you want? Perhaps it is even slower?
It is just that you like the wood on the dashboard, the smell of fine leather on the seats, the idea that someone you atmire has the same car, the way people on the pavement look at you? The idea someone famous has been driving with exactly this car you own?

wow. Great news.
Old 3 weeks ago | Show parent
  #343
Quote:
Originally Posted by rorohello ➡️
Sorry that's an ISA Two!! Crap I'm not making a good impression here...

What I was trying to stimulate debate about was more shootouts between "classic" mics and newer cost effective stuff.

I thought that there would be way more...but it seems like maybe the old established brands pull weight here and don't want these shootouts done.
i don’t think it’s that

it’s more likely that for those most likely to spend on a nicer mic online shootouts are not factoring significantly into their decision making.

Mics aren’t really* exciting, but they fill a need. You may find that some mics do a better job than others for certain applications, subjectively speaking. If everything you are recording sounds great then you don’t need anything.

*What a pair of coles does to the low midrange on a drum kit is a little bit exciting, in a low-mid kind of way.. if you’re into that sort of thing of course
Old 3 weeks ago | Show parent
  #344
Quote:
Originally Posted by rorohello ➡️
You are saying we can't trust shootouts from Vintage King??

I think there are plenty of well established places for shootouts without bias, and as I said earlier...a reason why they don't appear in this forum.

By making a statement like this...or the ever so common "Oh just trust your ears" statement that was made earlier...you are negating the democratization through technology that the Internet affords...which is exactly what people in Low End Theory should be coming here for.

There should be more shootouts...and there is a reason (deep pockets) that they are not happening.
i don’t believe it’s got anything to do with “deep pockets”.

I think what is being communicated is that internet shootouts probably mislead more than they help, by minimizing the importance of the entire rest of the situation, from the chain to the space. Plus no one said there should be fewer, the advice is to take them with a grain of salt. But no one is spending miney to suppress shootouts. Trust me on this
Old 3 weeks ago
  #345
Lives for gear
 
GRiFF's Avatar
 
2 Reviews written
🎧 15 years
I think the OP has this the wrong way round, its not that a mic in and of itself is desirable for its sound, but rather you need a particular mic to capture a source well. As in, if your Shure 57 is a sound you love, then don’t buy anymore mics. If though you have a singer who makes it sound like total gash, you might need a different mic or a mic more suited to that source.
I suggest you might look at a Townsend Sphere to really get a great way to understand what different mics can do in the field. Surprisingly I rarely use the U47 model - which sounds great btw, a singer I an working with happens to sound fantastic through pencil mikes.
So yes, in shootouts mics can be barely indistinguishable from each other, but in use when you can hear how one is clearly improving your talents recording is when mic lust really begins.
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #346
Gear Maniac
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by themiracle ➡️

*What a pair of coles does to the low midrange on a drum kit is a little bit exciting, in a low-mid kind of way.. if you’re into that sort of thing of course
Well...when I listen to all these Nashville guys in their home studios who run the Coles, it doesn't sound any better to me than when I run my Cascade Lundhals with the Berlant tube pres...

So again, not excited.
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #347
Gear Maniac
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by themiracle ➡️
Plus no one said there should be fewer, the advice is to take them with a grain of salt. But no one is spending miney to suppress shootouts. Trust me on this
Ok noted.
Old 2 weeks ago | Show parent
  #348
Gear Maniac
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by GRiFF ➡️
So yes, in shootouts mics can be barely indistinguishable from each other, but in use when you can hear how one is clearly improving your talents recording is when mic lust really begins.
Noted.

And as I stated, I'm really beginning this journey...
Old 1 week ago | Show parent
  #349
Quote:
Originally Posted by rorohello ➡️
Well...when I listen to all these Nashville guys in their home studios who run the Coles, it doesn't sound any better to me than when I run my Cascade Lundhals with the Berlant tube pres...

So again, not excited.
You are under no obligation to be excited my friend.

.. but if you think you can tell the difference a pair of 4038's would make in your room, on your kit (or whatever) as compared to your current chain based on someone's youtube video, there might be something you are just not hearing.

Renting a pair would probably give you a much more informed perspective.

..but as you noted, you are really just beginning this journey, and frankly, it's hard to go too wrong. Get the mics you need to record your sources and get to recording.
Old 1 week ago | Show parent
  #350
Gear Maniac
 
I'm only just starting the journey of having compound interest, and the capability to buy whatever I want.

This (life) experience and thread should actually really be of service to a lot of people in that respect...
Old 1 week ago | Show parent
  #351
Gear Maniac
 
If I rented a matched pair of Coles, and tested against the Cascades through both the modded Berlant tube pres, and the ISA Two, what source would the thread want to hear?

I'm thinking a maple snare (brushes/sticks/rimshots) maybe?

My neighbor here in Petaluma is actually a very experienced tabla player...
Old 1 week ago
  #352
Gear Guru
 
kennybro's Avatar
 
3 Reviews written
🎧 10 years
Mics are just like anything else. You can drop $45,000.00 on an Arri Master Prime, or 600 bucks on a Panasonic Leica DG Summilux. How different do you think the image will be? I can tell you, not as different as you would expect... or hope.
Old 1 week ago | Show parent
  #353
Gear Head
 
Just remember- microphones are never microphones!

They are cars, cameras, camera lenses, kitchen utensils, arrows, snow shovels, hammers, etc.

If you keep that in mind, everything should sound great!

Old 1 week ago | Show parent
  #354
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by BluesTrain ➡️
Just remember- microphones are never microphones!

They are cars, cameras, camera lenses, kitchen utensils, arrows, snow shovels, hammers, etc.

If you keep that in mind, everything should sound great!

Not sure what you are joking at or what the intent of your comment is exactly.

As there are always people that don't yet understand the differences between budget and very expensive mics and also people who will post crap trollish threads like the one we are working with here, analogies are an attempt to help explain what is actually going on.
Old 1 week ago | Show parent
  #355
Gear Head
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JLast ➡️
Not sure what you are joking at or what the intent of your comment is exactly.

As there are always people that don't yet understand the differences between budget and very expensive mics and also people who will post crap trollish threads like the one we are working with here, analogies are an attempt to help explain what is actually going on.
My point is analogies are pointless.

What's the actual value in comparing a microphone to a car? It's not a car. And although analogies and metaphor are artful forms of expression, they will never change the fact that microphones are not, and will never be, anything other than microphones!

The best way to PROVE any theory on microphones is to post some AMAZING sounding audio. Not crappy audio, because ANY MICROPHONE can sound crappy.

And how much AMAZING audio have we heard in service of this thread?



It's like a car...
Old 1 week ago | Show parent
  #356
Gear Head
 
And where do we draw the line with these analogies?

Can a microphone be a piece of wood? Shall I compare thee to a tree? Is this microphone an American Elm and that one a Boxelder?

Shall we compare them to food? This microphone is whipped cream, that one is a steak?

Shall we compare them to places? This microphone is a house in Cleveland, that one is a mansion in Beverley Hills?

And on and on.

Of course, the usual suspects are cars and cameras. I know this, because I have read it many times. Then there's the carpenter with his tools analogy. Or the hunter with the bow. And so on.

In the meantime, where's the KILLER sounding record?
Old 1 week ago | Show parent
  #357
Gear Addict
 
dwpthe3rd's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
Stepping through 12 pages of the thread, did I miss where OP offered a single piece of audio to support any of his comments? Apologies if I missed it.
Old 1 week ago | Show parent
  #358
Gear Nut
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BluesTrain ➡️
My point is analogies are pointless.

What's the actual value in comparing a microphone to a car? It's not a car. And although analogies and metaphor are artful forms of expression, they will never change the fact that microphones are not, and will never be, anything other than microphones!
What they all (cars, cameras, kitchen utensils) have in common is that they are products.
When you are introduced to a tool or product it can be difficult to do a cost/value assessment.

The value in these analogies is an approximation of how to valuate the product.
It helps people to loosely align concepts and make a better assessment than ZERO understanding. Otherwise it underlines the constant that YMMV.

You're just being cranky!
Old 1 week ago | Show parent
  #359
Gear Head
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by in media res ➡️

You're just being cranky!
Guilty as charged!
Old 1 week ago | Show parent
  #360
Gear Nut
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by dwpthe3rd ➡️
Stepping through 12 pages of the thread, did I miss where OP offered a single piece of audio to support any of his comments? Apologies if I missed it.
Without looking back I know OP posted at least two audio clips they recorded.
From what I can tell the problem is that nobody seems to want to participate.

The OP has reiterated several times that in building their new home studio, there has been the least wow factor in selecting microphones.
They have asked if somebody with similar gear and a room of similar size and treatment would be willing to shoot out mics with them.
Am I wrong?

There seem to be enough people watching this thread and taking the opportunity to sh!t on OP, but when they post something like this:
Quote:
Originally Posted by rorohello ➡️
If I rented a matched pair of Coles, and tested against the Cascades through both the modded Berlant tube pres, and the ISA Two, what source would the thread want to hear?

I'm thinking a maple snare (brushes/sticks/rimshots) maybe?

My neighbor here in Petaluma is actually a very experienced tabla player...
...crickets
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