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New Korg MS-20 Mini
Old 20th February 2013 | Show parent
  #811
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R3Member's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by dublave ➡️
Trying really hard to be excited about these reviews, but they were just a tad bit too glowing. Some kind of criticism, aside from the lack of MIDI implementation, would have made them feel more realistic. Maybe it really isn't too good to be true. In any event, mine has already been pre-ordered since day one, so it's happening. I'm just always very wary of reviews that seem a little too positive, you know?
I'd like to say that these were perhaps too positive as well, but the reviewer did sit with someone who owns the original MS-20 and did side-by-side comparisons. The original MS-20 owner himself even states that he prefers the keys on the Mini, haha. The sound demos sound pretty exact with the exception of the envelope, but as the review says, trying to dial in the same exact parameters will produce different results if one thing is just slightly off, especially considering the knob size difference.

I will add though that I'm not too happy with the lack of MIDI OUT. I preordered early as well to get a $100 discount assuming it would have standard MIDI IN/OUT. I was kind of hoping that if it had MIDI OUT, I could route a smaller synth module or sampler into the external audio in, then trigger the module with the MS-20 keys. Kind of have to it backwards now with an external controller triggering both at once.
Old 20th February 2013
  #812
Gear Head
 
🎧 10 years
Oh btw, to the guy saying it was plastic.

Hands-on with Korg MS-20 Mini: Exclusive Review, Q&A, Images, Video

What’s the build quality like? Is it made of plastic? Does it feel like crap?

Knobs on the MS-20 mini feel good, though some (by design) can be sensitive to small changes, the keyboard feels springy, and the side panels are made of plastic.

In other words – the mini is exactly like the original MS-20, which had all of these characteristics. But the added result feels solid and is loads of fun.

The mini’s knobs are slightly smaller, and there are a different number of grooves on the mod wheel, and —

No, actually, it doesn’t even make sense to go into this. The MS-20 mini comes so close to the look and feel of the original that it’s almost not worth mentioning. Perhaps it’s the advantage of young age, but the main difference you’ll notice is that the MS-20 mini’s keyboard feels substantially better than on a vintage MS-20. Build quality feels perfectly solid, and the main body is made of metal, but the whole affair remains lightweight.[/quote]

I don't personally care how authentic it is to the original, since I have never played one personally, but I do love the sound. The mini, to my ears has a lovely character. I'm leaning towards the mini vs the Minibrute / Mopho mono KB. (damn budgets!)

I found this video on Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sab1V_LwDm0

Which has some very compelling sounds from the mini.
Old 20th February 2013
  #813
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Teknobeam's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Well....build quality has to be considered with today's standards of electronics manufacturing.. A Hi Def DVD player for $49.00.....an HP printer with an interactive pop up LCD screen and a scanner for $60.00 (ink cartdrides included)... when that thing breaks...thro it away and buy a new one... This reality is the new paradigm for electronics in general. Electronics in general has experienced a massive evolution in the last deacde also.. far beyond what it was when the Moogs were being made,, and even far beyond VLSI technology of a few years ago. So.... understand that 'synthesizers" in contect to all of the other electronics devices being designed and produced today represent almost zero on the scale... So... that means that electronics manufacturing modes are definitely not beinf designed and considered with synthesizers in mind... End result..... newly desinged and manufactured synthesizers have to conform to the means and methods available to electronics manufacturing of the day. Some exceptions noted ( Moog, Solaris, etc).. but to do that,,,,costs are increased greatly
Old 20th February 2013
  #814
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goldphinga's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
I'll tell you this - listening to the clips there's something that doesn't sound right about the new one compared to the old. It's inherent in the tone- its ms20 like but something's missing. too controlled and polite in all the clips I'm hearing. No midi cc is poor show from korg too. after the initial buzz dies people will start complaining about the lack of cc control and daw editor. Essential things for today's studio. Big deal they reissued the ms20- how about actually innovating and not cloning.
Old 20th February 2013
  #815
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Acid Hazard's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Then it isn't an MS20. If you want something different, then buy something different. The new MS20 sounds like what the old MS20 did when it rolled off the line.

And it's Hz/VOLTS!!! NOT hz/octave! FFS.
Old 20th February 2013 | Show parent
  #816
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flat's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by goldphinga ➡️
Big deal they reissued the ms20- how about actually innovating and not cloning.
I assume you will be saying the same if Roland re-issues the TB-303, yes? ...

It is a big deal, because alot of people have asked numerous synth manufactuers to do something like this for a long time now, and Kudo to Korg, they listened.

If they had released an MS-30, with newer features, just like you said above, it would not sound the same as the original 'whine' 'whine' 'whine' 'blah' 'blah' 'blah', so I think they did the right thing. They already have experiemented with Tron/Tribe boxes, so its quite likely they will continue this line beyond Tron/Tribe/MS.

They also released a new VA synth at the same time, so you can hardly accuse them of not innovating and catering for different markets.
Old 20th February 2013
  #817
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Acid Hazard's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
We have a complete re-release of one of the most in demand vintage synths for a damn good price, and yet the internet complains.

Old 20th February 2013 | Show parent
  #818
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Teknobeam's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Acid Hazard ➡️
We have a complete re-release of one of the most in demand vintage synths for a damn good price, and yet the internet complains.

Well..."a complete re release" not quite an accurate description..

and well... "the internet complains" The internet isn't a monolithic entity, or a collctive entity.. it's a conduit...I'm sure you know that.

Are some of us whiners,, spoiled,, expect too much,,, possibly. Nobody's career will hinge on the release of the new MS20 ....so no pressure there. But really....people need to stop thinking about something like this as being a replica of something 20 years ago... It isn't going to happen.

Make great music with what you have...If that;'s the new MS20,, then I'm sure talented people will make some amazing music with it. But don't wait for anything to emerge or be re released....Don't live in someone else's past.....they didn't.

It's not about the racing stripes......

it's the car

Be the car.
Old 20th February 2013 | Show parent
  #819
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skira's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Acid Hazard ➡️
We have a complete re-release of one of the most in demand vintage synths for a damn good price, and yet the internet complains.
Old 20th February 2013 | Show parent
  #820
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
If this thing is in fact a clone circuit wise shouldn't the envelopes sound the same? I am a little puzzled by this. I understand that an old MS 20 with aging components will sound a little more erratic and therefore more pleasing to some ears. However, I seriously doubt that aging components will result in snappier envelopes. I have one on order as well and I will send it straight back if the envelopes are weaker than I expect. In my music world weak envelopes seriously limit synthesis capabilities.
Old 20th February 2013 | Show parent
  #821
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by funkyspacecadet ➡️
What’s the build quality like? Is it made of plastic? Does it feel like crap?
Since Reptil and I played the same model I guess we disagree on what the pots feel like. I think they are clunky and it seems that they are directly on the motherboard of the synth and are not attached to the metal frontplate. So that means they can't take a lot of abuse and may get problematic on the long run by wearing out faster than you'd like.
Besides that I still would like to get one because it may be a nice addition to my SEM.
Old 20th February 2013 | Show parent
  #822
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Just ran a little test on the clips from the Mini and the original. The reason the filter snaps sound so different is because the highs are rolled off of the mini starting around 10k. It is a fairly steep roll off and I am assuming this is how they achieved the lower noise ratio.
Old 20th February 2013 | Show parent
  #823
Gear Head
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by fuse ➡️
Since Reptil and I played the same model I guess we disagree on what the pots feel like. I think they are clunky and it seems that they are directly on the motherboard of the synth and are not attached to the metal frontplate. So that means they can't take a lot of abuse and may get problematic on the long run by wearing out faster than you'd like.
Besides that I still would like to get one because it may be a nice addition to my SEM.
Are the original MS20 knobs PCB or case mounted?
Old 20th February 2013 | Show parent
  #824
Gear Maniac
 
sensorfold's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
I figure if we get enough criticisms and complaints and projected concerns about the MS20-mini on this thread some people will cancel their pre-orders and mine could get moved up to mid-April. So keep 'em coming!
This thing costs less than a lot of software. I don't expect it to be as robust as the original. For the cost I can give it extra care. Carry it myself.
Midi notes on this is a simple step forward. Record midi notes then set up an audio track and tweak away.
Lots of retailers offer a 30 day satisfaction guarantee. If within that time frame you feel you can't live with the shortcomings- slow envelopes, poor VCA, plastic knobs, wobbly controls, etc., return it. If after a while there's a problem this shouldn't be hard to fix or modify as the specs have been public for a long time.
Even if a third party mod is $200 this thing would still be a phenomenal bargain.
Or buy the original on the Bay for $1500 to $2000. The choice is yours.
Old 20th February 2013 | Show parent
  #825
Gear Nut
 
🎧 5 years
I do for one make music with what I have and if I personally like the sound of an Ms-20 and want to make music with one and not spend $1,600-2,000 then that is what I'm gonna do. For someone to say "be the car" on GS is pretty funny. I partially agree but this forum is the most anti "be the car" place on the Internet. That's very close to taking a vow to never buy another piece of gear again!! Also, people will make great music with whatever musical instrument speaks to them it's not my right to decide what that instrument is, old or new design. If your are going to say that then I hope that you only own new Roland products! Jk

How about this question: If you walked into a pawn shop and they were selling an MS-20 for $600 would you buy it if that was in your budget and you didn't already have one? Or would you say, eww yuk that's old.

Plus, I don't know why someone could get upset about an amazing synth at an affordable price. It has much much better tone than a lot of new analog synths , that's my main deciding factor. I'm glad more people of varying income brackets will have access to a classic synth, bring on the tunes people!
Old 20th February 2013
  #826
Gear Head
 
🎧 10 years
A friend just pointed me to this lil' gadget Kenton CV to Hz/V board

So in theory this should help with interfacing it with other CV devices.
Old 20th February 2013 | Show parent
  #827
Gear Head
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by CV_Wonder ➡️
Plus, I don't know why someone could get upset about an amazing synth at an affordable price. It has much much better tone than a lot of new analog synths , that's my main deciding factor. I'm glad more people of varying income brackets will have access to a classic synth, bring on the tunes people!
^ This.

I'm so glad there are more options to choose from, some of them quite affordable, like the Minibrute, Tetra etc; Bring on the analogue revolution!
Old 20th February 2013 | Show parent
  #828
Gear Nut
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by funkyspacecadet ➡️
A friend just pointed me to this lil' gadget Kenton CV to Hz/V board

So in theory this should help with interfacing it with other CV devices.
Perfect!
Old 20th February 2013 | Show parent
  #829
Lives for gear
 
R3Member's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Acid Hazard ➡️
We have a complete re-release of one of the most in demand vintage synths for a damn good price, and yet the internet complains.

In all fairness though, I think all these types of complaints are what drove Korg to release this. I remember when the monotrons started coming out, tons of people complained about them for weeks on end saying Korg should just re-release a real MS-20. Korg gives us this, and sure enough, more still more complaining

What's more funny is that all these complaints are based on a review. How many people here have actually played an original MS-20 in person? There's one that has been sitting in this music shop in my city for months now that I've messing with every few weeks, so the fact that I can pick up a Mini instead of shelling out $2,000 is a really great thing. The differences are really not going to bug me as long as the oscillators and filters or more or less the same. The build quality on the original is honestly not much better, yet has stood the test of time. As for the envelope sounding different, if people did actually read the full review and comment section, they would see that it explained in detail not once, but twice.

From the review:

"I did find that setting knobs in identical positions on envelopes and other parameters produced slightly different results, but I would again attribute this to age and other variations; if you ignored the exact knob position and listened to the sound, matching the two was easy."

From the comment section (by the reviewer):

My judgment, at least, was that these weren't so significant musically - Benjamin was more concerned about the envelope timing differences, however.

There are a number of potential reasons, even with the same internal circuit architecture. Quality variation is one - as a commenter notes here, tolerances in components when the original MS-20 was produced were higher than now. Age (and dirt) is another.

When you actually produce sounds, though, these subtle differences wind up for me falling away. And as I said, I was able to dial up sounds so similar that I could convincingly use the two MS-20s to produce polyphony, which for me was the big test.
Old 20th February 2013 | Show parent
  #830
Gear Head
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by CV_Wonder ➡️
Perfect!
Yeah, it's quite the.. CV Wonder...

*shoots self in foot*

Old 20th February 2013 | Show parent
  #831
Lives for gear
 
SonicBern's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Acid Hazard ➡️
We have a complete re-release of one of the most in demand vintage synths for a damn good price, and yet the internet complains.




Acid Hazard, I say we Ignore the complainers
Old 20th February 2013
  #832
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by funkyspacecadet ➡️
A friend just pointed me to this lil' gadget Kenton CV to Hz/V board

So in theory this should help with interfacing it with other CV devices.
They don't sell this anymore. Just try to add it to shopping cart.
Old 20th February 2013 | Show parent
  #833
Gear Head
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bergman ➡️
They don't sell this anymore. Just try to add it to shopping cart.
D'oh, well I'm sure others will be out there, though it's not a train wreck if I can't use it to trigger my Slim Phatty, would've just been a bonus.
Old 20th February 2013
  #834
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Spectral Climax's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
A new comparison praising the similarities to the original...

Tested: MS-20 Mini versus Original MS-20, in the Studio [Discussion, Audio, Photos]


PS: No Control Change message support there...just note off / note on...
Old 20th February 2013
  #835
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nectarios's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Automating the cut-off! Hello stereo MS-20 patches with 4 VCOs... Nice!
Old 20th February 2013 | Show parent
  #836
Gear Nut
 
🎧 10 years
I only have room for one analog mono, the question is do I sell my Mopho Keyboard for the Ms20.

versatility vs tone?
Old 20th February 2013 | Show parent
  #837
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Wow! The above post just made me realize what an amazing combo an MS 20 and a Evolver would make!
Old 20th February 2013 | Show parent
  #838
Lives for gear
 
Spectral Climax's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by thesystemite ➡️
I only have room for one analog mono, the question is do I sell my Mopho Keyboard for the Ms20.

versatility vs tone?
I have the same dilemma...I'm tending to keep the Mopho though...Without having a strong basic character or many design limitations, It lets me alone to decide how I want to make it sound instead of leading me to make very characteristic or cliche sounds with it.
Old 21st February 2013
  #839
Gear Addict
 
🎧 10 years
What Eurorack modules would be good additions to the new MS-20, after getting the hertz/volts converter thingy?
Old 21st February 2013 | Show parent
  #840
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spectral Climax ➡️
A new comparison praising the similarities to the original...

Tested: MS-20 Mini versus Original MS-20, in the Studio [Discussion, Audio, Photos]


PS: No Control Change message support there...just note off / note on...
Ha, yeah dude, what do you think everyone's been talking about for the past couple pages?
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