Quantcast
100% Pure Analog! (How?) - Page 6 - Gearspace.com
The No.1 Website for Pro Audio
100% Pure Analog! (How?)
Old 20th March 2014 | Show parent
  #151
Gear Maniac
 
kosmoflot's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by kjukambe ➑️
actually, it does. it adds texture to the sound, and the sound itself is music. i like kosmoflot's tracks sound very much.

and there is inevitable analog simulation, crucial for the digital domain - it is called dithering
thanks man!

Recording in analog way will not necessary make your music better or worse, It's just going to be different... (as been said earlier)...
When I'm recording on cassette, and in my case everything has to be recorded in one take, does discipline me...
I know I can always rewrite the cassette but it's not going to be the same...
To me cassettes are like polaroids... there's never exactly the same polaroid... because it's physical... never exactly the same cassette because of the physics...
I've used to be a scratcher with a metal band around here in yearly 00's... gig's, rehearsals and all...
I tried to get around Reason those days... but it never cut it for me... I got bored after half an hour clicking in it. I know I can put Logic or Ablenton on my mac... but... well... you see....
It's the easy path... where everything can be quantised, synced, whatever... and I never was looking for one...
I don't mind coming to my friend's place with my brutes and recording some mayhem together through his ****tiest sound card in Logic... I just know it's 0101000101 in the end...
I know my sound could be little better with a better tape deck (sadly right now my financial situation is real crape so I have to stick with what I have...)

and there's nothing like going out to the park with your ghettoblaster loaded with your very own home made cassette, rolling a spliff and enjoying your music)

P.S. I don't know maybe that is a rhetorical or philosophical post or whatever... not really sure if it's on topic but anyway...
Old 20th March 2014 | Show parent
  #152
Lives for gear
 
Seccione's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Anyone with experience of Aphex 104 Aural Exciter C2 / Big Bottom?

I just psyched myself interested. Is is all sh*t?
The idea would be to revive some sparkle before/after cassette.
Old 20th March 2014 | Show parent
  #153
Lives for gear
 
Barfunkel's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seccione ➑️
Anyone with experience of Aphex 104 Aural Exciter C2 / Big Bottom?

I just psyched myself interested. Is is all sh*t?
The idea would be to revive some sparkle before/after cassette.
No idea about the Aphex, but aren't exciters basically just a hoax? I had a BBE Sonic Maximizer. Sounded like a really harsh EQ, it just made things sound a lot worse.
Old 20th March 2014 | Show parent
  #154
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Barfunkel ➑️
No idea about the Aphex, but aren't exciters basically just a hoax? I had a BBE Sonic Maximizer. Sounded like a really harsh EQ, it just made things sound a lot worse.
Not at all. I have an Aphex 103 and it's great if a bit noisy distortion box. It really helps to make a single track cut through. It's good on some drums too. I wouldn't use it on master though. Try to find the original Aphex Exciter, it's more expensive but quieter and more versatile.
Old 20th March 2014 | Show parent
  #155
Lives for gear
 
Seccione's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
^^ I had Behringer's () exciter long time ago. It sounded like crap, as expected, but I kind of saw the point of that stuff, if implemented properly.

What I've understood, the original Aphex implementation adds harmonic content, and then some voodoo blah blah.

The point being, maybe there is something more than EQ'ing going on.
I wouldn't trust that sh*t fixing my bass end, but maybe to restore some high freqs?
Old 20th March 2014
  #156
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
I've come to understand that it creates harmonic distortion therefore "inventing" harmonics and then summing that with the original signal with tuneable crossover point. So basically it is a high frequency distortion unit. There may be more to it but voodoo it isn't.
Old 20th March 2014 | Show parent
  #157
Lives for gear
 
Seccione's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Barfunkel ➑️
No idea about the Aphex, but aren't exciters basically just a hoax? I had a BBE Sonic Maximizer. Sounded like a really harsh EQ, it just made things sound a lot worse.
I found this old S.O.S article which actually explains the difference between brands:

Quote:
Only the Aphex system (and its immediate imitators) are true 'Aural Exciters' which go to the trouble of generating the missing or diminished upper harmonics. Both the BBE and SPL systems (and their ilk) rely more on applying carefully designed dynamic equalisation processes which typically combine a modest recess in the mid-band with a slightly boosted treble region.
Article on S.O.S
Old 20th March 2014 | Show parent
  #158
Gear Maniac
 
kosmoflot's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
I must confess - my knowledge of the exciters/compressors/limiters and other rack mounted processors is practically 0... but on the other hand there's so much to learn!!

but the day before yesterday I've been to my tech and brought him my Alisa 1377 for repairs (finally!!! after 1,5 years! damn I'm lazy)
as well as my "Venec AP-01" which looks like this 100% Pure Analog! (How?)-venec2.jpg
this is a bombous delay/modulator/reverse effect. manual also says it can do flange and chorus effects - but I'm not sure about that - mine would self oscillate and turning it on every time I felt like it's gonna hit me with 220v!!!
hopefully my tech can tame this monster! that thing reeks EVIL!
Old 20th March 2014
  #159
Lives for gear
 
wwjd's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
I meant the quality of the WRITING of the song.... a suck song on digital will STILL suck on analog and vice versa. And a GREAT song is still great on ANY medium. But you all know this.

ALL the failures in analog - compression, tape hysteresis, distortion, roll off, saturation, even mangling the physical tape can be done digitally. ALL of it.

Still nothing wrong with this thread and doing it all old school. :D Have fun! There are no rules.
Old 20th March 2014
  #160
Lives for gear
 
wwjd's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
I have an aphex exciter and enjoy it. It is not a hoax. It is an effect to use and abuse and overuse (Cough)John Mayer vocals(cough)
Old 20th March 2014 | Show parent
  #161
Lives for gear
 
dlmorley's Avatar
 
2 Reviews written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by wwjd ➑️
ALL the failures in analog - compression, tape hysteresis, distortion, roll off, saturation, even mangling the physical tape can be done digitally. ALL of it.
Can ALL the digital failures be done in the analogue domain?

Old 20th March 2014 | Show parent
  #162
Lives for gear
 
wwjd's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by dlmorley ➑️
Can ALL the digital failures be done in the analogue domain?

if by failures you mean perfect, uncolored audio, then sadly, no, analog can not recreate that.

if you wanted to digitally stutter, glitch or recreate so called artifacts, sure an effects box would let you print that to analog tape.
Old 20th March 2014
  #163
Lives for gear
 
pinkerton's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Sure it can theoretically all be done in digital but what's the point if the tape is effortless
Old 20th March 2014
  #164
Lives for gear
 
wwjd's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Oh, I agree. I see no need to add noise, flutter, roll off and other faults to make a great digital recording sound like old crap. But that is just me.
Old 20th March 2014 | Show parent
  #165
Lives for gear
 
Seccione's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
I once saw a movie 'filmed' on digital. It looked like ****.
Old 20th March 2014 | Show parent
  #166
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seccione ➑️
I once saw a movie 'filmed' on digital. It looked like ****.
Really depends on who's doing what. Talented people make good stuff regardless of gear; more a matter of what you enjoy. If I like something, I don't really care how it was done; just need to know if there's something I can use for my own purposes or explores in more detail an area I have an interest in

btw, 28 Days Later was digital. District 9. Zombieland. Girl With The Dragon Tattoo. Gravity... and many others:
List_of_films_shot_in_digital
(yep, a number of 'em do suck, but seriously it's the future and it's now; film is already becoming special feature only)
Old 20th March 2014 | Show parent
  #167
Lives for gear
 
Seccione's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Yes, I know, but this is a analog appreciation thread, and I would like to keep it that way.
Old 20th March 2014 | Show parent
  #168
Gear Maniac
 
kosmoflot's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Well special feature or not whatever....

there is such thing as "industry standards" ... I often work in movie industry... of course everything is shot in digital... doesn't make movie better or worse (I can't stress it enough) in terms of plot, acting, costumes, lighting, camera work etc...
But... there is one BIG BUT.... It's just a binary code!!! It may look pretty it may win 10 oscars... I'm not saying it's **** because it's digital... but I can't touch it!!
and i love to touch things.. i like to shoot real film dammit... develop it, make prints... whatever... as been said "a matter of what you enjoy"

While real film is the real deal... of course very few directors/cameramen would work with film nowadays... but some of them do.

I had a similar discussion while i was involved as a supportive/documentary cameraman in a movie this summer...
so eventually this girl said something like "well there's no difference in photography whether you shoot film or digital, but there is difference whether you shoot film or digital in cinema"... seriously???
For a moment I really wanted to hit her with my film canon EOS... really hard
but then I thought to hell with it... I'm a peaceful cat. Meh... let it be...

I really went off topic here again I think...
Old 20th March 2014
  #169
Lives for gear
 
wwjd's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
that is a very valid comparison and analogy. I'm working with digital film editing now, and can see the direct comparisons: visual & audio. Audio has a 20 year headstart, and digital film is finally catching up to this change over. But it is the same issue presented here that audio went through.

right now, we are adding "film grain", shooting slow analog film style 24 frames per second, and embracing "OFF" coloring like what analog FILM imparts to the production. Everything that was the ONLY option in the past thanks to the limitations of physical film. Why do we add all that? Because digital is colored TOO perfect, the image is TOO clear, the higher frames rates get TOO close to reality. So, we embrace the crap once again - because that is what people are USED TO, not what is best. I prefer 4K, 60 Frames per second, and sometime in the near future, people will get used to it and embrace it..... just like CDs, MP3s, onlien streaming, recording digitally.
Old 20th March 2014 | Show parent
  #170
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seccione ➑️
I once saw a movie 'filmed' on digital. It looked like ****.
Not many places anymore where you can watch NEW films on film..
Old 20th March 2014 | Show parent
  #171
Gear Maniac
 
kosmoflot's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by wwjd ➑️
that is a very valid comparison and analogy. I'm working with digital film editing now, and can see the direct comparisons: visual & audio. Audio has a 20 year headstart, and digital film is finally catching up to this change over. But it is the same issue presented here that audio went through.

right now, we are adding "film grain", shooting slow analog film style 24 frames per second, and embracing "OFF" coloring like what analog FILM imparts to the production. Everything that was the ONLY option in the past thanks to the limitations of physical film. Why do we add all that? Because digital is colored TOO perfect, the image is TOO clear, the higher frames rates get TOO close to reality. So, we embrace the crap once again - because that is what people are USED TO, not what is best. I prefer 4K, 60 Frames per second, and sometime in the near future, people will get used to it and embrace it..... just like CDs, MP3s, onlien streaming, recording digitally.
exactly!!! the head cameraman made me install technicolor Cinestyle to my 5d mkII because it is closer to film and the post processing is easier!
Old 20th March 2014 | Show parent
  #172
Gear Maniac
 
kosmoflot's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Teofunk ➑️
Not many places anymore where you can watch NEW films on film..
But there are some where you can watch old ones
Old 20th March 2014
  #173
Lives for gear
 
wwjd's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
(more preaching)

THE BEST thing about Analog that you, OP, will find out, is it WILL make you a better artist. You will have to fully write and plan out your songs to record them - unless you plan to cut tape? You will organize intsturments to fit well together, decide the flow, maybe even learn to play things for REAL, rather than midi'd. --- if you go FULL ANALOG, Midi doesn't exist.

This is why most older music is "classic" and listenable and a large portion of new stuff sounds like a cut and pasted spreadsheet.... because it is.
One doesn't make a fine meal by wondering pointlessly through many stores, randomly grabbing various foods that don't fit well together, then tossing them on a plate and eating.... you make a fine meal by PLANNING everything out from the cooking to the table ambience, then sit and enjoy the wonderous festivity of eating it. Same with music.
Old 20th March 2014 | Show parent
  #174
Lives for gear
 
wwjd's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by kosmoflot ➑️
exactly!!! the head cameraman made me install technicolor Cinestyle to my 5d mkII because it is closer to film and the post processing is easier!

I never shoot without CINESTYLE profile! Love it! Some whine about lost bits, but to me, the end result is ALL that matters. It equates to Mastering Compression in music, but for video.
Old 20th March 2014 | Show parent
  #175
Lives for gear
 
Seccione's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Wwjd, I already stated not to use midi because my analog synths doesn't have such thing. Also I don't want to use computers for this because I've learned to hate them because of my day job as a programmer. For me, computers are no good for anything else than trolling GS and wathcing porn.

I also had my piece of 'tape cutting' while working at a small radio broadcast station in the late 90's. We already had minidisk at the time, but oldskoolers still preferred r2r for making programming, and I was the poor bastard doing some editing.
Old 20th March 2014 | Show parent
  #176
Gear Maniac
 
kosmoflot's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seccione ➑️
computers are no good for anything else than trolling GS and wathcing porn.
Brilliant!

Seccione with that tape cutting experience you can go Delia Derbishire style recordings... but that would involve hell of a lot r2r recorders though!
Old 20th March 2014 | Show parent
  #177
Lives for gear
 
Seccione's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by kosmoflot ➑️
but that would involve hell of a lot r2r recorders though!
If I only could afford one! :D
Old 20th March 2014 | Show parent
  #178
Lives for gear
 
wwjd's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seccione ➑️
Wwjd, Also I don't want to use computers for this because I've learned to hate them because of my day job as a programmer.

I'm 1000% with you there! I'm a comp tech by trade, so I bought a 24 track digital recorder (Zoom R24)that I PRETEND is an analog tape box. I NEVER mouse, nor stare at a screen, have tactile transport controls and have to feel and sense timing, instead of staring at it on a screen.

Anyway, I wish you luck having a ball in the analog world! If it weren't so heavy, I'd ship you my 16 track analog tape deck to use, but the shipping cost would be 5 times the worth of the unit.
Old 20th March 2014 | Show parent
  #179
Gear Maniac
 
kosmoflot's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by wwjd ➑️
I'm 1000% with you there! I'm a comp tech by trade, so I bought a 24 track digital recorder (Zoom R24)that I PRETEND is an analog tape box. I NEVER mouse, nor stare at a screen, have tactile transport controls and have to feel and sense timing, instead of staring at it on a screen.

Anyway, I wish you luck having a ball in the analog world! If it weren't so heavy, I'd ship you my 16 track analog tape deck to use, but the shipping cost would be 5 times the worth of the unit.
wwjd where are you situated? How much does the unit weights?
Old 20th March 2014 | Show parent
  #180
Lives for gear
 
wwjd's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by kosmoflot ➑️
wwjd where are you situated? How much does the unit weights?
I'm in the middle of the USA, and it probably weighs above 80 pounds. It's not the weight so much as the SIZE it would need packed to survive any shipping. I think the Tascam MSR-16 sells for less than $200 now (I paid $6100!), and the rubber rollers have melted off anyway. Othewise it was awesome! Great memories - unneeded with digital now.
πŸ“ Reply

Similar Threads

Thread / Thread Starter Replies / Views Last Post
replies: 75 views: 10911
Avatar for Doublehelix
Doublehelix 30th June 2005
replies: 122 views: 10711
Avatar for Ben F
Ben F 8th November 2008
replies: 21 views: 3699
Avatar for Robby in WA
Robby in WA 30th November 2013
replies: 289 views: 16103
Avatar for joeq
joeq 30th September 2020
Topic:
Post Reply

Welcome to the Gearspace Pro Audio Community!

Registration benefits include:
  • The ability to reply to and create new discussions
  • Access to members-only giveaways & competitions
  • Interact with VIP industry experts in our guest Q&As
  • Access to members-only sub forum discussions
  • Access to members-only Chat Room
  • Get INSTANT ACCESS to the world's best private pro audio Classifieds for only USD $20/year
  • Promote your eBay auctions and Reverb.com listings for free
  • Remove this message!
You need an account to post a reply. Create a username and password below and an account will be created and your post entered.


 
 
Slide to join now Processing…

Forum Jump
Forum Jump