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Help a newbie out! Building live rig for raves
Old 26th June 2022
  #1
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Help a newbie out! Building live rig for raves

I am a complete newbie in terms of live events and live rigs but I love electronic music and I am passionate about organizing/hosingt such events.

I have some savings (6000€) as seed investment and then I plan to reinvest all income from the event to grow it futher. Please help me to start!

The events will be mainly outdoors, the first will be only 50-100 people (coser to 50 than 100). The genre is techno-tech-house, deep house.

My newbie questions:
1. What is better in terms of performance/price (value), building the speakers with my non-existent skills based on plans that I could find online or buying them?

2. Passive speakers are cheaper, but after buying all the necessary amps, are the passive setup still cheaper compared to active?

3. For ourdoor events, where I need to transport assemble/disassemble all the gear all the time, isn't active gear better in terms of durability and time needed for the assembly?

4. I would like a rig that I can upgrade/expand in the future, without selling parts of it. I believe that would be more future proof (but correct me if I am wrong... and likely I am)

My initial plan is something like: two Mackie DRM18S (2x 1300€) and
two Mackie DRM12A (2x 1400€) Total = 5400€

The idea is that the DRM12A is stackable, so I could buy more later as the event grows, just like the two DRM18S. In the future I could buy more, even stack them next or on the top of each other.

If you have any better suggestion in terms of speakers that have better performance for the price, please tell me, because I am not really familiar with the currently available brands/models.

Also, don't be shy to tell me if my whole concept is crap, but in that case please give alternative solution/advice.

Thank you!
Old 26th June 2022
  #2
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Sebastian N's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by YoKKa ➑️
I am a complete newbie in terms of live events and live rigs but I love electronic music and I am passionate about organizing/hosingt such events.



Also, don't be shy to tell me if my whole concept is crap, but in that case please give alternative solution/advice.

Thank you!
take that money and rent a system. it will sound much better than whatever you can put together with this cash. it will show up on time and be setup by people who know what they are doing. unless you want to start building a big sound system and go down that route (with it's associated culture) i would really insist on renting a system. not sure where you live and what the prices are. but to give you an example of what you can rent for a fraction of your money and obviously with increased price an even bigger system, check out the picture from a local rental company. if you're just starting to organize parties, trust me, having a nice sound system is worth it. if this is something you want to do more often, this is the right way unless you have proper money to throw at a system and have a van and some guys to move it all. rental equipment is insured (and please buy your own event insurance) so this is another thing off your mind.
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Old 26th June 2022 | Show parent
  #3
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1 Review written
🎧 5 years
what the previous poster said...

(except that ime the syva is totally unsuitable for all but some very rare applications)

...so get in touch with some local rental companies.
Old 26th June 2022
  #4
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Thank you @ Sebastian N and @ deedeeyeah for your advice, but as I see so far from the rental prices here (in Spain) pretty much all my profit would go to the rent, which means I have no space to grow. Sure, it's nice to feed these rental companies and the industry, but it would not help me go forward. Anyhow, based on your suggestion I will look around again and try to ask for some discount. Thank you guys!

But in this case it's still too expensive and not sustainable as a business model, wat would be your advice about on my newbie/general questions?
Old 27th June 2022 | Show parent
  #5
Gear Nut
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by YoKKa ➑️
Thank you @ Sebastian N and @ deedeeyeah for your advice, but as I see so far from the rental prices here (in Spain) pretty much all my profit would go to the rent, which means I have no space to grow. Sure, it's nice to feed these rental companies and the industry, but it would not help me go forward. Anyhow, based on your suggestion I will look around again and try to ask for some discount. Thank you guys!

But in this case it's still too expensive and not sustainable as a business model, wat would be your advice about on my newbie/general questions?
Since you are in Spain and want to buy instead of rent I would try to find an RCF speaker dealer who can guide you. RCF will perform much better than any other speakers in your price range.
Old 27th June 2022 | Show parent
  #6
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TobyToby's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by YoKKa ➑️
Thank you @ Sebastian N and @ deedeeyeah for your advice, but as I see so far from the rental prices here (in Spain) pretty much all my profit would go to the rent, which means I have no space to grow. Sure, it's nice to feed these rental companies and the industry, but it would not help me go forward. Anyhow, based on your suggestion I will look around again and try to ask for some discount. Thank you guys!

But in this case it's still too expensive and not sustainable as a business model, wat would be your advice about on my newbie/general questions?

I assume you already own DJ decks and mixer.
I try to avoid dependencies as much as possible. If I would be in your position I would absolutely buy a sound system. Owning it means you could spend days with it to learn it and to practice and craft epic dj sets. 50-100 people is a nice start to grow. I wouldn't be shy to start with Thomann's affordable house brand and make it work, 18" subs loud and proud to leave a mark

https://www.thomann.de/gb/dj_sets.ht...DJ&filter=true

After a few sets with your own sound system I would rent the best system for a night [some brand you already have on your mind for a future purchase] just to find out about the difference in quality and handling.

Exciting times ahead to gain for the full package that is needed to be a Techno DJ in front of a crowd. . I think renting a system for small events is an utterly inconvenient and boring option : )
Old 27th June 2022 | Show parent
  #7
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GeneHall's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by YoKKa ➑️
Thank you @ Sebastian N and @ deedeeyeah for your advice, but as I see so far from the rental prices here (in Spain) pretty much all my profit would go to the rent, which means I have no space to grow. Sure, it's nice to feed these rental companies and the industry, but it would not help me go forward. Anyhow, based on your suggestion I will look around again and try to ask for some discount. Thank you guys!

But in this case it's still too expensive and not sustainable as a business model, wat would be your advice about on my newbie/general questions?
As a start up, I think it is really important to focus becoming a reliable event first and foremost. Buying gear and expecting to make a profit from the very start is completely unrealistic.
Growth and profits are incremental and earned by commanding a solid event , the initial goal should be to lose as little as possible. Starting a brick and mortar style operation needs to concentrate on establishing trust with patrons.
Renting equipment is critical to your success and is the path of least resistance with much fewer possibilities to encounter unforeseen expenses related only to the sound equipment
Starting a business is hard work, those that succeed usually do so by minimising exposure to risks and fine tuning risks as they progress towards turning a profit
Old 27th June 2022 | Show parent
  #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzgitter ➑️
Since you are in Spain and want to buy instead of rent I would try to find an RCF speaker dealer who can guide you. RCF will perform much better than any other speakers in your price range.
Thank you for the tip! I will definitely contact some RCF dealers and ask about the performance because compared to Mackie their products seem to have lower SPL values. Of course, most of the manufacturers publish quite inaccurate, calculated numbers instead of measured ones. That is one my biggest problems, because it makes it hard or impossible to make a good purchase decision.

Portability is important for me, so I would go with less speakers that are louder other than many speakers that together produce the same loudness. Also for future upgrades I need to consider space.
Old 27th June 2022 | Show parent
  #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TobyToby ➑️
I assume you already own DJ decks and mixer.
I try to avoid dependencies as much as possible. If I would be in your position I would absolutely buy a sound system. Owning it means you could spend days with it to learn it and to practice and craft epic dj sets. 50-100 people is a nice start to grow.
Yes, your assumption was correct, I have all the mentioned gear already, even the lights, I just happen to not have any speakers. Strange, I know...

Quote:
Originally Posted by TobyToby ➑️
I wouldn't be shy to start with Thomann's affordable house brand and make it work, 18" subs loud and proud to leave a mark.
I checked out their home-brand gear and based on their wattage and SPL they seem quite lower volume than the speakers I've mentioned before. Of course, they are much cheaper, but I would like something that is future proof and I don't have to change it soon.

For example, from the same manufacturer, Mackie, I found slightly cheaper gear, I am considering these:

Mackie SR18S - 800€ - 1600W - 133dB SPL
Mackie SRT215 - 660€ - 1600W -133dB SPL

Compared to Thomman's 124dB SPL, These Mackies are literally twice as loud (for twice the price) but they still fit in my budget.
Old 27th June 2022 | Show parent
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GeneHall ➑️
As a start up, I think it is really important to focus becoming a reliable event first and foremost. Buying gear and expecting to make a profit from the very start is completely unrealistic.
I agree with everything you said, however I didn't share in my original post (I didn't want to make it too long) that I've already done two events and both were success.

The first event was powered only by:
2 X Behringer B210D (170W and 120dB)
1 X SOUNDBOKS 3 (210W? and 126dB).
The event was free, there were about 40 people coming. The aim was just to put me on the map. The sound level was closer to a cocktail party than to a rave. However, I got ton of positive feedback and a lot of new contacts from that event.

The second event was powered by:
2 x Mackie SRM650 (1600W 133dB)
I was charging a small amount, 5€ for this event, there were about 60 people, because of physical the limitations of the venue (terrace) we could not have more. Otherwise there were about 80 people interested in coming. The sound level was better with the bigger speakers, in the front row it was almost impossible to have a conversation. But in my opinion, even with the 15" drivers it seriously lacked bass.

For the next events I would like to scale:
I will have about 100 people, charing 10€ for the entrance, but having a more professional sound system, just as mentioned, the plan is two tops and two subs.

Let's say I buy these:
Mackie SR18S - 800€ - 1600W - 133dB SPL
Mackie SRT215 - 660€ - 1600W -133dB SPL
Total investment: 2920€ (not including cables, mounts, etc)
I would need at least 3 parties with 100 participants and 1000€ revenue with no expenses to recover that initial cost.

However, if I rent for... let's say 300€***, that means I could make 700€ profit per party, which means after 4 parties I could buy my own gear or keep renting bigger, loader gear for bigger parties.

***This 300€ was just an educated guess, I am still contacting rental companies and getting price quotes. Here is Spain businesses are quite slow when it comes to replying and sending offers or anything :D
Old 27th June 2022 | Show parent
  #11
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TobyToby's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by YoKKa ➑️
Yes, your assumption was correct, I have all the mentioned gear already, even the lights, I just happen to not have any speakers. Strange, I know...



I checked out their home-brand gear and based on their wattage and SPL they seem quite lower volume than the speakers I've mentioned before. Of course, they are much cheaper, but I would like something that is future proof and I don't have to change it soon.

For example, from the same manufacturer, Mackie, I found slightly cheaper gear, I am considering these:

Mackie SR18S - 800€ - 1600W - 133SPL
Mackie SRT215 - 660€ - 1600W -133SPL

Compared to Thomman's 124SPL, These Mackies are literally twice as loud (for twice the price) but they still fit in my budget.
Awesome, then buy the best you can get for your budget. I'm absolutely not up to date with the current market, but

a pair of these sounds like fun to me
https://www.thomann.de/gb/the_box_pro_tp218_1600_a.htm

The Mackie SRT215 are getting mixed reviews

RCF is a nice Italian brand but way more expensive. For some fun reasons we have PA speakers in our house [old JBL's for the wifes xbox]
One pair is a HK Audio with RCF woofer & BMS horns. They sound nice.
DIY. I've built a pair 18" subs with FaitalPro's 18FH500 for our studio. It took way longer than expected to complete them to my vision and measurements [ L and T shaped steel bar bracing inside etc]
Old 27th June 2022 | Show parent
  #12
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1 Review written
🎧 5 years
i have no idea about the expectations of you and your audience in terms of frequency range, dynamic range, coverage, max. spl etc....

...but the raves for which i have been providing gear needed massively larger and more capable gear!

(in these situations, none of what you listed would be deemed even remotely acceptable just for monitoring alone, not to speak of the use as pa - don't get me wrong: there's absolutely nothing wrong with using smaller, less and less stellar gear - as long as it meets the expectations...)
Old 27th June 2022 | Show parent
  #13
Here for the gear
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TobyToby ➑️
a pair of these sounds like fun to me
https://www.thomann.de/gb/the_box_pro_tp218_1600_a.htm
Yes, they look absolutely awesome and affordable, but for transportation reasons I think I will get the single 18" versions, because carrying 87kg boxes in a forest is not fun, especially because even with wheels they would not roll on the uneven surface. Carrying 30-40kg seems more doable :D

Quote:
Originally Posted by TobyToby ➑️
DIY. I've built a pair 18" subs with FaitalPro's 18FH500 for our studio. It took way longer than expected to complete them to my vision and measurements [ L and T shaped steel bar bracing inside etc]
I love DIY projects, I guess because my dad (who was also a DJ back in the days) was building speakers and lights at home and I grew up in that environment, but I don't have much personal, hands on experience. I see pictures on the internet of HUUUGE MONSTER sound systems, but I always wonder:

What delivers better performance, a HUGE DIY sound system that is a transportation nightmare, or a smaller store bought system that is more compact, tested and fine tuned by the manufacturer?
Old 27th June 2022 | Show parent
  #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deedeeyeah ➑️
...but the raves for which i have been providing gear needed massively larger and more capable gear!
Unfortunately, this is the budget and the resources I have to start with. Of course I would love to have tens of thousands of watts available to blast the forest to a clearing, but unfortunately neither I or the people around me have those resources. I hope my event will grow and I can upgrade the rig in the process.

Ps: If you have some spare gear, I accept donations :D
Old 27th June 2022 | Show parent
  #15
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TobyToby's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by YoKKa ➑️
Yes, they look absolutely awesome and affordable, but for transportation reasons I think I will get the single 18" versions, because carrying 87kg boxes in a forest is not fun, especially because even with wheels they would not roll on the uneven surface. Carrying 30-40kg seems more doable :D



I love DIY projects, I guess because my dad (who was also a DJ back in the days) was building speakers and lights at home and I grew up in that environment, but I don't have much personal, hands on experience. I see pictures on the internet of HUUUGE MONSTER sound systems, but I always wonder:

What delivers better performance, a HUGE DIY sound system that is a transportation nightmare, or a smaller store bought system that is more compact, tested and fine tuned by the manufacturer?
The laws of physics always apply. If you like to have an impact with your low frequencies [well, it's Techno] you would need a sufficient amount of moving surface area from the subwoofer cones, means you need to move air. Otherwise you would be in the sound "realm" of the typical funktion/congress speaker set-up. There is a price to pay as always.
Looking at some of our small Bristol cellar clubs with a dance floor capacity of 30 to 60 people, they usually have four sub systems and two or four satellites on poles or from the ceilling [often Mackie]. The sound is just bearable. There of course is way more to the whole subject but I understand you need to start somewhere and that is great.
Old 27th June 2022 | Show parent
  #16
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Sebastian N's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by deedeeyeah ➑️
(except that ime the syva is totally unsuitable for all but some very rare applications)
from that list, the syva would also be my last choice. however, i did get to hear it in action at the end of april. one of the rooms i'm regularly workin in had a red bull breakdance comeptition. for this we were just system technicians for the external company (red line). they came with a syva (including the 2 subs) to blow directly on the dance floor. they also used our array (kudo and ks28 subs) but just the center cluster as the audience was packed around the dancefloor. they did use all 8 subs though. i gotta say i did like the sound of the syva. a lot more than i do their big systems. in this room the sound system was already there so nothing i can do about it but i much much prefer the D&B i work with in the other room directly opposite. there's just something hypey about the l'acoustics sound which i don't particular enjoy.


to get back to the op's problem, from what i can tell he wants to go on and do bigger and nicer parties. but i really think it's the wrong way to go about it. first of all, for techno (or whatever electronic music you guys are playing) clarity and power rule. that's why you see a lot of void and funktion one at these kind of festivals on the smaller stages. they are made for this. if at some point you want to have a party with lets say 300 people, each paying 20 Eur, you need a proper sound system that can deliver enough CLEAN power and clarity to these people. keep in mind that most clubs nowadays have more than reasonable sound so your crowd will be used to this kind of quality. guess what happens when your sub-par system falls flat or god forbid you blow a speaker. next time nobody shows up. you are in the business of organising parties, not in the business of sound providing. leave that to pros. unless your objective is to have 100 ppl small parties (which can be great fun) start talking to rental companies. look at small festivals who provided sound for them. ask around. if you just want to do small parties, than by all means, put all that money and buy maybe a used system from a company that you can test before hand. or maybe rent it for one event, see how it performs and if you want to buy it, use some of the rental price to go towards the buying price (minus any transport/crew costs obviously).

if you dod decide to go the route of buying your own system, than do hire a proper sound tech to set it up and be there during the show. you might think it's not necessary. lots of people think that, until something happens
Old 27th June 2022 | Show parent
  #17
Gear Guru
 
1 Review written
🎧 5 years
@ sebastian: pretty far from my experience...

i still think there might be situations in which the syva is a good fit - however, i haven't come across any of these situations yet and i so far actually twice replaced a syva rig (with 5 hangs of a convertional small line array in one situation and a pair of column speakers in the other situation)...

short: imo there are better column speakers and better small line arrays from other manufacturers - for less money...

...but then (almost) every well-respected manufacturer has a piece of gear (or two) which i fail to see how i could use it (or why on earth anyone else finds useful)?!
Old 27th June 2022
  #18
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Sebastian N's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
if we're talking money, than i would never pay what syva systems go for. even used. 20k? that's a hard pass. i can build a nice kling & freitag or d&b system for that money that can cater to a lot more setups. what i don't understand is who this caters for. it's not big enough for proper clubbing, it's too expensive for random installs in small places, it looks much too technical for small venues that have more corporate events(i see a lot of the LD Maui in these places because of the sleek design). it seems a bit in the middle of nowhere. but this one time i heard it... can't deny it. even the light guy i normally work with (who has hearing damage from all the decades in the biz came up and asked what system it was because he liked how it sounded. he said it sounded incredibly clear and punchy to him. he never heard properly tuned voids i guess
Old 28th June 2022 | Show parent
  #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sebastian N ➑️
put all that money and buy maybe a used system from a company that you can test before hand. or maybe rent it for one event, see how it performs and if you want to buy it, use some of the rental price to go towards the buying price (minus any transport/crew costs obviously).
Could you please tell me, is there a reliable/standard way to test speakers before/after I rent them? I am concerned about something: What if I rent speakers that are already on their last legs, and they die when I use them? In my opinion it would make sense to have a method to test speakers beforehand to make sure they are in good condition when I receive and when I give them back.

Or how does this work in the speaker rental world?
Old 28th June 2022
  #20
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Sebastian N's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
a reputable rental company will give you a system in good working order. they normally check everything when it reaches the warehouse. clean as appropriate etc. there may be cases when one system goes from one rental straight to the next. but if something breaks as you are using it, you pick up the phone and call immediately. the companies we work with we have a long standing relationship so there is an amount of trust there. but like i said, normally if something is delivered to you, it should be in good working order. now, some systems might be rocked more than others. also, the older a system is, the more tired it will be. but that's why generally you would rent(or build) something with more power than you need so you can run it with enough headroom for loud clean reproduction.
Old 1st July 2022
  #21
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Could someone please tell me how to calculate how strong generator/aggregator do I need for the speakers outdoors?
I would think that a speakerwith let's say 2000W peak performance needs at least 2000W from a generator.
But that ight be completely wrong. I am pretty sure you have experience with this, please share!
Old 1st July 2022
  #22
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🎧 5 years
As a new DJ at a rave event, you are in need of 2 things more than anything else. Loud (especially in the low end), reliably good sounding (even if you don't know much about speaker setup), and reliable.

Powered speakers are going to be your best bet as all the processing and protection and cross-overs are all handled for you. I would suggest new vs used so you have the warranty behind you should anything happen to the speakers (which is more frequent with DJ's than bands.

I have no problem with RCF, but they do tend to be a bit more expensive than other brands.

For the kind of music you are looking for, I would start with two 18" powered subs and one powered 12" top all of decent quality.

My general recommendations are:

Yamaha DZR12 top with two Yamaha DXS18XLF's (around $5000 USD)
JBL SRX812 top with two JBL SRX818 subs (about the same as the Yamaha package)
RCF 745a top with two RCF 905 as II subs (about the same price as above)

When you get to making money (which you are more likely to do with any of these systems since you will sound great right out of the box) buy another top and two more subs giving you a total of 2 tops and 4 subs.

That is my 2 cents. Good luck!
Old 2nd July 2022
  #23
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Sebastian N's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
if you're gonna go dzr, i'd go with the 15 rather than the 12. just sounds cleaner when pushed as a pa speaker. the 12s will work, but i find they start sounding squashed faster. great for stage monitors though.
Old 2nd July 2022
  #24
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Thank you @ OneEng and @ Sebastian N for your advice, I am going to start with 15 tops and 18 subs just as you recommended.

Here is a potentially newbie question. I think I know the answer but please confirm my thoughts:

There is a 18" sub that is 3000W and SPL 132dB and another one that is pretty much the same but 1000W and the SPL 135dB

So the second speaker has better efficiency because it makes the bigger sound level from less watts? Or the companies published bullshit data in their specs?

Speaker one, less efficient:
https://www.thomann.de/gb/turbosound_iq18b.htm

Speaker two, much more efficient:
https://www.thomann.de/es/jbl_srx818sp.htm

Because I happier to get more loudness from 1000W instead of 3000W. Especially because I need generators in the forest to run the whole show.
Old 3rd July 2022 | Show parent
  #25
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🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sebastian N ➑️
if you're gonna go dzr, i'd go with the 15 rather than the 12. just sounds cleaner when pushed as a pa speaker. the 12s will work, but i find they start sounding squashed faster. great for stage monitors though.
Interesting.

Generally, the cross-over output in the subs are set somewhere between 90-120Hz. I wouldn't have thought that 15's would have had much of an edge over 12's setup like this.

Thanks for the information.
Old 3rd July 2022 | Show parent
  #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OneEng ➑️
Interesting.
No... it's nonsense if the boxes are high passed over subs. I own and use many of the current powered speakers available in my market(north america), the 15" boxes have no advantage over 12's when used this way.
Old 3rd July 2022 | Show parent
  #27
Lives for gear
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by YoKKa ➑️

Here is a potentially newbie question. I think I know the answer but please confirm my thoughts:

There is a 18" sub that is 3000W and SPL 132dB and another one that is pretty much the same but 1000W and the SPL 135dB

So the second speaker has better efficiency because it makes the bigger sound level from less watts? Or the companies published bullshit data in their specs?
Unfortunately it's nearly impossibe to directly compare speakers from different manufacturers based on specs alone, there are differences in the way things are measured by the manufacturers and various amounts of specs fudging takes place from one brand to the next.
The JBL sound level specs have been independantly verified as being mostly accurate and if anything the power amp specs are under reported, while the parent company for Turbosound(music tribe) is notorious for exaggerating specs and I'm not aware of any independant testing for those speakers, so you have to take what you see with a grain of salt.
Old 3rd July 2022 | Show parent
  #28
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Christof's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by YoKKa ➑️
Thank you @ OneEng and @ Sebastian N for your advice, I am going to start with 15 tops and 18 subs just as you recommended.

Here is a potentially newbie question. I think I know the answer but please confirm my thoughts:

There is a 18" sub that is 3000W and SPL 132dB and another one that is pretty much the same but 1000W and the SPL 135dB

So the second speaker has better efficiency because it makes the bigger sound level from less watts? Or the companies published bullshit data in their specs?

Speaker one, less efficient:
https://www.thomann.de/gb/turbosound_iq18b.htm

Speaker two, much more efficient:
https://www.thomann.de/es/jbl_srx818sp.htm

Because I happier to get more loudness from 1000W instead of 3000W. Especially because I need generators in the forest to run the whole show.
Regarding max. SPL - don't believe the hyped numbers. Most of the time those numbers do not give you any realistic information about how loud the speaker will be. Of course there are more efficient speakers, but the question is, HOW did they measure? At what frequency or frequency band? Half space or full space? Peak or RMS? In germany there's a magazine called "Production Partner". They do measure every tested product with the exact same procedure, so you can compare the results and get a very good impression about the differences between two products. Anything else is just guesswork - you should try and test yourself.
Old 3rd July 2022
  #29
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PsyKology's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 5 years
Hire a system for the first few gigs. That way if it doesnt take off you dont lose a lot of money. If the gigs do take off, use the profit you make to increase your budget. I also would go for Yamaha DZR, or RCF.
Old 3rd July 2022 | Show parent
  #30
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🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by paul o ➑️
No... it's nonsense if the boxes are high passed over subs. I own and use many of the current powered speakers available in my market(north america), the 15" boxes have no advantage over 12's when used this way.
That has been my experience as well; however, I don't own the DZR's (I own DSR's) so I don't feel comfortable telling someone who owns them that what they are hearing isn't true.

I can say that for bottom heavy stuff, I have seen my DSR112's clip the limit light on things like bass notes and kick drum hits even when using the cross-over out from my PRX618XLF's (90Hz cross-over). For bottom end heavy stuff, it is possible that a 15" speaker would do better than a 12" based on what I have seen..... I simply haven't tested it with those specific speakers under that kind of music.
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