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Would you rather have a modular or analog poly?
Old 8th March 2014 | Show parent
  #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Varaldo ➡️
Have you been under a rock? You forgot the latest craze in the modular music scene: "Insectoid Drone"
Coolz! I be on da kuttin edge! Dis frm 2 years ago
Old 8th March 2014 | Show parent
  #92
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by maisonvague ➡️
As for the other points in your post, I'm not going to even bother addressing them because frankly, I see no value in discussing modulars with someone with such strong and, in my opinion, narrow-minded views. Sorry.
You're right, it isn't worth discussing the point that the only real, practical value of modular synths in 2014 is the ability to create "better" sci-fi bug noises. Because that point is unassailable.

Well okay, I suppose there is one other advantage: The ability to wow your friends with a bunch of goofy lab-like equipment cluttering up your studio. But I would rather impress people with the quality of my music and not some studio props.
Old 8th March 2014 | Show parent
  #93
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And to answer the original post, I'd really hate to be forced to have one or the other. I currently have several poly synths and several modular synths and love them all.

But, if an alien/Satan held me at ray-gun/pitchfork point and said I HAD to choose, I guess I'd choose the world's biggest modular because it would be big enough to leave several bass, lead, poly and sound effects patches up at the same time all the time and still have tons left over to experiment with.
Old 8th March 2014 | Show parent
  #94
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🎧 10 years
Man, you're just beggin' for it, aren't you?

Ok, then. Let's start with this:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gadget Fiend ➡️
Look, there is absolutely nothing wrong with having fun creating odd bleeps and bloops with a modular. Just like there is nothing wrong with creating weird noise beds with a Radio Shack transistor radio kit. But neither process has much to do with music.
John Cage and others redefined the question "What is music?" fifty years ago. Only someone who was completely ignorant of this fact or a die-hard elitist would make such a statement in 2014. (Recommended reading: Silence by John Cage)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gadget Fiend ➡️
You're right, it isn't worth discussing the point that the only real, practical value of modular synths in 2014 is the ability to create "better" sci-fi bug noises. Because that point is unassailable.
If you honestly believe that's all modulars are good for then I have to question the amount of experience you've had with them. Anyone with extensive experience with modulars would know they can be used for many musical purposes. One need not even create sounds within the modular itself but simply use it to process external sounds (as chrisso already pointed out).

They can also serve as a kind of mechanized-musician. Using programmable random and/or semi-random signal generators, etc. you can literally jam with a modular. Of course, this could be done by other means as well (e.g. a computer) but that's not the point. The point is that modulars are highly flexible musical instruments.

Quote:
Well okay, I suppose there is one other advantage: The ability to wow your friends with a bunch of goofy lab-like equipment cluttering up your studio. But I would rather impress people with the quality of my music and not some studio props.
What a statement! I'm not going to even bother with that one.

One thing I will say, though, is this: you're not alone in your views, just as I'm not alone in mine. There are many valid reasons to be turned off by modulars, some of which you've cited. But to dismiss them as you do raises the question of how much experience you've had with them because if you did have the experience, I imagine you'd simply say "they are not for me" and leave it at that. There would be no need to go further and question the intelligence and musicality of others.
Old 8th March 2014 | Show parent
  #95
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by maisonvague ➡️
John Cage and others redefined the question "What is music?" fifty years ago. Only someone who was completely ignorant of this fact or a die-hard elitist would make such a statement in 2014.
You're kidding, right? I'm the elitist because I, like most people, actually appreciate harmony and melody and would rather not be subjected to the atonal racket made by navel-gazing geeks to impress other members of their insular, cooler-than-thou crowd. That's priceless.
Old 8th March 2014 | Show parent
  #96
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by maisonvague ➡️
They can also serve as a kind of mechanized-musician. Using programmable random and/or semi-random signal generators, etc. you can literally jam with a modular. Of course, this could be done by other means as well (e.g. a computer) but that's not the point. The point is that modulars are highly flexible musical instruments.
Right, the point isn't that you can use a $300 laptop and free software to accomplish the same musical result (jamming along to algorithmically-generated music and beats). It's that it takes you 10 times longer and costs a lot more to accomplish the same thing. Because who would want to ever complete a song? You might actually be judged by the result.
Old 8th March 2014 | Show parent
  #97
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chrisso's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gadget Fiend ➡️
Right, the point isn't that you can use a $300 laptop and free software to accomplish the same musical result.
Yeah, but you keep missing the point, the important point, that tools are inspiring.
We're not making burgers here, or packing shelves at the supermarket.
I'm making music from a blank page. So what if I am more inspired by building my own synthesiser from raw components for every sound, rather than fiddling with free software and a mouse.


You really are coming across narrow minded. I can get that some could prefer a poly to modular, or free software even. But even though so many posters have mentioned great artists who have made great music using modular systems, you keep blabbing on about bug noise.
Old 8th March 2014 | Show parent
  #98
Deleted c40a31f
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gadget Fiend ➡️
Right, the point isn't that you can use a $300 laptop and free software to accomplish the same musical results (jamming along to algorithmically-generated music and beats). It's that it takes you 10 times longer and costs a lot more to accomplish the same thing.
A gunnysack, jeans and a t-shirt and a fine 3 piece suit all accomplish the same thing, they can cloth you.

A ride in a donkey cart, a ride in a Honda and a ride in a Mercedes all accomplish the same thing, they can transport you to a destination.

A meal at a corner hot dog stand, a meal at The Outback steak house and a meal at El Celler de Can Roca all accomplish the same thing, they all can feed and nourish you.

So, IMHO, making music can be a lot like getting dressed up and going out for a meal; the quality of the tools used along with knowledge and skill of those using the tools can have a subtle to drastic affect on the outcome and perceived experience.

I've said elsewhere long ago that I'd rather hear the best musicians in the world making music with the worst instruments than hear the worst musicians making music with the best instruments. That said, the best musicians with the best instruments would be the bestest!
Old 8th March 2014
  #99
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🎧 10 years
To use a Modular synth creatively and musically you do have to have a certain amount of self control not to disappear into modular time, as in 1 hour = 1 day.

That being said a modular gives me control over the sound that no fixed synth can give, it can do everything a normal synth can do but loads more.....except one thing. Polyphony....but then I tend to use digital or samples for that.

But if you really wanted Polyphony from a modular then just simply record each note and pop it into your DAW. Tracks are almost free with todays technology, certainly a lot cheaper than buying 4 modular's to play a chord.
Old 8th March 2014 | Show parent
  #100
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maisonvague's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gadget Fiend ➡️
You're kidding, right? I'm the elitist because I, like most people, actually appreciate harmony and melody and would rather not be subjected to the atonal racket made by navel-gazing geeks to impress other members of their insular, cooler-than-thou crowd. That's priceless.
Making broad statements about what is and what isn't music is elitist, yes. It's a slippery slope best avoided -- and better left to self-important academics and music critics (also to be avoided ).

Tonality or atonality has nothing to do with it. In post-war Europe and other western countries, if you weren't composing atonal music you weren't considered a serious composer. It's thanks to people like John Cage, who worked against modernism and European elitism, that later composers like Philip Glass could compose tonal symphonies inspired by David Bowie albums such as Low and Heroes and "get away with it."



It also means you are free to enjoy your tonality again. The ivory tower has, to a great extent, been destroyed. But views like yours lay the foundation for a new tower -- one that excludes "atonal racket" or anything else you deem as unworthy of being called music. Your posts are laced with prejudice and snobbery no different from those who, back in the 1950s, considered tonality as hackneyed sentimentality unworthy of the contemporary concert stage.
Old 8th March 2014 | Show parent
  #101
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🎧 5 years
what makes it appealing for me with a modular is the fact that you can have various vcos and filters in the same synth.

also a major plus is the modulation sources/destinations. i dont think its worth getting one if you're in like 90s house or that kind of music. you'd be better off with a sampler and a few vintage synths.

for me though it would offer me some modulation paths that i can only otherwise have in a tempest and/or maybe an elektron box right now but without a filter of my choice or a vco of my choice and also where it is not so easy to interact with a sequencer or other modules as it is in a modular.

so i think the point of having a modular is also to track it as soon as you have a good sound. you can definitely coax amazing sounds out of it as long as you know what you are doing.
Old 8th March 2014
  #102
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Synthbuilder's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Hang on, wasn't the question, which would you chose modular or analogue polysynth? I assumed we were talking about other things still being available, like romplers, VAs, softsynths, or was it a desert island type of question? If the latter then I would indeed go for a polysynth. But then I'd rather have a modern rompler than any analogue polysynth if I could only own one musical instrument.

I make melodic music, for the most part, and I use my modular pretty much as a tricked out monosynth. Oddly I prefer to make drones using multiple layers of modulars and digital synths. And remember one can always sample a modular for polyphonic use.

Tony
Old 8th March 2014
  #103
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slaughtrhaus's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Umm, guys...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vertflyer ➡️
Meant to be a fun thread.
Epic fail. This is Opinion-Slutz, and it always goes to **** eventually. Sorry Vert, Slutz can't NOT argue.
Old 8th March 2014 | Show parent
  #104
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TheBrightSide's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by slaughtrhaus ➡️

This is Opinion-Slutz, and it always goes to **** eventually. Sorry Vert, Slutz can't NOT argue.
I know right.
Who would have thought that a genie giving away synths would cause so much trouble?
Old 8th March 2014
  #105
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Acid Mitch's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Maybe it's time to put it back in the bottle.
Old 8th March 2014 | Show parent
  #106
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Mefistophelees's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyFM ➡️
what makes it appealing for me with a modular is the fact that you can have various vcos and filters in the same synth.
There's also the sheer variety of oscillators and filters available. A typical analogue synth typically has a very small selection of waves available. Some modular oscillators do the same but others throw in wave shaping so you can get a huge variety of waveforms from a single oscillator - and of course you can modulate them.

However this is just the start. There are many oscillators that use different kinds of synthesis. Things like wavetables, phase and frequency modulation, granular synthesis, physical modelling. Some even put multiple types of synthesis together at the same time.

It's the same with filters. There are many based on popular synth designs but then there are others from more obscure or historical synths. Then you get the really whacky stuff like are somewhere between filters and distortion units. You also get hybrids that combine technologies like Vactrols into filters to get incredibly smooth results.

That's just for oscillators and filters. There's also completely different kinds of modules that have no direct equivalent in other hardware synths mono or poly.
Old 8th March 2014 | Show parent
  #107
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🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mefistophelees ➡️
There's also the sheer variety of oscillators and filters available. A typical analogue synth typically has a very small selection of waves available. Some modular oscillators do the same but others throw in wave shaping so you can get a huge variety of waveforms from a single oscillator - and of course you can modulate them.

However this is just the start. There are many oscillators that use different kinds of synthesis. Things like wavetables, phase and frequency modulation, granular synthesis, physical modelling. Some even put multiple types of synthesis together at the same time.

It's the same with filters. There are many based on popular synth designs but then there are others from more obscure or historical synths. Then you get the really whacky stuff like are somewhere between filters and distortion units. You also get hybrids that combine technologies like Vactrols into filters to get incredibly smooth results.

That's just for oscillators and filters. There's also completely different kinds of modules that have no direct equivalent in other hardware synths mono or poly.
yeah I guess you find all that out when you start building/experimenting on a modular. Again it is about the kind of music you produce. I guess many people would use a modular in the same way they would a hardwired mono, just to get variety of tones, filters and what naught because that's all their music needs to sound good. I'm sure though it opens a whole new world of synthesizing and when it comes to building a wide variety of sounds a modular certainly wins over a poly or one box synth

modular or poly as your only synth? maybe a poly but haven't tried a modular yet
Old 8th March 2014 | Show parent
  #108
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Mr. Varaldo's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by ImJohn ➡️
Coolz! I be on da kuttin edge! Dis frm 2 years ago
This is awesome, and really clever, John!

Although I have to play devil's advocate for a second, here... your piece works wonderfully, and it's paired with a suggestive video collage.

Question for all people browsing this thread: I think we can all concur that John's piece is really cool, and emotions of empathy are provoked when viewed with the video.

My question is, if one did not see the video that accompanies "InfeStation", but only heard the bug music in audio format, would (s)he feel the same feeling when listening to the audio only?

And the second question would be: do our reactions change (I like it, or I don't like it) when we pair two forms of art / sensorial perception - i.e. we seem to enjoy more a vapid techno/house/dubstep/etc. song at a party if it has stroboscopic lights in addition to just the music being played, or the famous "MTV" '80s era when videos sold millions of songs, etc.

And to MaisonVague's point, my third question is: I am against capital punishment, but should I make an exception for John Cage's 4'33"? heh
Old 8th March 2014 | Show parent
  #109
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🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gadget Fiend ➡️
I remember standing in line at Guitar Center Hollywood about 25 years ago about to buy a copy of Turbosynth. I was going on and on to a buddy of mine about how you could apply this or that processing to a sound. Just blabbering on like a total computer nerd about how amazing (just amazing!) this software was. Believe it or not, Thomas Dolby was standing at the counter as well. He turned to me and asked, "But what will that actually sound like and how do you intend to use it?" I was taken aback that someone (especially Thomas Dolby!) would question whether there should be a musical purpose to some high tech sound design tool. Wasn't it enough to just have all of these amazing capabilities whether the music produced with them was complete crap?
The crap you made with it is entirely separate from the actual music made with it.

There's really no need for you to project your failures on others. People do stuff beyond your artificial limitations, there's really no need to speak in such overbroad terms.

It's good to ask questions as Dolby does, it's always good to think and self-criticize, but other people have uses for these tools that you may not have thought of.
Old 8th March 2014 | Show parent
  #110
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by chaosium ➡️
The crap you made with it is entirely separate from the actual music made with it.

There's really no need for you to project your failures on others. People do stuff beyond your artificial limitations, there's really no need to speak in such overbroad terms.
Ok, so now my music is crap (although you haven't heard a note of it). Oh, and I'm a failure on top of being a narrow-minded elitist. Nice. The infantile, passive aggressive name calling would be laughable if it wasn't so pathetic. Are you 12? I'll let you and the cool kids enjoy your modular circle jerk and I'll get back to making music.
Old 8th March 2014 | Show parent
  #111
Gear Guru
 
chrisso's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gadget Fiend ➡️
…….I'll get back to making music.
…with my modular.
I'm just editing 200 kicks and 200 snares I've made over the last few months, about 3/4 of which were created using my modular.
Old 8th March 2014
  #112
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
felt like some of the fun got sucked out of this thread, so i'm going back to the start...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vertflyer ➡️
Meant to be a fun thread. If a genie offered you one, and you had neither (or could switch), which would you rather have?
i'll take one poly to go please.

modular is fun, but i have enough mono-synths atm; need a multi-voice to fill out some midrange pads... and if it could be arranged for a one-knob-per-function interface (or close to) that would be marvelous.

thanks.
Old 8th March 2014 | Show parent
  #113
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisso ➡️
I'm just editing 200 kicks and 200 snares I've made over the last few months, about 3/4 of which were created using my modular.
You do realize that you just proved my point, right? "Editing 200 kicks and 200 snares" is NOT what most people would consider "making music."

If you enjoy doing that, hey, more power to you. Although I will say that the world probably doesn't need any more kicks and snares.
Old 8th March 2014 | Show parent
  #114
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Septik's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Money wise, I'd rather invest into a modular. I absolutely love my analog polys, and as hard as I would find it to live without them, if I was to decide between one primo poly synth like a sunsyn or Synthex and a $10,000 eurorack system, I think it's obvious which would give me more inspiration and potential for sound design and total integration into my project. I love my polys dearly but if I couldn't fund a modular with my personal income, I'd probably sell one or two to fund a modular system. They have extremely unique character that I crave, but they don't provide all the possibility and expansive inspiration that a quality euro rack of equal value would.
Old 8th March 2014
  #115
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Carnalia Barcus's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
I don't really care if something is modular or an all-in-one-unit, and I don't ultimately care if it's analog or digital, either. I don't have an analog or digital preference overall.

What I do care about, though, is:

(i) I'd always rather have something be polyphonic rather than monophonic,
(ii) I'd like to have as many options that I can tweak as possible, preferably tweakable in real-time, in addition to being able to save any settings as a program that I can instantly call-up,
(iii) the easier it is to use, the easier it is to create different sorts of sounds and also instantly call saved ones up the better in my opinion,
(iv) I'd prefer it to be compact and light, and
(v) I like having a lot of variety timbrally.
Old 8th March 2014 | Show parent
  #116
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maisonvague's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheBrightSide ➡️
Who would have thought that a genie giving away synths would cause so much trouble?
Old 8th March 2014 | Show parent
  #117
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🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gadget Fiend ➡️
"Editing 200 kicks and 200 snares" is NOT what most people would consider "making music."
**** most people...never let anyone's opinion define what you call music
Old 9th March 2014 | Show parent
  #118
Gear Guru
 
chrisso's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gadget Fiend ➡️
You do realize that you just proved my point, right? "Editing 200 kicks and 200 snares" is NOT what most people would consider "making music."
.
LOL, you are quite the character.
The modular kicks and snares are unique sounds to me I use in my music.
A kick is a musical sound.
So if you make a pad sound on your poly you aren't't making music?
So I can only use other people's sounds in future if I am to make music???
You did claim you weren't narrow minded?
Old 9th March 2014 | Show parent
  #119
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bil_g's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gadget Fiend ➡️
You do realize...
Old 9th March 2014 | Show parent
  #120
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TheBrightSide's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by maisonvague ➡️
Cool looking bong.
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