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DSI Prophet 12
Old 25th January 2013 | Show parent
  #271
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Gringo Starr's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
It's amazing to see the amount of careless negativity that circulates here. How can anyone come to a conclusion on this synth based on the limited amount of sound clips and videos that are available?
Old 25th January 2013 | Show parent
  #272
Gear Addict
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gringo Starr ➑️
It's amazing to see the amount of careless negativity that circulates here. How can anyone come to a conclusion on this synth based on the limited amount of sound clips and videos that are available?
+1
Old 25th January 2013 | Show parent
  #273
Deleted User
Guest
great synth
Old 25th January 2013 | Show parent
  #274
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 10 years
O teh funky GAASSSSSSSSS
Old 25th January 2013 | Show parent
  #275
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synthguy's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
It does have the DSI P-08 sound to it, which I don't see as a bad thing. But much bigger, and with extra juice.

Really, I think what everyone should consider is what you can do with such an insane amount of sound generators, filters, modulators and effects on this thing. Okay, you don't have a step sequencer - buy a Mopho or an Arturia Origin to go with it.

You have four oscillators. Double that, and you have eight. Tune them, and you have one-finger chords. Four may be digital wavetables, but I recall his sawtooth samples are pretty good.

You have dual filters. Layer them, and you can have beefier 24db filters doubled with 12db filters for tantalizing textures.

You have FOUR DELAYS. You should be able to out TD Tangerine Dream. I bet you can get chorus and flanging with them.

You have tunable feedback, and STEREO ANALOG DISTORTION. Plus the other grindy effects. More dirt than a wheatfield. And I'm betting Girth and Air are bass and treble EQ.

You have FOUR LFOs and FOUR ADSRs. And there are assignable sources and destinations with almost everything.

Guys, if you layer two patches, you're getting a MASSIVE semi-modular mostly ANALOG PROGRAMMABLE SYNTHESIZER. Yes, it's got a strong DSI flavor, but for crying out loud... just think of it as a slightly lighter, sizzlier GRP A8. But polyphonic and programmable. And what did that mono beast sell for again??

Jeepers, I'm getting gas just pondering what I could do with all those knobs over a weekend of programming...

Quote:
Originally Posted by EvilDragon ➑️
Well whining escalated quickly.
Now you know how Roland feels.
Old 25th January 2013 | Show parent
  #276
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
oscillators like the cyclebox, morphing terrarium and the WMD PDO have showed me that digital is the way forward when it comes to osc.

this synth is good news!
Old 25th January 2013 | Show parent
  #277
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ohmicide's Avatar
what's hilarious is that a lot of peeps are saying that it sounds bigger and fatter than the Prophet '08 which goes to show how bland the '08 oscillators sounds

or maybe it's just the fact that it can have up to 48 oscillators stacked up which gives the illusion of sounding huge and fat

so what is it then? P'08 just doesn't sound that great or is everyone just comparing apples and oranges like always and not realizing that every synth is different and there's almost no point in comparing?

there is no way to compare this thing to anything really, all you have are demos, which showcase it's ridiculous amount of oscillators and doesn't really put it in comparison with the P'08 or any other synth at all

it's a new synth, it's a hybrid, it seems very capable but is it revolutionary or anything crazy new that you couldn't already do with software or older wavetable synths? I don't think so

it seems like a great synth for sound designers and wavetable enthusiast, not so much for the analog enthusiasts and not at all a Prophet '08 replacement, nor any other polyphonic analog or virtual analog synth

this would be a real game changer if they would have given it more synthesis types like the Virus TI has but with an analog signal path

if you're going to make a digital synth then you needa own up to it and give it the best you got, not just throw some wavetables on it, a bunch of filters, a pretty box and call it a day

there isn't even a single word about the oscillators being wavetables, at least not all of then, are they trying to hide it so more people gain interest in it thinking it's a 48 DCO analog monster? why not just market it like it is?

this is why I am not impressed
Old 25th January 2013 | Show parent
  #278
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shponglefan's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Given the hybrid nature of this synth, I don't think it makes much sense to compare to a P'08 (for the record the P'08 is an awesome synth). Most of the sounds in the demos sound nothing like the P'08.
Old 25th January 2013 | Show parent
  #279
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natefrogg's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
i feel that it sounds gorgeous, can't wait to hear one in real life and give it a spin when shops start getting them
Old 25th January 2013 | Show parent
  #280
Gear Addict
 
sizzlemeister's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
what's hilarious is that there are peeps saying this new DSI synth ain't no thing or are using it to diss DSI's prior work

which just goes to show people will say anything on an internet message board because they can

is it something people are immediately coveting and because some people know they can't afford it they're knocking it early without really any info what-so-ever?

or is it that there are people who simply can't understand why people will gravitate towards hardware regardless of the capabilities of software?

just asking the questions is all, 'cause there're always the people who want to be in control of everything and can't let the rest enjoy the moment

DSI always seems to be crapped on by internet forum people and yet they sell enough gear to not only survive, but develop and release new and interesting instruments for internet forum people to crap on

amazing how synth peeps can be, and it really shows when new gear is released
Old 25th January 2013 | Show parent
  #281
Gear Addict
 
🎧 5 years
I'll be honest...my hype was short-lived. When i saw it and heard it (the demo at least) i jumped like many others, yet later i the day i started to think about the Prophet 08 9dont judge me) and listened to some sound demos and such...honestly, i liked it more than the Prophet 12.

Is that bad? not really, i just liked the P08 more...sure, it doesnt have 48 oscillators, quad multimode delay, high and low pass filters, wavetables, touch strips (this i wish the P08 had) and the rest...but...im not sure. Im inclined more towards the P08...seems to be my cup of tea...

My 2 cents btw
Old 25th January 2013 | Show parent
  #282
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
this thing seems like it could be really powerful.. 4 LFOs per voice, waveshaping, tuned feedback path, 4 tap delay per voice, all those envelopes. a mod matrix that is likely to be as deep as anything that exists...

the synthesis/sound design potential is all there. a real playground for the right person.

complex waveshapes, feedback, lot's of modulation.. yeah... someone who knows what he/she is doing can really get a lot out of this.. i bet it gets weird and far outside a basic analog sound.

i look forward to more details about the oscillator wave shapes etc.
Old 25th January 2013 | Show parent
  #283
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synthguy's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by ohmicide ➑️
it's a new synth, it's a hybrid, it seems very capable but is it revolutionary or anything crazy new that you couldn't already do with software or older wavetable synths? I don't think so
I really don't see how you can say that. I will admit that you could put a few synths soft and hard together like this:

Diva
Reaktor
OP-X
FM8
Omnisphere
Virus
Radias
Blofeld

And say all your synth bases are covered. I could do it too, say like:

KORG Kronos
Arturia Origin

There, all you need for a universe of sound.

And be completely true. And also be completely wrong in a sense, because you're ignoring how different each instrument is, real or virtual. You know, if Diva is so cool, why is Reaktor still selling? And if Reaktor is so awesome, why is Zebra still selling? And why are people still buying Kronoses and Voyagers and Jupiter-80s and Prophet-08s? It's because everything does something the other guy doesn't, and sounds a little different too. A Virus, a Gaia, a Nord Wave and a Radias all are VAs, but they sound pretty different from each other. I will have to say that softsynths sound much too samey to me, so most of the character I accrue to their flexibility and routability, and how vintage analog they sound.

So here we have this beastie. Unlike Shponglefan, I hear a lot of Prophet-08 character in it. But I also hear a lot more. Dave Smith's noodling intro was pretty amazing. The big pad at the start had some Blofeld character to it, along with the P-08 I expected to hear. It sounded like two synths MIDIed, but it wasn't, so I know that there are some things that are a gestalt different between a P-08 and a P-12. How can you say what four OSCs running through dual LP-HP filters of different slopes, mangled with tuneable feedback and stereo distortion are going to sound like? And this is before you even layer something.

No, this isn't just a P-08 with a bunch more chips inside, or a PEK on steroids. This is a new being, and what it can do will be defined by the musicians who know how to get those parameters to dance in ways only they can together.

And... I second what ignatius said above in fewer sentences.
Old 25th January 2013 | Show parent
  #284
Lives for gear
 
2 Reviews written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by ohmicide ➑️
this is why I am not impressed
What other types of synthesis would you like to see? Reading your posts I think you're looking for things to not like because you were hoping for something else. Since DSI hasn't pulled the 08 I don't think they'd consider this a replacement.

Quote:
throw some wavetables on it, a bunch of filters, a pretty box and call it a day
Interestingly the Wave is selling for like 8 grand and that's really all it does. The Microwave is probably the biggest pain in the ass synth to program but it sells for over a thousand and it's only trick is exactly what you described.

As for other synthesis types, it lacks DX7 style FM. Big deal. What other types of synthesis would you like to see in order for this to be ground breaking in your opinion?

If you don't like it you don't like it, but it doesn't help to post over and over that you're not impressed. We get it. Don't buy it.

Go bug the folks at Access to create an analog filter version of the Virus for you.
Old 25th January 2013 | Show parent
  #285
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The Hamburglar's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
"This looks awesome"
"This doesn't look that great"
"People are so negative"
Old 25th January 2013 | Show parent
  #286
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greenlights's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Polygon Cube ➑️
I'll be honest...my hype was short-lived. When i saw it and heard it (the demo at least) i jumped like many others, yet later i the day i started to think about the Prophet 08 9dont judge me) and listened to some sound demos and such...honestly, i liked it more than the Prophet 12.

Is that bad? not really, i just liked the P08 more...sure, it doesnt have 48 oscillators, quad multimode delay, high and low pass filters, wavetables, touch strips (this i wish the P08 had) and the rest...but...im not sure. Im inclined more towards the P08...seems to be my cup of tea...

My 2 cents btw
I feel just like you. I think I'll get the Prophet 08, I already have a Virus TI2 and Slim Phatty.
Old 25th January 2013 | Show parent
  #287
Lives for gear
 
ohmicide's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Hamburglar ➑️
"This looks awesome"
"This doesn't look that great"
"People are so negative"
Lmfao exactly
Old 25th January 2013 | Show parent
  #288
Gear Maniac
 
Lotus Voltage's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by mike vee ➑️
All those little boutique mono synths are wack to me.
The boutique manufacturers are making some of the best synths around. How is your statement that "all boutique synths are wack" any different from the people saying "this Prophet 12 doesn't sound that good"?

The Prophet 5 was designed and made when Sequential Circuits was still a boutique manufacturer.
Old 25th January 2013 | Show parent
  #289
Gear Addict
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by greenlights ➑️
I feel just like you. I think I'll get the Prophet 08, I already have a Virus TI2 and Slim Phatty.
Get the P08 and be ready to have the fattest f-cking smile for the rest of your life. That synth is pure GOLD.

Not saying the P12 isn't... just saying that P08 definitely is.
Old 25th January 2013 | Show parent
  #290
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by ohmicide ➑️
what's hilarious is that a lot of peeps are saying that it sounds bigger and fatter than the Prophet '08 which goes to show how bland the '08 oscillators sounds

or maybe it's just the fact that it can have up to 48 oscillators stacked up which gives the illusion of sounding huge and fat

so what is it then? P'08 just doesn't sound that great or is everyone just comparing apples and oranges like always and not realizing that every synth is different and there's almost no point in comparing?

there is no way to compare this thing to anything really, all you have are demos, which showcase it's ridiculous amount of oscillators and doesn't really put it in comparison with the P'08 or any other synth at all

it's a new synth, it's a hybrid, it seems very capable but is it revolutionary or anything crazy new that you couldn't already do with software or older wavetable synths? I don't think so

it seems like a great synth for sound designers and wavetable enthusiast, not so much for the analog enthusiasts and not at all a Prophet '08 replacement, nor any other polyphonic analog or virtual analog synth

this would be a real game changer if they would have given it more synthesis types like the Virus TI has but with an analog signal path

if you're going to make a digital synth then you needa own up to it and give it the best you got, not just throw some wavetables on it, a bunch of filters, a pretty box and call it a day

there isn't even a single word about the oscillators being wavetables, at least not all of then, are they trying to hide it so more people gain interest in it thinking it's a 48 DCO analog monster? why not just market it like it is?

this is why I am not impressed
I have little doubt that yourself, and others, will run out and buy these up once they're seen in the studio of whatever flavor of the month producer is being idolized at the time.

Kudos to DSI though. Looks like a very capable synth, and I can't wait to see some more details.
Old 25th January 2013 | Show parent
  #291
Lives for gear
 
ohmicide's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by SovietSpaceChild ➑️
I have little doubt that yourself, and others, will run out and buy these up once they're seen in the studio of whatever flavor of the month producer is being idolized at the time.
nawt me, I'm hardware synth free and loving it
Old 25th January 2013 | Show parent
  #292
Lives for gear
 
greenlights's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Signifier ➑️
Who needs 'beefy'? One synth in you arsenal needs to do 'beefy', and the others need to fit into the mix without fighting with each other. This appears to be one of those rare gems, I think.
So what do you do when you have a Virus TI2 and a Slim Phatty already?? Sounds like I need the 08.
Old 25th January 2013 | Show parent
  #293
Pym
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Updated the main post with additional spec details.

I'll do my best to answer questions here and at dsiforum.org just as I did with the Tempest in the days to come.

The big details are largely ironed out but we still have a few surprises in store before the instrument hits the shelves, lot of ideas still swimming around on the details of many of the FX, Delay, and UI implementation that hopefully will make it in before we ship!
Old 25th January 2013 | Show parent
  #294
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pym ➑️
Updated the main post with additional spec details.

I'll do my best to answer questions here and at dsiforum.org just as I did with the Tempest in the days to come.

The big details are largely ironed out but we still have a few surprises in store before the instrument hits the shelves, lot of ideas still swimming around on the details of many of the FX, Delay, and UI implementation that hopefully will make it in before we ship!
What's the internal sample rate of the digital portion of this synth? 48khz? 96khz?
Old 25th January 2013 | Show parent
  #295
Pym
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Some answers to questions and some comments off the top of my head:
  • The oscillators are digital. Some options are wavetable based, but we may change the selected wavetables by the final release. You have fully sweepable wavetables between 3 waveforms, one in the center of the shape mod param and the other two on either extreme
  • I do not believe we will have user wavetable uploads. This is due to the implementation where we very carefully craft multiple wavetables to improve the oscillator across a larger range with extremely low aliasing
  • The 4 delay lines, per voice, have a REALLY large range. Nearly a 1 second buffer and lots of resolution on the fine end so you can easily get effects of flangers, chorus, reverb, delay, and even a looper using the feedback control. We are looking into adding additional modes for the final release, including stereo and ping-pong type effects
  • The analog lowpass filter has been cleaned up and extended an extra octave from the Prophet '08 series. This gives it a noticeable sheen in the high end that is not present in our older voices
  • The highpass is similar to the one present in the Tempest but with resonance. There is a 'hidden' feature allowing you to push it into self-oscillation
  • The stereo analog distortion is based off of the distortion circuit in the Tempest with an improved, smooth dry/wet transition
Old 25th January 2013 | Show parent
  #296
Pym
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Some answers to questions and some comments off the top of my head:
  • The oscillators are digital. Some options are wavetable based, but we may change the selected wavetables by the final release. You have fully sweepable wavetables between 3 waveforms, one in the center of the shape mod param and the other two on either extreme
  • I do not believe we will have user wavetable uploads. This is due to the implementation where we very carefully craft multiple wavetables to improve the oscillator across a larger range with extremely low aliasing
  • The 4 delay lines, per voice, have a REALLY large range. Nearly a 1 second buffer and lots of resolution on the fine end so you can easily get effects of flangers, chorus, reverb, delay, and even a looper using the feedback control. We are looking into adding additional modes for the final release, including stereo and ping-pong type effects
  • The analog lowpass filter has been cleaned up and extended an extra octave from the Prophet '08 series. This gives it a noticeable sheen in the high end that is not present in our older voices
  • The highpass is similar to the one present in the Tempest but with resonance. There is a 'hidden' feature allowing you to push it into self-oscillation
  • The stereo analog distortion is based off of the distortion circuit in the Tempest with an improved, smooth dry/wet transition
Old 25th January 2013 | Show parent
  #297
Gear Addict
 
🎧 10 years
It's more like a Poly Evolver '12 than a Prophet '12. Not a bad thing, just a bit misleading. I would love to have one, but I would also get a Tetra or Prophet 08 (or any other analog poly) to go with it.
Old 25th January 2013 | Show parent
  #298
Gear Guru
 
Yoozer's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
From the specs:

Quote:
4 wavetable based sources
How should I read this? 4 wavetables to choose from, or...?

edit: already answered for user wavetables but arguably the aliasing is part of the charm
Old 25th January 2013 | Show parent
  #299
Pym
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
The ADC/DAC portion are 44.1kHz, but internally we process faster. The analog control voltage updates are >11kHz, and the LFOs can go up to that speed (almost effectively adds 4 additional oscillators). I don't have final numbers since we're still tweaking the DSP code and won't finalize until we've done a good amount of additional optimization

Quote:
Originally Posted by SovietSpaceChild ➑️
What's the internal sample rate of the digital portion of this synth? 48khz? 96khz?
Old 25th January 2013 | Show parent
  #300
Pym
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
In many respects the voice is more similar the Evolver series. The Prophet name was chosen in no small part because this is a keyboardist's keyboard. The evolver crossed into production, FX processing and other realms whereas the Prophet '08 was solidly a keyboard. So we decided this felt like a Prophet in spirit and went with the name.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JimmiG ➑️
It's more like a Poly Evolver '12 than a Prophet '12. Not a bad thing, just a bit misleading. I would love to have one, but I would also get a Tetra or Prophet 08 (or any other analog poly) to go with it.
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