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How likely is it for Roland to do a "Korg ms20" with Juno 106?
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #61
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Looping Loddar's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Probability: less than 0,00000000001 percent
It is much more likely that you will get rich by playing online-poker.
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #62
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by flat earth ➡️
it doesn't sound like an 808 to me. Just something vaguely similar.
And this is problem Roland would face if they reissue anything from their analog history. Two revisions of MS-20 filter are quite different, it's like comparing TB303 and Jupiter 8 filters. And yet, people never did and still don't care much about that. For all (ok, maybe great majority) it's MS-20, one way or another.
Roland OTOH endured Full Blown And Over-the-top Canonisation of Holy Tone. They are properly f'cked up on cloning front, maybe even more than Moog would be with straight up clones. Miami is pretty much what could Roland (in theory) achieve today. Only thing is, Roland could do it for something like $200 less, like Korg did with MiniMS. Intense amount of time was spent in xoxbox project to get pretty much perfect clone, on level unattainable maybe even for Roland. And yet bunch of people will tell you it sounds nothing like real deal. If I was Roland I would stick with accordions, they could never live up to their analog heritage.
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #63
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🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by recnsci ➡️
. Intense amount of time was spent in xoxbox project to get pretty much perfect clone, on level unattainable maybe even for Roland. And yet bunch of people will tell you it sounds nothing like real deal. If I was Roland I would stick with accordions, they could never live up to their analog heritage.
BULL.. the xox is a surfaced low inteligence geek product on the level of the other adafruit toys.. nothing even remotly close to the genius of roland as a real musical instruments manufactor. Rather braindead in comparison..

However Roland had theire time where they was ahead of the time.. the didnt made too much profit back than.. i doubt they want to be avant garde again..
Old 28th January 2013
  #64
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dlmorley's Avatar
 
2 Reviews written
🎧 15 years
Yes, the we design the future was somewhat optimisitic!
Some GREAT products for sure but for example the Roland Modular 700 came nearly 10 years after the Moog system first came out.
The Jupiter 4 came out at the same time as the Prophet 5 (jupiter 8, 3 years later)
The SH1000 came out 3 years after the Minimoog
Even the 303 came after the Firstman SQ-01
etc etc
Not knocking the products, but they weren't really forward thinking so why should they be now?
With Drum Machines they were better IMHO.

But with their finances, they could do a great System 100m again and sell well I think.
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #65
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by audioconsult ➡️
BULL
I guess you will compare schematics and part lists to point out differences for other GSers in next post, right?
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #66
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🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by dlmorley ➡️
Yes, the we design the future was somewhat optimisitic!
Some GREAT products for sure but for example the Roland Modular 700 came nearly 10 years after the Moog system first came out.
The Jupiter 4 came out at the same time as the Prophet 5 (jupiter 8, 3 years later)
The SH1000 came out 3 years after the Minimoog
Even the 303 came after the Firstman SQ-01
etc etc
Not knocking the products, but they weren't really forward thinking so why should they be now?
With Drum Machines they were better IMHO.

But with their finances, they could do a great System 100m again and sell well I think.
??

moog was old fashioned when they first showed up already.. Roland had designed the future in th 1980´s. as we was able to witness in the 90´swhen their formerly expensive instruments hit the road as cheap second hand instruments..theire sequencing concepts still dominate electronic music production. all daw´s show the marks..especially abletonn live..most actual drumcomputers follow the roland model. . moog never had a sequencig concept at all.
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #67
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🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by recnsci ➡️
I guess you will compare schematics and part lists to point out differences for other GSers in next post, right?
No.. You dont get it anyway.. i just needed to mark your statement as bull to prevent stupid internet myth building up...
Old 28th January 2013
  #68
Gear Addict
 
🎧 10 years
If Roland didn't reissue the 303 when they started to fetch two grand on the used market... or the 909 during the mid-90s when apparently it was a legal requirement that all dance tracks use it and barely anything else, with no other drum sounds permitted... and this was all long before there were software emulations...

...well, really I don't expect they would put out those or any of their other now-sought-after instruments now.

However, if Korg sells 50,000 MS-20 Minis, Roland *might* consider a response. But even then I wouldn't hold my breath.
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #69
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by audioconsult ➡️
moog was old fashioned when they first showed up already.
HELLS BLOODY BELLS
I'm out of this thread
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #70
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dlmorley's Avatar
 
2 Reviews written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by recnsci ➡️
HELLS BLOODY BELLS
I'm out of this thread
Hang on, I'm coming too...
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #71
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🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisso ➡️
The most attractive thing they could do is replicate 100, 100M and 700 series modules in Eurorack format.
Hope they listen to this!
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #72
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🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluegreengold ➡️
Hope they listen to this!
maybe it has escaped your attention.. but thats just what doepfer did around 15 years ago...

seems that roland is less old fashioned than their potential users when going down the same boring road as clavia theese days.
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #73
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🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by recnsci ➡️
HELLS BLOODY BELLS
I'm out of this thread
great.. no more "moog invented the syntheziser" bull please
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #74
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🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by audioconsult ➡️
maybe it has escaped your attention.. but thats just what doepfer did around 15 years ago...

seems that roland is less old fashioned than their potential users when going down the same boring road as clavia theese days.
Really, I didn't realize that doepfer cloned the roland circuits. (not that I think cloning is a brilliant thing, but the roland modulars are really nice).
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #75
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🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluegreengold ➡️
Really, I didn't realize that doepfer cloned the roland circuits. (not that I think cloning is a brilliant thing, but the roland modulars are really nice).
the first line of doepfer modules was essentially roland clones.. curtis chip based designs.

the varity is wide by now..
Old 28th January 2013
  #76
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🎧 10 years
I so dearly hope Roland rereleases the 303 just so I can grap the popcorn and watch audioconsult ramble on about what's wrong with it.
Old 28th January 2013
  #77
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Yoozer's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
Eurorack is really underground, despite the fact that it's a "big" format and a boatload of modules are available.

Customer support would probably be a pretty big issue.
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #78
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🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mans ➡️
I so dearly hope Roland rereleases the 303 just so I can grap the popcorn and watch audioconsult ramble on about what's wrong with it.
they better consult me before the release to ensure success and not another mc 303 shame
Old 28th January 2013
  #79
ozy
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ozy's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasonM ➡️
I want to buy a Juno 106, just thinking ......will Roland ever re make the Juno 106/60?
no, they won't

but I heard from reliable sources that Roland will take a page from Korg's Namm2013 book anyway.

They will build a VA whose name will be "King Slutz",

and which will perfectly model the 106.
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #80
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spaceman's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by audioconsult ➡️
they better consult me before the release to ensure success and not another mc 303 shame
This is one of those awkward moments where i don't know if i should heh or
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #81
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🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by spaceman ➡️
This is one of those awkward moments where i don't know if i should heh or
as you probably dont even understand why the mc 303 was a shamefull release from the asumed giant roland.. maybe just scratch your head.. listen to the resonance..and think...

what might be wrong with a bad timing unit full of cheasy goa trance presets you cant even erase? sad when a company gets a moronic management that kills a good reputationin no time...
Old 28th January 2013
  #82
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🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by audioconsult ➡️
as you probably dont even understand why the mc 303 was a shamefull release from the asumed giant roland.. maybe just scratch your head.. listen to the resonance..and think...

what might be wrong with a bad timing unit full of cheasy goa trance presets you cant even erase? sad when a company gets a moronic management that kills a good reputationin no time...
Oh so you were burned personally?

I used to have a mc505, wasnt a bad little sequencer - sounds were cack but never really saw it as a synth

Sent from my GT-I8190
Old 28th January 2013
  #83
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🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasonM ➡️
I want to buy a Juno 106, just thinking ......will Roland ever re make the Juno 106/60?
Last year i bought the korg ms20 only for Korg to bring it back AND include MIDI/USB. do you think Roland will take a leaf from korgs book,and start remaking some of their classic synths? what do you think?.

And to Roland, if you are reading this, if you do decide to follow suite, you better make it sound the same/just as good, or else don't bother.
Doubt it, just buy a 106.

Sent from my GT-I8190
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #84
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🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by dubmunkey ➡️
Oh so you were burned personally?

I used to have a mc505, wasnt a bad little sequencer - sounds were cack but never really saw it as a synth

Sent from my GT-I8190
no.. but roland was.. the mc 303 marked the change in politics from futuristic instruments to homeorgans... also around the time the founder wasnt in control anymore.. clearly a loss in quality and especially vision. When medium talent people take over the outcome cant be brilliant anymore.. see ableton
Old 28th January 2013
  #85
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🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by audioconsult ➡️
no.. but roland was.. the mc 303 marked the change in politics from futuristic instruments to homeorgans... also around the time the founder wasnt in control anymore.. clearly a loss in quality and especially vision. When medium talent people take over the outcome cant be brilliant anymore.. see ableton
Yeah see microsoft

The jv range were pretty decent romplers and v synth is pretty cool but the 303 wasnt great and skipped the wprkstation features that made the 505 useble but yeah Roland are no longer great

Then again would have said the same about korg but they are redeeming themselves

Sent from my GT-I8190
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #86
Gear Addict
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by audioconsult ➡️
no.. but roland was.. the mc 303 marked the change in politics from futuristic instruments to homeorgans...
Roland's core business has always been more "home organs" than anything else. Their philosophy has never changed. What *has* changed is how people view their older products. So many of these now-sacred instruments were certainly not viewed as such when they came out, nor were they intended to be. The Jupiter instruments had credibility, but they also had a price tag to match. The Junos, drum machines, etc.? Roland marketed them for their value, not for their features or sound.

What you think of as "futuristic instruments" were actually more the "home organ" items of their time. The Juno-106 certainly wasn't futuristic when it came out. It was a no-frills budget synth, not cool or sexy at all, simply what you settled for back in the day when you really wanted a Prophet or Oberheim or Jupiter but didn't have thousands of dollars to spend on them.

People today seem to have no concept of just how incredibly expensive all this stuff was back in the day. Price was the bottom line for these manufacturers, and outside of the flagship items, the goal was never "smooth warm filters" or "analog realness" but simply getting the most features (first polyphony, then multitimbral, then number of sampled sounds in ROM) at the lowest price possible. As new technologies emerged, Roland et al embraced them and put the past behind them. The older instruments were picked up and embraced by poor musicians because they couldn't afford the newest and fanciest toys out there. Some of those poor musicians used them to make records which are now classics.

By re-releasing a 35 year-old piece of equipment, it is actually Korg who have changed their target market. The issue here isn't that Roland has changed their philosophy... it's that they haven't.
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #87
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🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by dubmunkey ➡️
Yeah see microsoft

The jv range were pretty decent romplers and v synth is pretty cool but the 303 wasnt great and skipped the wprkstation features that made the 505 useble but yeah Roland are no longer great

Then again would have said the same about korg but they are redeeming themselves

Sent from my GT-I8190
drummachines and sequencing was the key competence of roland.. that their answer to the techno phenomen was such weardo machines as the mc 303 while korg safed themself by exploiting roland concepts shows a big misunderstanding of the own legacy products.. something had changed at roland.

look at the genial asymetrical designs of the older machines that allow spontanious navigation on the darkest stage.. followed by black boxes you harddly cant operate under a flood light with magnifying glass..

and to top that they gave them totally uselress transfomer look alike silver spoilers... so from brilliant stage orientated design to pseudo cool tokio trash? well done
Old 28th January 2013
  #88
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pinkerton's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Really? The acidlab Miami is ugly? I thought it looked pretty nice. I mean, I'm not planning on owning one (or an808) anytime soon but it didn't jump out at me as ugly. As for the sound, I've heard it on recordings and it sounds like an 808 to me. "Vaguely similar", bit of a hyperbole IMO
Old 28th January 2013 | Show parent
  #89
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🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruno Republic ➡️
Roland's core business has always been more "home organs" than anything else. Their philosophy has never changed. What *has* changed is how people view their older products. So many of these now-sacred instruments were certainly not viewed as such when they came out, nor were they intended to be.
Thats total bull****.. Roland wanted us young twen customers inn the 80´s.. and they got us.. but with a little delay thanks to the high yen the stuff became more expensive as planed..

come on guy.. look at theese machines.. and tell me they are ment as home organs


the jupiter 4 is the last one you can say this.. but not about the older SH series or system 100 or 700.. and all the sequencers.. you dont hav a clue.. wher have you been when the 606 was entering the shops? i was waiting for it.. the first day one was in the city we was in the shop.. just to hear it.. drum machines was hot.. home organs pfffff
Old 28th January 2013
  #90
Gear Addict
 
🎧 10 years
I put "home organs" in quotes, meaning not literally, but as more general-purpose keyboard instruments.

The rest of your comment doesn't make much sense. The SH series were designed to compete with Minimoogs and ARP Odysseys, which were off the market by the early 80s. I vividly recall that the SH-101 was practically an anachronism when it came out, and was viewed by man as "the last monosynth". The modular stuff? I never even saw that marketed to musicians; I thought they sold that mostly to universities.

The 303 and 606 weren't marketed as serious instruments but songwriting tools.
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