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How likely is it for Roland to do a "Korg ms20" with Juno 106?
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #91
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spaceman's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by audioconsult ➡️
as you probably dont even understand why the mc 303 was a shamefull release from the asumed giant roland.. maybe just scratch your head.. listen to the resonance..and think...
No, my post was about the " they better consult me before the release to ensure success " part. Because i'm sure it was dead serious. ( I could care less about TB303's and co )
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #92
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🎧 5 years
Anyway.. Roland/Boss is still doing well and their keyboards are still good.. but they have changed over time from a rhythm box manufactor, over an electronic music instruments manufactorer, to an electronic instruments company that features the whole band.. from drummer to acoustic guitarist boss looper...

naturally they was more interesting for electronic musicans when we was the main target customers.. the visionary future customer..

we design the future? Roland had a good part in that.. aswel as the other companies involved in the midi protocol
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #93
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🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruno Republic ➡️
I

The 303 and 606 weren't marketed as serious instruments but songwriting tools.
bull****.. roland had any year new products and they loudmouth advertized them as a system for the future of music production.. appeared more as wishfull thinking at first..but than house music happened... and housemusic and roland go hand in hand..

however..you are obviously to young to have first hand experience regardiong the topic.. the internet is very inacurate regarding rtimes before the mid 90´s... Allways this roland as organ company bla bla.. does the 808 looks
like a backward orientated home organ instrument to you?
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #94
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spaceman's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruno Republic ➡️
Roland's core business has always been more "home organs" than anything else. Their philosophy has never changed. What *has* changed is how people view their older products. So many of these now-sacred instruments were certainly not viewed as such when they came out, nor were they intended to be. The Jupiter instruments had credibility, but they also had a price tag to match. The Junos, drum machines, etc.? Roland marketed them for their value, not for their features or sound.

What you think of as "futuristic instruments" were actually more the "home organ" items of their time. The Juno-106 certainly wasn't futuristic when it came out. It was a no-frills budget synth, not cool or sexy at all, simply what you settled for back in the day when you really wanted a Prophet or Oberheim or Jupiter but didn't have thousands of dollars to spend on them.

People today seem to have no concept of just how incredibly expensive all this stuff was back in the day. Price was the bottom line for these manufacturers, and outside of the flagship items, the goal was never "smooth warm filters" or "analog realness" but simply getting the most features (first polyphony, then multitimbral, then number of sampled sounds in ROM) at the lowest price possible. As new technologies emerged, Roland et al embraced them and put the past behind them. The older instruments were picked up and embraced by poor musicians because they couldn't afford the newest and fanciest toys out there. Some of those poor musicians used them to make records which are now classics.

By re-releasing a 35 year-old piece of equipment, it is actually Korg who have changed their target market. The issue here isn't that Roland has changed their philosophy... it's that they haven't.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruno Republic ➡️
I put "home organs" in quotes, meaning not literally, but as more general-purpose keyboard instruments.

The rest of your comment doesn't make much sense. The SH series were designed to compete with Minimoogs and ARP Odysseys, which were off the market by the early 80s. I vividly recall that the SH-101 was practically an anachronism when it came out, and was viewed by man as "the last monosynth". The modular stuff? I never even saw that marketed to musicians; I thought they sold that mostly to universities.

The 303 and 606 weren't marketed as serious instruments but songwriting tools.
Agreed 100%
A lot of it has to do with distorted perceptions of past eras. People always tend to mythologize periods they didn't live. Mythologizing the 70's if you didn't live through them, the 80's, etc.. ( the 90's are perhaps still too fresh )

In 20 years from now , young people will mythologize "the good times" of the 2000's and will want to recreate the sound and technique of it...
I very well remember that the drum machines of that time ( the now "legendary" 808 and 909 ) were not sought after because they had some kind of magical sound or anything like that, it was because people were looking for REALISM ! They were judged on how close to a real drummer/drum set they were ! No one today would use an 808 because of that, on the contrary...

Many things and characteristics that get dreamed about today were considered crap in their time . Sometimes for good reasons, sometimes for wrong reasons. Not everything was fantastic in those eras.
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #95
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🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by spaceman ➡️
Agreed 100%
A lot of it has to do with distorted perceptions of past eras..
yep.. like you guys..


again the question.. what have you done the day roland released the 606?

i gave an eyewitnes report.. and that was not from visiting the homeorgan companys release..

You seem to have no idea which position companies like korg and roland held for electronic music in the past.. even in the late 70´s where roland was really in the home organ market they was futuristic and allowed to write own patterns..

what was the first writeable customer drum machine?

maybe no this one.. buit it was the first writable cult drum machine

Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #96
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🎧 10 years
God, I love Liquid Sky. Too long since I've seen it, but I love that scene. Just noticed, is that a 635a she's singing with? Ha, nerdy.
Old 28th January 2013
  #97
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🎧 5 years
So the question I have is what has Roland released within the past 5 years that is decent?
This is a serious question?

I purchased the Juno G and it was not great.
I was up to date at one point with what Roland was releasing then I gave up.

I thought by now they would have released a new 303 given the cult following.
Maybe even a new 909 or an 808.
Maybe its one of those things, it was the past and lets move forward thinking by Roland.
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #98
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by audioconsult ➡️
however..you are obviously to young to have first hand experience regardiong the topic..
I wish I was. But I'm not.
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #99
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Looneytune ➡️
So the question I have is what has Roland released within the past 5 years that is decent?
This is a serious question?
That depends what you're in the market for.

If you are a gigging musician in a regular rock/pop band, they've done a few interesting things. But if you're wanting to make edgy electronic or dance music, absolutely nothing. However, I would also argue that the biggest advancements in this area have nothing to do with hardware anymore.
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #100
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🎧 5 years
homeorgans? have you read that in the internet?

at least they worked hard to hide it



Old 28th January 2013
  #101
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🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by javd007 ➡️
Ms20 will be everywhere. I ordered one the day I found out. 599 for a MS20 , Hello! I think Roland needs to get back into making instruments that are actually heard on records. This fantom/Gaia stuff needs to stop. That are sooo foolish for not reissuing the 808. It would sell better than any piece of gear ever made. Hell I'd buy one, and I own one.
Yeah, they need to stop making knobby synths that are fun as hell and inspiring :confused:

I know people like to bash Roland, but there is nothing wrong with the Gaia. Its a nice synth. Perfect? No, but definatley a cool synth.

I preordered the MS20. I can't wait.
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #102
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by audioconsult ➡️
homeorgans? have you read that in the internet?

at least they worked hard to hide it
I'm old enough to remember the HS-60 version of the Juno-106, which had cheesy built-in speakers and looked very much like a home organ (or at least those wretched Yamaha PSR home keyboards) and they sure didn't try to hide it there.
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #103
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🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruno Republic ➡️
However, I would also argue that the biggest advancements in this area have nothing to do with hardware anymore.
?? only with hardware.. software only emulates hardware.. we havent seen any new algos since melodyne or kyma and even there new only in a rather relative sense..

hardware makes the difference.. can be your i7 cpu, i pad, elektron device or ableton push controler..but software?
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #104
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by audioconsult ➡️
?? only with hardware.. software only emulates hardware.. we havent seen any new algos since melodyne or kyma and even there new only in a rather relative sense..
Well, the Korg Polysix and Juno-106 were only emulating much more expensive synths. Most synths were sold to emulate conventional instruments. The 808 was only emulating real drums. Thousands of DX-7s were sold just for the electric piano patch. And don't get me started on that overused M1 piano sound.

Look a little deeper and you'll see that most successful electronic instruments are marketed as having the ability to replace something else. Often it's not about how the instruments are used, but how they are misused and abused, and repurposed. Practically everything is imitative until you get to Buchla levels of esoteric gear.

Massive's wavetable synthesis might not be new, but like it or not, its modulation controls launched an entire genre.
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #105
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spaceman's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by audioconsult ➡️
?? only with hardware.. software only emulates hardware.. we havent seen any new algos since melodyne or kyma and even there new only in a rather relative sense..
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #106
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🎧 10 years
This picture has got home organ written all over it.
Attached Thumbnails
How likely is it for Roland to do a "Korg ms20" with Juno 106?-oscar_peterson_tb303_tr606.jpg  
Old 28th January 2013
  #107
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pinkerton's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Haha owned
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #108
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AJ Reynolds ➡️

This picture has got home organ written all over it.




Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #109
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🎧 5 years
hard to believe that you guys are literate
Old 28th January 2013
  #110
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kirkelein's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
this is fun
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #111
MusicFan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by audioconsult ➡️
hard to believe that you guys are literate
Thereafter for those who didn't understand my previous post:

"This thread just has reached the pinnacle of absurdity."

Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #112
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🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by audioconsult ➡️
hard to believe that you guys are literate
hard to believe you're not a bottle of vinegar and water with a handy applicator tip.
Old 28th January 2013
  #113
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cresshead's Avatar
possible releases based up the product's "league status" in analogue synthesis and capability for Roland to sell alot at a reasonable price point.

realistic possibilities for production have an asterisk

*SH-101 (iconic plastic mono synth you can play like a guitar)


*Juno 106
*TB 303
*TR808
* JX-3-P (optional PG200)

TR909 (808 would come first every time when making a list)
MC202

(with all the SH range below including SH-01...Roland would always opt for the SH-101 over all of these for their
fisrt jump back into retro reissue of classics as i has a higher "status" in most peoples minds)

SH-09

SH-01
SH-5

Jupiter 8 (VERY doubtful due to price)

Roland have an extensive legacy compared to Korg but when you put their back catalogue thru
"the produce it in 2013" filter that can shift decent amount of product you are left with
a much shorter list of realistic possibilities.
Old 28th January 2013
  #114
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pinkerton's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Any future revisions of jx3p should do away with the pg200 nonsense.
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pinkerton ➡️
Any future revisions of jx3p should do away with the pg200 nonsense.
what do you mean "do away"....you never owned one then?
I had a JX-3p with pg200 back in the 80's and it was essential to have that for programming the sounds.

Do you mean INCLUDE it on the synth...?
not an add on with a multicore cable and magnetic strips on the bottom but part of the synth?

Old 28th January 2013
  #116
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pinkerton's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
I have an mks30 and a pg200 sitting right here.

But I think you may have misunderstood me.

I mean they should not gimp the keyboard by (nearly) requiring a programmer to make sounds on it.
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #117
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Yoozer's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by cresshead ➡️
possible releases based up the product's "league status" in analogue synthesis and capability for Roland to sell alot at a reasonable price point.

realistic possibilities for production have an asterisk

*SH-101 (iconic plastic mono synth you can play like a guitar)
I think that would be the most realistic option. It's still a very iconic design, and because of the plastic, cheap.

Arturia did the Minibrute and they don't have Roland's scale. But - they didn't set out to replicate a 101 exactly. There's something special about the 101's bouncy sound, and I guess that means replicating the CEM and the Roland filters and VCA.

The JX3P is not so easy; there are already DCO synthesizers and they don't skimp on programming options. I am of course talking about DSI's efforts in that regard. The MC202 is not iconic enough (and not straightforward in terms of programming). Though - an MC202 may be a more achievable form factor for an amateur project setting out to replicate a 101 faithfully.

If it'd be any of the Junos, it'd have to be the 60, not the 106, otherwise you're trying to fight a secondhand market.

Quote:
Originally Posted by pinkerton ➡️
Any future revisions of jx3p should do away with the pg200 nonsense.
The joke is that they would still require it, it's just that the PG200 would be an iPad app.
Old 28th January 2013
  #118
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pinkerton's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Lol yea. I could see them doing that
Old 28th January 2013
  #119
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re Jx-3p...yeh ipad programmer!...i could see Roland doing that for the jx3p, jx 8 jx 10 and d50!....i HOPE ROLAND are not reading this getting ideas!

for me IF ( it's amassive if)...IF roland remake a monosynth...it will be a SH-101
...IF roland re make a drum machine....it'll be a TR-808

if roland (and Boss) want to test the waters on a cheap thing before diving in...they might want to re issue a DR-55 or a TR 606
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #120
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UnderTow's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by audioconsult ➡️
come on guy.. look at theese machines.. and tell me they are ment as home organs :facepalm
In the grander scheme of things (with the quote marks in the original post you were responding to)? Most certainly. The 303 was a cheap replacement for a session bassist. The 808 and 909 were cheap replacements for session drummers. They were not aimed at the high-end studios or the bigger commercially successful bands of the day. The fact that creative people used them to make new sounds and new styles of music is irrelevant to the intent of Roland and the market they were aiming at when releasing those products.

Alistair
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