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Any Korg DSS-1 users? DSSend utility.
Old 1st December 2014
  #1
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Any Korg DSS-1 users? DSSend utility.

Are there any Korg DSS-1 users around? I wrote a very small utility program called DSSend that sends and retrieves systems over MIDI and saves them to files. A beta version is attached if you'd like to give it a try. (Sorry, Windows version only.) It does not support the DSM-1, only the DSS-1.

I had read that disk drives on the DSS-1 are susceptible to going bad. So just in case mine ever did fail I thought I'd write a program to grab all the data on the floppies and save it to hard disk. I've seen that there are a couple of older programs that let you create floppies from disk images, but I didn't see any that let you avoid the disk drive altogether and transfer over MIDI. So that's why I made this. It may be useful to anyone who has a DSS-1 with a broken floppy drive, or if you just want to backup or save without having to buy more blank floppies. I don't know how long my floppies will retain their magnetic personalities.

Yes, it's slower than loading from floppy disk. The Piano system A from factory Disk 1 takes about 195 seconds to send compared to about 45 seconds when loading from floppy. (Although the smallest systems like system C on the same Disk are actually faster over MIDI.) But it's better than nothing if your floppy drive is broken.

This utility is very basic and doesn't allow any sort of editing of systems. It only sends and retrieves entire systems. It maintains the idea of a "Disk" which is a collection of systems that share multisounds. But unlike a real floppy disk a DSSend "Disk" can contain more than four systems.

I'm calling this a beta version in case any there are any minor bugs found or any minor improvements needed. (Let me know.) To use DSSend, first setup the MIDI ports and channel using the MIDI menu. Make sure your MIDI connections are OK. Click the New button to begin a new blank disk. Then click the Receive button to retrieve the current system from the DSS-1. Once you have gotten all the systems you want from the DSS-1, click the SaveAs button to save all to a file (with extension .dssdsk). You can rename systems and disks. The arrow buttons let you reorder systems in the list.

I have about 57 factory disks I could eventually make available in DSSend format if I could find a place to put them online. There are more disks at this DSS-1 site but I don't know the file formats of those files.
Attached Files
File Type: zip DSSend_1.0_18Dec2014.zip (1.07 MB, 471 views)

Last edited by minorguy; 21st December 2014 at 07:01 PM.. Reason: Updated attachment to version 1.0
Old 1st December 2014
  #2
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Hollowman9's Avatar
I used to own a DSS-1 and it is an awesome machine. It's really cool that you have made this program and are offering it in support of DSS-1 owners. Very commendable!
Old 1st December 2014
  #3
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robot gigante's Avatar
 
2 Reviews written
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Cool, thanks!
Old 1st December 2014
  #4
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Ignore the version 0.1 that I originally put there as it had a problem.
Old 21st December 2014
  #5
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I just wanted to give a small bump because I updated the DSSend program (the attachment in the first post).

DSSend can now export all the Sounds in a System to Wave files. It can also export all the Multisounds in a System to Soundfont2 files. The Wave and Soundfont2 files are collected into zip files so they don't make a mess when you do the export. To export, select the System you want to export and then choose "Export" from the main menu.

Wave files normally don't have loops, so a separate text file lists the loop points.

The Soundfont2 files only contain the Multisound information. They do not contain parameters of the DSS-1 programs. I could have implemented those so you at least get closer to the actual sound that was on the DSS-1. But I didn't bother to go that far, partly because there's no way to represent the digital delays in SF2.

One incentive I had for exporting the SF2 files was to import them into my Kronos. Although this works, I encountered one snag: the sounds may be slightly out of tune. Kronos only supports certain sample rates. Most of the samples in the DSS-1 have a sample rate of 32KHz. Apparently Kronos doesn't support that rate and so the sounds will be slightly out of tune (although it imports fine otherwise). So after importing you need to go into the multisample edit page and adjust the pitch of each sample in the multisample. (It's usually off by less than 50 cents). I don't know of a solution for this. But at least it's easier than having to load individual WAV files and map and loop them. The soundfonts might work fine when importing them into other samples players, but I don't know. I only tried the Kronos.

Ok, back to your regularly scheduled program.
Old 21st December 2014
  #6
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It should be possible to keep the loop points integral to the wav file should it not, or is it the DSS-1 that doesn't dump the loop points as part of its data?
Old 21st December 2014 | Show parent
  #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by apprenticemart2 ➑️
It should be possible to keep the loop points integral to the wav file should it not, or is it the DSS-1 that doesn't dump the loop points as part of its data?
I had read somewhere that loops aren't normally included in a WAV file, so I stopped there. But I see that there is a "smpl" chunk that can be added that contains loop info. Perhaps I'll add that and then post an update, not sure when though.
(I also considered importing disk images from this site, but that would take a long time to figure out and so most likely I won't.)
Old 21st December 2014
  #8
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 10 years
You could do a quick resample at e.g. 44.1 before saving the SF2. I don't have a DSS-1 but I'd like one!
Old 21st December 2014 | Show parent
  #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by masstronaut ➑️
You could do a quick resample at e.g. 44.1 before saving the SF2.
Yeah, in the case of the Kronos it would be better to go from 32KHz to 48KHz, then I can just turn every two samples into three samples. Although I don't think that's the most accurate way to do it, which is what stopped me. I never tried it anyway just to see if it solved the tuning issue.
For the general case, 44.1 would be better. I may try just doing interpolation to see how it comes out.
Quote:
Originally Posted by masstronaut ➑️
I don't have a DSS-1 but I'd like one!
I expect it's harder to buy and sell DSS-1s that have non-functioning floppy disks. That's why I thought a program like this might come in handy. And, although floppies can last a long time, they don't last forever. Recently I noticed that I have at least one that got partially corrupted because it's so old.
One nice thing about the DSS-1 is the analog filter. So it can sound like a DW-8000 but with samples as oscillators. No portamento though . (unless you spring for a modification.)
Old 22nd December 2014
  #10
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I'd like to have those old DSS1 sounds in my Kronos! My old DSS1 has a broken floppy, though I do have a replacement around somewhere that I never got around to putting in. The board sounded great, though... and also had one of the best synth actions I ever played. Too big and heavy to gig with these days, and of course there were the slow load times, but it's still a great board. I had read that its samples were the foundation for the M1, but the DSS1 has that nice 12-bit grunge (the M1 was 16-bit), and all the analog processing.
Old 22nd December 2014
  #11
Oli
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Hey nice work. I got one modded with USB etc, but this is pretty great.
Old 11th January 2015
  #12
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cool idea

I own two of these: one with the SD card emulator and one with a floppy drive that still works. I'll have to try this nonetheless.
Old 17th March 2015
  #13
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I just wanted to include an addendum to this for posterity. I briefly revisited the issue with the wave and soundfont exports being out of tune. I resampled the samples to more common rates using the r8brain library. It turns out the problem is not that the Kronos doesn't handle the DSS-1 sample rate, but rather I think there's something strange about the DSS-1. It's as if the sample rate isn't 32000 but something a bit less than that. Perhaps 32000 is just nominal. If I assume the original sample is about 31500 and then resample up to 32000 things get more in tune, however each sample is different depending on the original key. There's a roughly linear relationship to original key, but not exact. So no easy formula as far as I can tell. (This is not a Kronos issue since it's the same when importing to a software SF2 player.) Perhaps all DSS-1 samples were made by sampling directly into the DSS-1 so it doesn't matter what the sample rates are exactly. I don't know what's going on inside.

Anyway, I decided it wasn't worth spending more time on. If you're importing to a player like the Kronos that can tune samples, it seems it's just better to do that manually. For other players the samples will just be out of tune.
Old 18th May 2015
  #14
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You can also take a look to VSTizer DSS-1 plugin. It performs all upload/download over MIDI and they have transformed all floppy from Korg into VST banks. All the communication is performed over RTP-MIDI open standard (supported by Apple, Yamaha, Behringer, KissBox, iConnectivity, etc... )
And the version 2.0 of the plugin announced last week now allows to create multisounds, and to import WAV files directly in the multisound (rather than sampling with the DSS-1 )
The plugin is available under Mac and Windows, and can also be used as a standalone application.
Old 18th May 2015
  #15
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Thanks for the info. I wasn't aware of KissBox or the VSTizer DSS-1 plugin. Note that you must buy their hardware to get the license for their plugin, so it's not free.
Old 31st May 2015
  #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by minorguy ➑️
Are there any Korg DSS-1 users around? I wrote a very small utility program called DSSend that sends and retrieves systems over MIDI and saves them to files. A beta version is attached if you'd like to give it a try. (Sorry, Windows version only.)
Hi, I just got a DSS-1 with a bad disk drive, and I was just wondering what Windows OS is necessary to run this utility. I tried it on XP SP3 and it says that it is not a valid application.
Old 1st June 2015 | Show parent
  #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by junglebrah ➑️
Hi, I just got a DSS-1 with a bad disk drive, and I was just wondering what Windows OS is necessary to run this utility. I tried it on XP SP3 and it says that it is not a valid application.
I had only tested it on Windows 7. Today I tried rebuilding it for XP so that it doesn't give the valid application error. But there is still some other issue after that. Unfortunately I'm not set up to debug on XP and I need to reboot for each debug cycle, so it may take me some time to find the problem. If I do I'll post an update.
Old 2nd June 2015 | Show parent
  #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by minorguy ➑️
I had only tested it on Windows 7.
Word thanks. I just loaded it on to my Windows 7 machine and it works good.

I have been able to get it to send the system from the DSS-1 to the computer, but I can't seem to get it to receive back from the computer. It keeps saying "Data Load Error!" on the DSS-1 and a window pops up that says "Program Read Failed" on the utility. Have you ever encountered that before? It looks like the error happens when trying to load the multisounds; it sits at 1% for about one second and then throws up the error. The one that I sent to the computer just had a single 4 second sample.


Edit:
Well I have been messing with it more, and I got it to load a hand drawn waveform, but it still doesn't seem to want to load a sample.

Last edited by junglebrah; 2nd June 2015 at 02:22 AM..
Old 2nd June 2015
  #19
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Thanks. I have not encountered that problem. But I'll take a look as soon as I can.
BTW, a hand drawn waveform is a sample, right? Maybe it has something to do with the size.
Old 2nd June 2015 | Show parent
  #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by minorguy ➑️
Thanks. I have not encountered that problem. But I'll take a look as soon as I can.
BTW, a hand drawn waveform is a sample, right? Maybe it has something to do with the size.
Yes I believe that it is a sample. I was thinking that maybe the size is the key as well. The single-cycle wave is astronomically smaller than a 4 second sample.

Thanks for coming up with this utility. It can (at the VERY least) save a killer patch that has a full parameter set. Let me know if you have a chance to upload any disk files; I would love to try and send them to my DSS-1.
Old 6th June 2015
  #21
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Just to follow up, after a couple of PMs it turns out that the trouble junglebrah was having was due to the MIDI interface not handing SysEx well. So no problem with the DSSend program.

BTW, I've made the DSS-1 factory disks that I have available at:

http://1drv.ms/1AKNpGI

Also to be found there is an update to version 1.2 which adds Windows XP compatibility.

If anyone would like to pass along more disk files in DSSend format that'd be cool.
Old 19th August 2015
  #22
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I updated DSSend to version 1.3 which can be found at:

http://1drv.ms/1AKNpGI

This update adds the ability to read native files, which are the same files the DSS-1 writes to its floppy disks. A native file disk consists of one .DS1 file and several .DMS files, one for each multisound. To load a disk, click the open button and open a .DS1 file. The .DMS files are then loaded automatically if they're in the same folder. Then send the systems to the DSS-1. DSSend doesn't save to native files, it only reads them.

Some disks can be found here under the Sound Files section:

Downloads | Straylight Engineering

Thanks to teesquared for pointing out the files to me. Unfortuantely DSSend only supports the unmodified DSS-1 and doesn't handle systems that are too big to fit into it.
Old 16th February 2016
  #23
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I’ve now made the source code for the DSSend program available. You can find it here. I did it mostly because the license of the JUCE GUI requires it, but also because…why not?? See the Downloads section there for a Windows executable.

Currently I have no plans for updating it further since I got distracted by other projects. (ahem, Solaris)
Old 4th January 2017
  #24
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hello. the link to the updated version is no longer a valid address, does anyone know where to find it? i have been dreaming of an application to do exactly this for my old samples from my DSS1 !!!! i just hope i didn't find it too late. i tried using the 1.0 thats in the first post but i keep getting an {error: read error} box. running it on windows 7 SP3. thanks
Old 4th January 2017 | Show parent
  #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JBENDER ➑️
hello. the link to the updated version is no longer a valid address, does anyone know where to find it? i have been dreaming of an application to do exactly this for my old samples from my DSS1 !!!! i just hope i didn't find it too late. i tried using the 1.0 thats in the first post but i keep getting an {error: read error} box. running it on windows 7 SP3. thanks
I probably didn't make it very clear. To get the latest executable for version 1.3 go to this page. Then click on the "Downloads" link on the left. (Or just go directly to it here.) Click on the ZIP file to download it.

Unfortunately I can no longer edit the posts further up to warn people that the links no longer work. :(

Here's an updated link to some of the factory disks I saved. I'm not sure how long this will stay valid though.

https://1drv.ms/f/s!Ap9UObkIEwgung0WFXrtW33aL6bX
Old 4th January 2017
  #26
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🎧 5 years
thank you so much. i believe i have imported the dsk files but when i go to export as WAV or SF DSSend quits abruptly. is this something you have experienced?
thank you
Old 4th January 2017 | Show parent
  #27
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robot gigante's Avatar
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by minorguy ➑️
I’ve now made the source code for the DSSend program available. You can find it here. I did it mostly because the license of the JUCE GUI requires it, but also because…why not?? See the Downloads section there for a Windows executable.

Currently I have no plans for updating it further since I got distracted by other projects. (ahem, Solaris)
Thanks for doing that.

Quote:
Currently the code only supports the Windows platform. It is almost cross-platform except for the MIDI code (which I wrote myself long ago). It should be pretty straightforward to change this to use the MIDI support available in JUCE and then the program should be fully cross-platform. I just never got around to doing that.
I would love to see this cross-platform as it crashes in WINE right after it opens. I'm still pretty new to JUCE, just haven't had enough time to get into it. Straightforward enough for a JUCE noob to change this do you think? If not, if you ever find the time to do it, some of us would be eternally grateful... At least I would!
Old 4th January 2017 | Show parent
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JBENDER ➑️
thank you so much. i believe i have imported the dsk files but when i go to export as WAV or SF DSSend quits abruptly. is this something you have experienced?
thank you
I haven't seen that one. I sent you a PM.

Quote:
Originally Posted by robot gigante ➑️
I would love to see this cross-platform as it crashes in WINE right after it opens. I'm still pretty new to JUCE, just haven't had enough time to get into it. Straightforward enough for a JUCE noob to change this do you think? If not, if you ever find the time to do it, some of us would be eternally grateful... At least I would!
Not sure if you are on Mac or Linux. But either way....I don't own a Mac, and I don't have Linux set up and unfortunately I don't have time to get into all that now.

I don't think you necessarily need to know JUCE because ideally you just need to rebuild.
But if you run into compilation issues you need to fix that and then it might mean changing code. Anyway, you would need to know enough to install and set up the required libraries. (I could probably get rid of the Boost library to makes things a bit easier, but I originally hadn't planned on releasing the source.)

Edit: Opps, sorry. It's been a while since I worked on this and I was not even reading what I wrote. You cannot just rebuild for Mac or Linux. The MIDI code in DSSend is not cross-platform. It could be if it were changed to use the JUCE midi code, but I haven't done that.

Last edited by minorguy; 4th January 2017 at 08:28 PM.. Reason: correction
Old 4th January 2017
  #29
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Good to know! I'll give it a go. My main computer is Linux but I use Mac as well.

The Boost library is not really an issue, it's already installed on my machine.
Old 19th March 2018
  #30
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Korg DSS-1 disk drive broken

I friend came to my home with a Korg dss-1, he wanted to put it in the rubbish because It does not make sound. Somebody gave him this machine because is moving to another place.

There are no disks and I tried to use the disk drive and seems broken.
I know that the Korg dss-1 is working because I can create sounds using "Create Waveform" function.

Then I found this post. I downloaded the last version, and a disk image.
I only have a Windows 10, but DSSend seems to work on It.

When I tried to send something to the Korg dss-1 appear the windows "Sending System" but It stay in 0% for ever.

Is necessary to put the Korg dss-1 in a specific mode? I must to select a specific midi channel? How you configure and what are the instructions step by step to use DSSend?

Thanks in advance
Joniuz
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