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Vintage U-47
Old 15th December 2021
  #61
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toledo3's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
actually...recollecting some...

I had thought that the process of EMI having had those U47 modded to U48 by Neumann some years after acquisition, had ended up avoiding some part of the issue by having a slight different implementation than a stock U48 has....I remember reading some technical discussion about those mics. I may have just reached the wrong conclusion or remember the wrong detail about it.
Old 15th December 2021 | Show parent
  #62
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by bgood ➡️
They can certainly be had…. Do you have the bread? Start making calls. This thread confuses me

I must say that my flea sounds really really good compared to my actually real 47.

I would only buy one online from a trusted seller like Vintage King or the like.
I'd only buy a U47 that I could check out in person, no matter where it comes from. If the mic is with a dealer in the US it will be 'the best mic they ever had' even if it's a total dud, so buying from a respected dealer doesn't ensure it's a good sounding mic at all.

I've heard many U47's and only very few of them actually had 'that' sound. The Flea 47 is a great microphone, certainly better than most real ones I encountered, but it doesn't hold up so well against a great U47.
Old 15th December 2021 | Show parent
  #63
Gear Guru
 
1 Review written
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by BradD ➡️
Just curious, why does anyone need/want 12 U47s?
for the same reason someone wants 60 schoeps (or any other highly desireable piece of gear that gets regular use): if the gear does the job, you like it and can afford it, why not?

in the case of u47's, it's still more sensible than to see your money melt away on a bank account and not everyone is into buying houses or shares from weapon manufacturers, art-connected nft's or otherwise participating in crypto-criminal activities...

anyway, i sold my u-47 (and some other vintage tube mics) two years ago and the money i made helped me to finance gear for which i have much more frequent use and without which i could neither compete for some jobs nor realize them; an u-47 however i can still rent if i have/want to - besides, i can't get bothered to use any tube mics (specifically their psu's/cables) on location anymore...
Old 15th December 2021 | Show parent
  #64
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bgood's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by sonicdom ➡️
I'd only buy a U47 that I could check out in person, no matter where it comes from. If the mic is with a dealer in the US it will be 'the best mic they ever had' even if it's a total dud, so buying from a respected dealer doesn't ensure it's a good sounding mic at all.

I've heard many U47's and only very few of them actually had 'that' sound. The Flea 47 is a great microphone, certainly better than most real ones I encountered, but it doesn't hold up so well against a great U47.
The flea doesn’t hold up, huh? Ok lol! You’re precisely the kind of guy I keep my neumanns serviced and hardly ever use them…. They’re like Bitcoin and every one of these threads makes them pop another grand or so

Well… I dunno where you live, but, if you want a 47 and insist on auditioning them in person… find one, and start booking flights! If you’re a serious buyer, VK will probably consolidate a few at one location for you to check out depending on where is most convenient for you to travel to
Old 15th December 2021 | Show parent
  #65
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bgood's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by deedeeyeah ➡️
for the same reason someone wants 60 schoeps (or any other highly desireable piece of gear that gets regular use): if the gear does the job, you like it and can afford it, why not?

in the case of u47's, it's still more sensible than to see your money melt away on a bank account and not everyone is into buying houses or shares from weapon manufacturers, art-connected nft's or otherwise participating in crypto-criminal activities...

anyway, i sold my u-47 (and some other vintage tube mics) two years ago and the money i made helped me to finance gear for which i have much more frequent use and without which i could neither compete for some jobs nor realize them; an u-47 however i can still rent if i have/want to - besides, i can't get bothered to use any tube mics (specifically their psu's/cables) on location anymore...
Smart man…
Old 15th December 2021 | Show parent
  #66
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by bgood ➡️
The flea doesn’t hold up, huh? Ok lol! You’re precisely the kind of guy I keep my neumanns serviced and hardly ever use them…. They’re like Bitcoin and every one of these threads makes them pop another grand or so

Well… I dunno where you live, but, if you want a 47 and insist on auditioning them in person… find one, and start booking flights! If you’re a serious buyer, VK will probably consolidate a few at one location for you to check out depending on where is most convenient for you to travel to
Don't get me wrong, I like the Flea... There is one U47 I get to use sometimes where the Flea really does not sound so great next to. That 47 is really special however... But frankly, I rarely have talent in front of the mic where it would matter. So I'm happy using a Flea any time...

I live in Europe where most U47's that have a broadcast history were converted to Nuvistor in the late 60's and most of them were later converted back to Vf-14 with whatever Vf-14 people could find, so they could be sold for more. In one particular case I liked the mic a lot more with the Nuvistor before it was converted back to Vf-14... go figure.
Old 16th December 2021 | Show parent
  #67
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toledo3's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Klaus ➡️
That increased sensitivity you mention is mystifying to me.

In order to generate two polarization voltages to activate true and equal-output figure-eight in the U48, the available 105VDC is split up: rear side gets 105VDC, and backplate gets half of that, 52.5VDC, which reduces overall sensitivity of the mic by a couple of dB, compared to the U47.

There is no way around that, unless you jack up the output of the power supply to, say, 120VDC, then reconfigure all voltage dividers and dropping resistors in the mic which, to my knowledge was not done in the EMI mics, for the simple reason that the heat-sunk hand-wound wire resistor for the heater voltage embedded in the mic body is an integral part of both mics.

So, unless it was completely redesigned by Neumann, that part alone would be an insurmountable stumbling block to jack up polarization voltages into the range of the U47.

But maybe you have more detailed information to explain increased sensitivity in these modified U47 with U48 heads?

It is the output transformer I am thinking of, in that most U48 have the later version BV8 that has less output. I think I had just generalized in my mind that all U48 have the lower output transformer but I suppose that is probably incorrect given all the variations out there.

The EMI Beatles mics having been earlier U47, then converted to U48, would presumably still have the higher output transformers.
Old 16th December 2021 | Show parent
  #68
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Klaus's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by toledo3 ➡️
It is the output transformer I am thinking of, in that most U48 have the later version BV8 that has less output.
That would just be for the last year of production, and only for those that went to the United States, as per Temmer's (Gotham Audio) request. These are identified by the suffix "b" after "GN8"
Old 16th December 2021 | Show parent
  #69
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toledo3's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Klaus ➡️
That would just be for the last year of production, and only for those that went to the United States, as per Temmer's (Gotham Audio) request. These are identified by the suffix "b" after "GN8"
I appreciate the clarification. I think it is a post by you many years ago where I read about the U48s having that transformer, but in the post you just said “late U48s” and called the transformer a BV8 version. https://repforums.prosoundweb.com/in...c,17564.0.html

I think more details about some fine points of all of this with the output transformer designations got clarified by Neumann later on. I see I had just momentarily lumped together this output transformer issue with the capsule polarization/sensitivity differences between U47 and U48 in my memory.

But I wish I could find some posts specifically about the emi/abbey road U47/48 mics that I think were over at PRW…I’m sure I’ll turn them up at some point.
Old 16th December 2021 | Show parent
  #70
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chessparov2.0's Avatar
 
IIRC based on what I've read, over the years...

George Martin personally asked to get EMI's U47's modded for Figure 8.
Guessing partly for background vocals, so whichever Beatle wasn't on lead vocals... The other two could sing call/response and/or harmony.
Chris
Old 16th December 2021
  #71
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toledo3's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Vintage U-47-6ac5c009-6ac6-4499-91dc-68a284dbc88f.jpg

Here’s a pic of the badge of one of the EMI/Abbey Road converted mics.
Attached Thumbnails
Vintage U-47-6ac5c009-6ac6-4499-91dc-68a284dbc88f.jpg  
Old 16th December 2021 | Show parent
  #72
AB3
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1 Review written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by chessparov2.0 ➡️
IIRC based on what I've read, over the years...

George Martin personally asked to get EMI's U47's modded for Figure 8.
Guessing partly for background vocals, so whichever Beatle wasn't on lead vocals... The other two could sing call/response and/or harmony.
Chris
George sent them a short text:
"Go figure."

(Sorry - not as experienced in pro audio humor as Chris.)
Old 16th December 2021
  #73
Gear Guru
 
chessparov2.0's Avatar
 
That might actually be a blessing, in disguise.

Hmm... Now should I throw a U47/48 cap, in my MXL V69. Or a CK12?

I wonder which one Klaus thinks,
might make it sound magical?

Chris
Old 17th December 2021 | Show parent
  #74
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Ghost In The Attic's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by musicsound-2 ➡️
I am using a U47w (Wagner) since a lot of years and it is very very good.
I quite like mine too.
Old 21st December 2021
  #75
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woodsman's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
an observation- some posts on the first page from january 2021 claim it will cost 12-20K to acquire one. what has happened in the past year to cause the prices to jump up ? i have seen them around 29k on vintage king. i am kind of in the club, my band purchased a u48 with a nuvistor replacement tube serial # 501 so am a part owner. i appreciate all you guys sharing your knowledge !! john
Old 21st December 2021 | Show parent
  #76
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Paul_G's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by woodsman ➡️
an observation- some posts on the first page from january 2021 claim it will cost 12-20K to acquire one. what has happened in the past year to cause the prices to jump up ? i have seen them around 29k on vintage king. i am kind of in the club, my band purchased a u48 with a nuvistor replacement tube serial # 501 so am a part owner. i appreciate all you guys sharing your knowledge !! john
That original price is still about right. VK have jacked up prices beyond the norm.
A Nuvistor would be on the lower side.
Old 22nd December 2021
  #77
Gear Addict
 
spectrasound's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by om28e ➡️
Can anyone tell me some good places to look for a vintage U-47? I wish I didn't like the mic but I do. Too much. Thanks for the help!
I have 2 vintage U47s for sale, PM for photos & details.
[email protected]
Old 8th January 2022 | Show parent
  #78
Gear Addict
 
🎧 10 years
Abbey road purchased u48s With both u47 heads and u48 heads together.

Lester Smith tell all the secrets

https://youtu.be/KL5WaY4tUPE
AT 31 minutes.
Old 16th January 2022 | Show parent
  #79
Here for the gear
 
🎧 5 years
I second the auditioning recommendation as well as vintage king. I was fortunate six years ago, when they were still in the $15k range, to audition three different ones at their Ferndale location, using a broom closet as a vocal booth, with a friend of mine with the right pipes to know the results. The one I bought was a shining star and I've been a happy owner ever since.

Clip of the winner:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1qGm...w?usp=drivesdk
Old 16th January 2022 | Show parent
  #80
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Ghost In The Attic's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Waveburner32 ➡️
What a beautiful voice and talent. Would you be willing to post a completely dry version? We could do it by PM if you prefer. I would love to have that clip for reference.

You got a winner U47 there.
Old 21st January 2022 | Show parent
  #81
Gear Addict
 
🎧 10 years
I suspect that the U48 body specs is specifically made for U48. has a different resistance value than the official U47 resistance value. For this type a bit in between.

? 1. When I swapped a vf14 tube for a other vf14. Is it a Frankenstein U47 .
2. If I swapped the membrame k47 for an other old k47 is itt a Frankenstein mic?
3. When will be a Frankenstein mic . A Frankenstein mic?

Last edited by QueenSisi; 21st January 2022 at 11:00 PM..
Old 24th January 2022
  #82
Here for the gear
 
🎧 15 years
I'm thinking if you can afford a real U47, and then would seem to know what they are...you should be able to figure out where to find one by yourself. I am serious. If you are THAT into recording, be it business or hobby....you should know. Me I'd never spend that kind of coin. I just sold 3 vintage u87's . Consecutive s/n 1968's and a '75 from the hit factory in nyc after they closed. Nice mic's not for sure comparable ones out there for much less. Don't get trapped in the hype.
Old 25th January 2022 | Show parent
  #83
Gear Head
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by sleshnyc ➡️
I will try to save a lot of people time and post all the proper responses.

1. All you really need is vocal lessons
2. If you don't know where to buy one you obviously can't understand or appreciate a vintage U47
3. It sounds like you couldn't tell the difference between a vintage U47 and an sm57
4. Just buy a Fearn mic pre.
5. Just buy a sheffield mic pre.
6. If you record your guitar parts with a strat instead of a les paul it will free up the frequency ranges that are being masked by your current mic and you really only need to buy another Distressor.
7. Upgrade your Pro Tools
8. The Warm Audio mic is exactly the same.
9. Don't even consider Warm Audio
10. Flea makes a perfect copy of a vintage 47
11. I've heard the Flea and it sounds nothing like my buddy's U47.

Hope this helps.
This response should be canonized.

Also add: what’s your room like? If you haven’t spent $500k on your room you don’t deserve any good microphones.
Old 26th February 2022 | Show parent
  #84
Gear Addict
 
🎧 10 years
What would be the values of the resisters in a combi mic U47/U48
Old 2nd March 2022 | Show parent
  #85
Gear Head
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by sonicdom ➡️
I'd only buy a U47 that I could check out in person, no matter where it comes from. If the mic is with a dealer in the US it will be 'the best mic they ever had' even if it's a total dud, so buying from a respected dealer doesn't ensure it's a good sounding mic at all.

I've heard many U47's and only very few of them actually had 'that' sound. The Flea 47 is a great microphone, certainly better than most real ones I encountered, but it doesn't hold up so well against a great U47.
don’t laugh but that’s also my rule with vintage Ludwig drums. Some are beautiful but some are not even round or the same size each side of the shell. Blame Ed Sullivan. I’ve recorded with a 47 and I loved it. But as a producer, spending 20K on one is out of the question. Unfortunately, it’s just not gonna make the song any more popular. But they are special, that’s for sure.
Old 3rd March 2022
  #86
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dbjp's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
My goodness me. Crazy prices.
Really wondering how much my large badge U47 is right now. Purchased for around 12K over 10 years ago I think, and has a VF14 in there. Felt like a lot back then but seems like it was a good investment! Sounds great too.
Old 6th March 2022
  #87
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Rumi's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 15 years
What is a normal price for a Wagner these days?
Are they still in production at all?
Old 7th March 2022
  #88
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Wiggy Neve Slut's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
I’d say £10k and no longer on production.
Old 8th March 2022 | Show parent
  #89
Gear Addict
 
joelfarr's Avatar
 
2 Reviews written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by sleshnyc ➡️
I will try to save a lot of people time and post all the proper responses.

1. All you really need is vocal lessons
2. If you don't know where to buy one you obviously can't understand or appreciate a vintage U47
3. It sounds like you couldn't tell the difference between a vintage U47 and an sm57
4. Just buy a Fearn mic pre.
5. Just buy a sheffield mic pre.
6. If you record your guitar parts with a strat instead of a les paul it will free up the frequency ranges that are being masked by your current mic and you really only need to buy another Distressor.
7. Upgrade your Pro Tools
8. The Warm Audio mic is exactly the same.
9. Don't even consider Warm Audio
10. Flea makes a perfect copy of a vintage 47
11. I've heard the Flea and it sounds nothing like my buddy's U47.

Hope this helps.
LOL. The best response!
Old 8th March 2022 | Show parent
  #90
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Rumi's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wiggy Neve Slut ➡️
I’d say £10k and no longer on production.
Thank you! Good to know.
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