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Lexicon PCM 42 and PCM 41 -- differences ??
Old 6th February 2007
  #1
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Lexicon PCM 42 and PCM 41 -- differences ??

OK, another thread comparing 2 pieces of gear from the same manufacturer.

HOW DIFFERENT are these 2 pieces of gear from each other ? Is it a "night" and "day" difference in terms of the quality of the delay and sound ??

I know the PCM 42 is famous for overloading the input. Does the PCM 41 react in the same way ?

I'm looking for a great outboard delay box to route into the console, mostly for guitar and vox. Been thinking either PCM 42 or TC 2290.

Would the PCM 41 pale in comparison the the PCM 42 ?? If so, could anyone explain why they are so different ?
Old 6th February 2007
  #2
Led
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🎧 15 years
Hi, there's a few threads explaining all this, but the short story is the 42 has a 2 stage limiter on the input that gives it a bit of a tape delay sound. The 41 does not. There is more to it than that, try searching as it will explain it better than I can.
Cheers
Old 6th February 2007 | Show parent
  #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Led ➑️
Hi, there's a few threads explaining all this, but the short story is the 42 has a 2 stage limiter on the input that gives it a bit of a tape delay sound. The 41 does not. There is more to it than that, try searching as it will explain it better than I can.
Cheers
Led,


That's why I posted, because I searched and searched on GS and could not find anything.

Guess I'll try again.
Old 6th February 2007 | Show parent
  #4
Led
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🎧 15 years
Hi, this thread has a bit of info in it.

https://www.gearslutz.com/board/showthrea...ighlight=pcm42
Cheers
Old 6th February 2007 | Show parent
  #5
member no 666
 
Fletcher's Avatar
 
🎧 20 years
I guess I never hit the input limiters on those things because I have found I prefer the PCM-41 to the PCM 42 on a sonic level... it seems a bit darker and richer to me which is what I like about it... its not as fast to use as the 42 as you don't have the digital readout display on the 41 like you do on the 42 but I have no problem timing my stuff out using a snare drum on the input and turning the knob unit I like the feel of the delay in the pocket.

As always, YMMV.
Old 7th February 2007 | Show parent
  #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletcher ➑️
I guess I never hit the input limiters on those things because I have found I prefer the PCM-41 to the PCM 42 on a sonic level... it seems a bit darker and richer to me which is what I like about it... its not as fast to use as the 42 as you don't have the digital readout display on the 41 like you do on the 42 but I have no problem timing my stuff out using a snare drum on the input and turning the knob unit I like the feel of the delay in the pocket.

As always, YMMV.
Hey Fletcher,

Thanks for your feedback! So you really think the PCM 41 is a good delay box ? I'm asking because I have a chance to get one pretty darn cheap compared to what a PCM 42 would cost me.

That's why I wanted to know if there is a "night" and "day" difference betwenn the 2 boxes; because the difference in price would make you think there was.

Also, how would the PCM 41 delay (used with a Trident 80 console) compare to using PT Mix TDM plug-in delay like Echo Farm ??

I actually like Echo Farm for electric guitar, but I'm wondering how much better will a dedicated outboard delay box be for this application ?

I'm definitely looking for that "in your face" sound that people claim to get with the PCM 42.

Is there another way to get this sound with the PCM 41 ? Like, using an analog compressor in conjunction with it ??
Old 7th February 2007 | Show parent
  #7
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Tetness's Avatar
 
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🎧 15 years
I'd rather have the 42. More vibey of a sound. If you can grab one, you won't be dissapointed.
Old 7th February 2007 | Show parent
  #8
member no 666
 
Fletcher's Avatar
 
🎧 20 years
More "vibey" of a sound? Have you ever heard them next to each other? I have, and frankly, once you get past the display thing, I can't tell them apart [from a sonic perspective].
Old 7th February 2007 | Show parent
  #9
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thethrillfactor's Avatar
 
4 Reviews written
🎧 20 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by sage691 ➑️

I'm definitely looking for that "in your face" sound that people claim to get with the PCM 42.
Man how do rumors get started?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sage691 ➑️
Is there another way to get this sound with the PCM 41 ? Like, using an analog compressor in conjunction with it ??
The answer is no. And yes there is a slight difference in character between the PCM41 and PCM42.

I would say if you want the PCM 42 character on the cheap look for a used Lexicon 1300S digital audio daisy synchronizer. It has the PCM 42 electronics minus the regeneration/feedback/modulation controls.
Old 8th February 2007 | Show parent
  #10
Harmless Wacko
 
🎧 20 years
Both cool boxes.

Ya need at least 2 of each.

HOHOHO.

Hey... it's GS... WhaddaYaExpect?

Buy... Buy everything... Then you'll be safe.

SM.
Old 8th February 2007 | Show parent
  #11
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1 Review written
🎧 15 years
LOL!

B.
Old 8th February 2007 | Show parent
  #12
Gear Addict
 
jslstrat's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
PCM 41

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletcher ➑️
I guess I never hit the input limiters on those things because I have found I prefer the PCM-41 to the PCM 42 on a sonic level... it seems a bit darker and richer to me which is what I like about it... its not as fast to use as the 42 as you don't have the digital readout display on the 41 like you do on the 42 but I have no problem timing my stuff out using a snare drum on the input and turning the knob unit I like the feel of the delay in the pocket.

As always, YMMV.
I bought a PCM 41 a few years back.Love It......Did a search and most BIG budget studios had a pair of PCM 41,s It has a cool dark warm grainy sound. But yet still clear delays in the mix. Does that make sence? I really have to say Fletcher seems to have a good ear. I dont know him. But every time I have bought a piece
of gear, Trident 80B, iZ radar, Urei La3a....I find a post that Fletcher raves about the pieces!!! So It makes me feel good. We both must have good ears.)))))))))
Old 1st February 2009 | Show parent
  #13
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TinderArts's Avatar
 
🎧 20 years
What I loved about the 41 was being able to quickly switch from a 1/16th note to an 1/8th note and 1/4 note delay once you dialed the basic tempo in.

Both devices are much fun.
Old 1st February 2009 | Show parent
  #14
Registered User
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by jslstrat ➑️
I bought a PCM 41 a few years back.Love It......Did a search and most BIG budget studios had a pair of PCM 41
Many studios use PCM 41's as predelays on plates. That is by far the most common use that I have seen. it is cool to see people using them in a mix.
Old 1st February 2009 | Show parent
  #15
Registered User
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletcher ➑️
Have you ever heard them next to each other? I have, and frankly, once you get past the display thing, I can't tell them apart [from a sonic perspective].
Yes I have heard them side by side and I am having trouble believing that you did and didn't hear a difference. Perhaps you didn't bother to push the inputs, because if you did and you didn't hear a difference then something is wrong and it aint with the gear.
Old 6th August 2009 | Show parent
  #16
Registered User
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletcher ➑️
I have found I prefer the PCM-41 to the PCM 42 on a sonic level... it seems a bit darker and richer to me which is what I like about it
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletcher ➑️
More "vibey" of a sound? Have you ever heard them next to each other? I have, and frankly, once you get past the display thing, I can't tell them apart [from a sonic perspective].
So, which is it then? Do you find one "a bit darker and richer" or "can't tell them apart [from a sonic perspective]"?
Old 6th August 2009 | Show parent
  #17
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Drumsound's Avatar
 
🎧 20 years
The PCM 41 sounds great and is easy to use. It can be simple or whacky, but usually awesome!
Old 14th March 2010 | Show parent
  #18
Registered User
 
🎧 10 years
I've had my PCM 41 years, sounds great. I use that with Roland SDE3000's as my main delays, they sound great on guitar, easy to dail in a great sound. Not to get off topic but I got an Empress Superday(pedal) that has great analog sounds!
Old 13th January 2011 | Show parent
  #19
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🎧 10 years
SDE3000
Old 13th January 2011 | Show parent
  #20
Gear Head
 
InjuredEar's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Didn't the PCM 41 have much shorter delay times? I also remember it was easy to make it do GREAT flanging/chorusing.

-Greg
Old 10th May 2011 | Show parent
  #21
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1 Review written
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Dude just get the PSP Lexicon 42 plug-in... it sounds just like it and you don't have to repair plugins. Also reccomend the sQuad pack. McQ and ConsoleQ are my favorite EQ plugins of all time. They're a little intense on the CPU, but it's definitely worth it.

The sound of the 42 is killer for so much stuff. It even works on drums sometimes... Trash city, in a good way.
Old 10th May 2011 | Show parent
  #22
Registered User
 
🎧 15 years
PSP42 has a plastic and less organic sound not comparable to PCM41 or PCM42. For me the best delay plug-in is soundtoys echoboy but vintage lexicon delays rocks!!! 42 and 41 do not sound exactly similar but both are amazing delays.
Old 10th May 2011 | Show parent
  #23
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jono_3's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
I have a pcm 41 and think it sounds fantastic
Old 11th May 2011 | Show parent
  #24
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ha ! ha !

It's pretty funny to see a thread i started over 4 years ago resurrected.

Since that time I have learned so much that I could write a novel about it.

I have sold a 2" tape machine, a sh*tload of hi end analog compressors, and a few outboard FX machines (including a PCM 41).

One of the things I have kept and would likely never consider parting with is my PCm 42.

It gets used on just about every mix in one fashion or another. When i have a track where the main vocal needs to be big, lush, forward, and dominant it provides (IMHO) and very integral part of what constitutes that sound. Even with a great sounding U47 thru the best pre, that vocal will definitely be missing something important without the PCM 42 in the mix.

It can also be the BOMB for a delay on a guitar riff that needs to cut thru a very dense mix, yet still remain tucked behind other more dominate instruments.

The 41, on the other hand, sounded quite dull by comparison and it was a no brainer to sell it rather quickly after hearing the 42.
Old 11th May 2011 | Show parent
  #25
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TonyBelmont's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by psykostx ➑️
Dude just get the PSP Lexicon 42 plug-in... it sounds just like it and you don't have to repair plugins.
No way.... I have both here (actually... I have multiple PCM42's), and there is a MAJOR difference in terms of "sound".

I love the PCM42... Best digital delay ever (although, there are other strong contenders).
Old 11th May 2011 | Show parent
  #26
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elambo's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 15 years
Lexicon blessed the PSP plugin but don't let that confuse you -- it's not a software version of the 42, not by a long shot.

I've actually brought EchoBoy closer to that sound.
Old 11th May 2011 | Show parent
  #27
member no 666
 
Fletcher's Avatar
 
🎧 20 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hammer Mark ➑️
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletcher ➑️
I have found I prefer the PCM-41 to the PCM 42 on a sonic level... it seems a bit darker and richer to me which is what I like about it

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fletcher ➑️
More "vibey" of a sound? Have you ever heard them next to each other? I have, and frankly, once you get past the display thing, I can't tell them apart [from a sonic perspective].
So, which is it then? Do you find one "a bit darker and richer" or "can't tell them apart [from a sonic perspective]"?
From a year and a half ago - though I think clarification is required. Yes, I can tell the difference, which is kind of subtle - and yes, I prefer the sound of the PCM-41... and no - I never drive the input too hard leaving headroom in the unit. Perhaps I missed something cool... but delays aren't where I tend to want to get into changing the sound... time / vibe / feel yes, sound - not so much.
Old 11th May 2011 | Show parent
  #28
Lives for gear
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by elambo ➑️
Lexicon blessed the PSP plugin but don't let that confuse you -- it's not a software version of the 42, not by a long shot.

I've actually brought EchoBoy closer to that sound.
It's a pretty recognizable delay. You can crank the input on the PSP and it has a decent break-up as most PSP plugs do... they sound very analog, but I guess you are right, they sound like cheaper analog gear as plugins tend to do. The chorus sounds pretty great as long as you don't overdo it... great for that Shpongle "ping-pong" drum effect... it's close enough not to spend $1200 for one. You could buy a bunch of plugins for the same price as the box... in this case it might be worth it, ya know?

The PSP 42 is pretty close in my opinion. The PSP MCI emulation is pretty good sounding, especially on guitar. The Amek eq emulation is great on drums, roll off some highs and it's smooth yet still snappy. It's worth it over buying a $1200 piece of outboard ... there's better things to spend money on IMO. Like hardware compression, every software compressor sounds like a cheaper DBX or an Alesis 3630 to me... except a few that are slightly better. Again, my opinion.
Old 11th May 2011 | Show parent
  #29
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
Like Thrill said, you can grab a Lex 1300S for under $100. Great for pre delay and the overdrive trick but no modulation/feedback. Another decent under $100 delay is the Yamaha D1500. The next delay Yamaha put out after it is the coveted D5000. Good luck ever finding a deal on that model. I'm partial to the Deltalab delay sound also which you can find very cheap. I have no plans on ever selling my DL-2 which I've had since the early 80's.
Old 12th May 2011 | Show parent
  #30
Gear Guru
 
elambo's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by psykostx ➑️
it's close enough not to spend $1200 for one.
For most people, maybe, but for no-holds-barred productions the difference between the plugin and the hardware will be intensely important. HUGE! If Al Schmitt used PSP on Dianna Krall I think most of us would call bullshit. Those are recordings where all the little details are relevant to the big picture.
πŸ“ Reply

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