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New 50 cent album sounds fantastic!
Old 14th March 2005
  #1
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illynoise's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
New 50 cent album sounds fantastic!

How do they do it? Anybody know? The quality of their vocals is redic. Very simple, but it do stick out good.

Matter of fact all of G-Unit/Dr. Dre recordings sound fabulous to me. What are they using?

Peace out,

BaseJase
Illynoise
Old 14th March 2005
  #2
Gear Head
 
🎧 15 years
i have to agree the dre g-unit stuff sounds amazing
the dble tracked vocals are so tight
i'd love to know how and what they use
vocalign and autotune?
who engineers dre's stuff?
is it a secret!
can anyone shed light on it?
Old 14th March 2005
  #3
no ssl yet
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NOT SO AMAZED

I HAVE TO BE THE VOICE OF DISSENT. EACH TIME I LISTEN TO AN OLDER DRE RECORD (MINUS THE HYPE OF IT BEING NEW) I ONLY HEAR GOOD MIXES, BUT NOTHING THAT IS AS AMAZING AS I THOUGHT IT WAS WHEN I WAS SUCKERED INTO THE HYPE OF IT. DRE USES SOME GOOD SAMPLES AND PROGRAMS OPEN PATTERNS THAT MAKE SPACE FOR THE "BOOM" "BAP" NO REAL SECRET TO IT. ANY GOOD PRODUCER WORTH HIS SALT CAN ACHIEVE AT LEAST SIMILIAR RESULTS WITH A GOOD ENGINEER.
Old 14th March 2005 | Show parent
  #4
Gear Head
 
🎧 15 years
oh come on thats just like saying any one can play reggae ,
all you need is to be able to play reggae....
with respect
i think we are asking about production techniques
not wether you like it or not
Old 14th March 2005
  #5
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illynoise's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Sweat the Technique

I really would like to know how they get the snare to hit so loud. Every once in a while I get a mix to do that, but it seems like all of their productions have that sound. And it's not just the drums, because I have one of the biggest drum collections around, from back in 1986 on..... from a mirage, eps, asr, up to EXS.

I know good drums, but it must be in the mastering or something.

BaseJase
Illynoise
Old 14th March 2005 | Show parent
  #6
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Stoneface's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Dre has always been fond of tracking his vocals through Sony C-800G into a Neve 1073 into a DBX 160. Then he utilizes the SSL compressors. This was true when he was still recording to 2" tape. I know he uses Protools now so I'm not sure if he's still able to achieve the same results going digital with the same chain.

As for his drums, he spends hours layering kicks and tweeking the mess out of all his drums. He said he once spent an entire week on one kick drum. Damn...that's serious dedication.

As for mixing, he's still rockin an SSL. Was the 4000 but may have upgraded since then. On a side note, I have to give a lot of credit to his mastering engineer as well. I think it's still Brian "Big Bass" Gardner, or something like that, out of LA. It's also good to keep in mind that aside from sampling, Dre employs some top notch studio musicians that are there when he arrives at the studio and this small team creates the tracks together.

Some people who do hip-hop seem to forget that everything you sample was once played live so I'm glad there are still a few that understand that simply smacking out a beat on an MPC could NEVER compare to the "life" that real musicians and instruments bring to a music bed. Without live instruments it simply becomes the same cold and boring 8 bar loops that are killing Hip-Hop. Point is, if you want to achieve similar results....be creative and incorporate live musicians into your projects. It will make all the difference. An SSL and all the outboard gear you can stand dosen't hurt either!
Old 14th March 2005 | Show parent
  #7
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MY POINT WAS

I never said I didnt like Dre's stuff. I only said that I don't find it extra special anymore. I have not heard the new 50 record yet, but I have heard the GAme, the old 50 and all of Dre's records. maybe our ears hear different things, but when I listen to a Dre record, (minus the hype/marketing/knowing its the album of the moment) I hear standard stuff api/dbx160xt on drums, SSL channel strips on most of the instruments. I honestly dont hear much difference in the dre stuff and PENsado's mixes. Professional it is! Amazing it isn't

Production wise most of the best advice has already been given use talented musicians and good drum mults. This may sound like i'm over simplifying but I too used to wonder what the great secrets were, then I began to meet better engineers/producers and learn that it simply comes down to talent. So I began to work on my talent. And, as far as the mastering is concerned. Big Bass Brian has a pair of realistic minimus 7s that he keeps on the floor to monitor through (in addition to others) If thats not an example of the talent and not the gear, then what is??


Just my opinion.
Old 15th March 2005 | Show parent
  #8
Dor
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Dor's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
This isn't from his new album but i doubt the vocal chain has changed much.

50 CENT

"In Da Club"

Producer: Dr. Dre

Engineer: Vito (Mauricio Iragorri)

"With 50, he's an artist with such an amazing voice," says Vito. "You just put him behind a microphone and it just sounds good! My job is make sure it doesn't distort and it's not overloading. While he's vibing and doing his thing, I'm scrambling to make sure nothing is going wrong with the signal path."

"Recording vocals with Dre is a meticulous process," Vito reveals. "There are some exceptions, like 50 is an exception. There are some people that just do it, and there's not much punching involved. And there are other people who need a lot of punching, and that means maybe a couple words at a time until all the rhythm and the pockets are correct. Dre has an amazing sense of rhythm. He hears all these crazy rhythms in the vocal and, because he's a rapper as well, he knows how it should be performed. As a producer he's great, but as a rapper he knows what pocket they should be hitting and he can really coach someone well. Working with Dre on vocals is cool because you get to see how he directs someone and they actually sound the best they've ever sounded."

Signal Path: Tracking

"I like my vocals to sound 'crystal,'" says Dre. "I use the Sony C800-G for vocals because it has a clean sound and about 85% of the people that get behind it sound great. My main objective is that the vocal sound is present and clean and ultimately does not distort. I get the sound I want out of the EQ on the SSL. We've used it forever and have made many hits on it, including 50's 'In Da Club.'"



"We come from the Sony C800-G and out of that into the Neve 1073 mic pre," explains Vito. "We don't use the EQ, because most of the time it sounds good flat. If there's a need for it we'll engage it, but for 50 Cent on 'In Da Club' we didn't use any EQ. Then we took it out of the Neve mic pre into the Avalon 737-SP compressor. It's a mic pre with EQ, and it actually has a compressor, but we're not using any of the mic pre on the Avalon - we're just going straight into the line input. From the output of the Neve it goes into the line input of the Avalon, which allows you to use the compressor alone. We set the compression ratio around 7:1 and the threshold usually hovers at around 0. I set it at a medium attack and fast release. I'd say we're using around 3 or 4 dB of compression, sometimes up to 7 dB. On 'In Da Club' it was about 4 or 5. Then it comes back into the SSL 4000 G with E modules (at Encore Studio) and we bring it back on the insert.

"There's a patch on the patch bay that says 'insert return,'" he continues, "and that's where we bring the vocal back into the insert return, because it's the shortest patch before you actually hear the vocal. It has the least amount of circuitry of anything in the channel, so you're bypassing the EQ, the dynamics. You could use it all, but if you really want the shortest, cleanest signal, that's the way to go. Then we bus it out to Pro Tools HD and we use the small fader to send it to PT. That's about it."

Discovery

"The way we came to this chain is - a while ago, when I first started out, I was assisting for Dr. Dre," says Vito. "I noticed how their engineer was doing it and it sounded good. The records sounded amazing, so when Dre hired me to engineer, I told him, 'Ya gotta buy some of these,' and he bought some 1073s. I had heard for a long time that they were really good mic pre's to run vocals through. At Encore, where I was assisting, they had one there, and anytime we were doing a session we would always run vocals through it. So when I saw Dre doing it, it was just cool seeing a rap guy using a 1073! That's how we came up with it. As for the compressor, it's just a good tube-sounding compressor. Sometimes we use the dbx 160 - the original - as an alternate compressor; it sounds good and we've used that on a lot of records."

Signal Path: Mixdown

The Yamaha SPX-1000 played a prominent role in mixdown. "We used a REV-5 room setting," says Vito. "There are a couple patches in there that sound really good. They're old reverbs and they're not the best nor most expensive, but they sound good, they're reliable, and that's all that matters! For R&B the Lexicon reverbs sound great. They work good for R&B, but for rap the SPX works good. We've used Lexicon's before too and they work okay. It's depends on the song and the artist and what you're looking for in the song. Like on Eve's stuff we used the SPX-1000, too."
Old 15th March 2005 | Show parent
  #9
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De chromium cob's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
New 50 cent album sounds fantastic!

If it sounds so good, you'd think they would charge more than 50 cents for it!
Old 15th March 2005 | Show parent
  #10
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Charlie-O's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
What the hell is this guy ( Dre) tracking his drums through? He has that mpc sound great!
Old 15th March 2005 | Show parent
  #11
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stoneface
Without live instruments it simply becomes the same cold and boring 8 bar loops that are killing Hip-Hop. Point is, if you want to achieve similar results....be creative and incorporate live musicians into your projects. It will make all the difference. An SSL and all the outboard gear you can stand dosen't hurt either!

Hip hop was CREATED on those "boring" 8 bar, 4 bar etc. loops. Whats killing hip hop ain't the production its the majors(like every genre of music) that wants to make music for immature adolescents.
Old 15th March 2005 | Show parent
  #12
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illynoise's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Now I'm not trying to start the hip hop is dead war. It's dead in the mainstream that's for sure. Where it's progressing is not in NY or LA or ATL or CHI it's here in the midwest with groups like techn9ne and atmosphere who are doing bigger numbers than lloyd banks and making more money. And what's worse is that I can't stand these groups. So where do I stand? Give me some ATCQ and Heavy D and I'm straight!

Live shows are flourishing in Colorado with hip hop that now one has heard of. Immortal Technique is selling 50,000 records on Caroline sh*tting on Bush. That's where the real hip hop is. Not with Lil Jon.

But back to the subject, fake hip hop sounds really good, I guess.

Peace out,

BaseJase
ILLYnoise Music
www.theblackpegasus.com
Old 15th March 2005 | Show parent
  #13
Dor
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Dor's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
i find it hard to believe that atmosphere and tech are putting up bigger numbers than lloyd banks. They don't have a fraction of the budget...
Old 15th March 2005 | Show parent
  #14
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dor
i find it hard to believe that atmosphere and tech are putting up bigger numbers than lloyd banks. They don't have a fraction of the budget...
I'm guessing he means money wise not unit wise....but either way I don't agree with him

Tech said on one his songs he made about $400K off his first mixtape LP(probably a generous #)...I think banks made more then that with "Hunger for more"
Old 15th March 2005 | Show parent
  #15
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illynoise's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
I'm talkin performance wise, they draw bigger numbers than lloyd banks. LB was just did a show at a reduced rate 12k and he didn't even draw 1000 people. Tech sells out every 1000 venue in colorado and the northwest. Of course LB is bigger on a larger scale, but Atmosphere is doin better numbers in alot of markets. Tech9 does more merch than most big artists. That's the thing it's different.

I can only speak for Colorado, which is a favorite of many performers, that big artists don't do that great out here. Living Legends (which I don't like) and Atmosphere (also don't care for) could do a show together and probably do as many as Snoop, if not more. That's nothing to scoff at. AND Atmosphere is charging only 10 less than snoop and more than Lloyd Banks, per ticket.

Don't sleep on the Underground BS hip hop market. I don't like it, but it's thriving.

Damn, I'm hijacking my own thread!!!!


Peace out,

BaseJase
ILLYnoise
Old 15th March 2005 | Show parent
  #16
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by illynoise
I'm talkin performance wise, they draw bigger numbers than lloyd banks. LB was just did a show at a reduced rate 12k and he didn't even draw 1000 people. Tech sells out every 1000 venue in colorado and the northwest. Of course LB is bigger on a larger scale, but Atmosphere is doin better numbers in alot of markets. Tech9 does more merch than most big artists. That's the thing it's different.

I can only speak for Colorado, which is a favorite of many performers, that big artists don't do that great out here. Living Legends (which I don't like) and Atmosphere (also don't care for) could do a show together and probably do as many as Snoop, if not more. That's nothing to scoff at. AND Atmosphere is charging only 10 less than snoop and more than Lloyd Banks, per ticket.

Don't sleep on the Underground BS hip hop market. I don't like it, but it's thriving.

Damn, I'm hijacking my own thread!!!!


Peace out,

BaseJase
ILLYnoise
It makes sense that those guys could hang with the likes of lloyd banks live show wise considering banks music is marketed towards kids that can't even go to concerts.

Never heard of Tech9, I like Slug from Atmosphere not sure about the rest of them.
Old 15th March 2005 | Show parent
  #17
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entropy's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
The new Game album sounds ****ing excellent! Bottom end on that is (dare I say it) PHAT but just so tight. Again, I'm sure it Vito... nice work.
Old 16th March 2005 | Show parent
  #18
Gear Head
 
christian's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
For my ears, dr.dre gets possibly some of the best mixes in r&b and hiphop today. I think alot of it is good arangement and use of filters. i"ve been trying to work out for years how he gets everything louder than everything else, and the vocals still in your face. there definately is a secret to it, and i"m sure one of the secrets is probably a good two to three days mixing,AND a great room. other guys who gets great mixes, although different but just as good are pensado and duro. what are they doing that gives everything its own space like that?
Old 16th March 2005 | Show parent
  #19
Gear Addict
 
RyanR's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by illynoise
Live shows are flourishing in Colorado with hip hop that now one has heard of. Immortal Technique is selling 50,000 records on Caroline sh*tting on Bush. That's where the real hip hop is. Not with Lil Jon.
Yeah, I feel a whole different vibe coming out of Colorado. I just realized you're with Black Pegasus down in the Springs. I'm feeling your "mission statement" and I too think change is coming in hip hop.

You ever heard of Liquid elementz?
Old 16th March 2005 | Show parent
  #20
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STARSKI's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
If something is good its good. I get sick of hearing how some people aren't "keeping it real" or "selling out" just cuz they are selling big numbers. If i like a britney spears song i like a britney spears song i'm not gonna sit here and front you know? Lots of people get so caught up in "not" being trendy that they lose focus of what is good and what isn't. G-Unit camp happen to make some good songs, not like they are the most illest MC's ever but if you are talking about good songs they crank em out. Sure lots of stuff that is selling is garbage, but i like to give music a chance be it underground or mainstream. Lots of really dope MC's can't write a good hook or good whole song. So what if so and so used that really sick metaphor? And lots of folks i know are stuck in the past (the glory days of hip hop) jazz loops and break beats, good stuff of course but its done, time to move on and do some new things. I know when i hear a new song and it sounds like it came out in '93 im like wtf? Anyways sorry for the rant and rave just wanted to get that off my chest. Oh and Dre's albums (or people he produces) are always top quality sound wise in my opinion.
Old 16th March 2005 | Show parent
  #21
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illynoise's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Nah, Liquid Elementz? I'll ask BP if he knows.

We try to make great music, that sounds great. With what we have I think that it sounds very good. I've been recording rap for about 15 years, so I'm an OG. But just when you think your stuff sounds good, here comes something on the next level.

Peace out,

BaseJase
ILLYnoise
Old 20th March 2005 | Show parent
  #22
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underground network

Man if you cats have some decent material and you wanna make some dough without making a commitment to a major label (or waiting for them to get the heart to sign something new ). The most sensible thing to do is form a network of people in different states who assist one another in finding there way around, selling, promoting products in each others areas. (Kinda like the underground railroad of rnb/hip hop).

Think of it this way with 200 units per state times 50 states equals about $80K per project. Which is probably more than a gold artist would make on a major label. and If you cannot make your record sell a mere 200 units in an entire state then you need to find a new line of work anyway.
Old 20th March 2005 | Show parent
  #23
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STARSKI's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
sign me up for the underground rap road!!!
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