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Old 29th January 2015 | Show parent
  #31
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Hollowman9's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by nowaysj ➑️
I wasn't really looking for a cz. I know the sound a bit, and it was definitely on my radar. I never see them come up. I see one locally for $250. Just wondering if that is a legit price. If so, I might do it if the synth checks out.
The prices fluctuate a bit but are generally rising. I got my 1st CZ-1 in 2006 for $76 and my 2nd one last year for $200 mint which I thought was very fair.
IMO $250 is high for the 5000. If it is in mint condition then $200 is fair. Otherwise offer $175. The 5000 is unique in having a sequencer but it is pretty primitive and not worth extra compared to a CZ3000 IMO.
Old 29th January 2015 | Show parent
  #32
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nowaysj's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by robot gigante ➑️
I've seen a couple CZ-5000's come up locally recently for $200 - $250. Seems fair.
You're not the guy selling this cz are you?

Old 29th January 2015 | Show parent
  #33
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nowaysj's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hollowman9 ➑️
The prices fluctuate a bit but are generally rising. I got my 1st CZ-1 in 2006 for $76 and my 2nd one last year for $200 mint which I thought was very fair.
IMO $250 is high for the 5000. If it is in mint condition then $200 is fair. Otherwise offer $175. The 5000 is unique in having a sequencer but it is pretty primitive and not worth extra compared to a CZ3000 IMO.
Okay, thanks for the input. Really appreciate it.
Old 29th January 2015 | Show parent
  #34
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Hollowman9's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by nowaysj ➑️
Okay, thanks for the input. Really appreciate it.
You're welcome. Out of curiosity I searched my local CL and a CZ3000 came up with a asking price of $250. I don't see it going anywhere for that price though. Folks tend to ask too much expecting to be haggled on CL.
Old 29th January 2015 | Show parent
  #35
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robot gigante's Avatar
 
2 Reviews written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by nowaysj ➑️
You're not the guy selling this cz are you?

Haha, no... I just have a CZ-1000, which is good enough for me for now. $250 does seem a little steep.
Old 29th January 2015 | Show parent
  #36
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Someone on eBay recently had a '5000 for $790 + $77 for standard shipping. Needless to say no one bought it.
Old 29th January 2015 | Show parent
  #37
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eat ➑️
The only way I recall to stack any sounds was in mono mode where you can layer 4 sounds on top of one another but now you're down to single note polyphony. Not sure if you get 2 note polyphony using single osc's for each patch. I could never stack patches... not that I even tried that much... Probably user error tho'.

So basically if you have one 101, you're stuck with one patch at a time...and then only four notes [or eight notes with a one-osc patch].
The only thing to add to that is, you can stack two MONOPHONIC sounds on a cz101 using the Tone Mix button. iirc, you pick a patch, hit the button, then pick a second patch the usual way.

To stack different patches in Mono mode, you would need to send the same MIDI notes on different channels from another keyboard or sequencer, via the 101's MIDI in. That's how Mono mode works: You have 4 different patches, each being played on its own MIDI channel.
-------
fwiw, I thought the big CZ I had for a minute (don't remember which) WAS cleaner than the 101, but this might just mean the two 101s I own are showing their age. Both of them give a certain amount of digital background noise, which has become worse on my first 101 as its little electronic body decays. Maybe the third-party wall wart exacerbates this, I dunno.

The CZs are very worthwhile if you are willling to spend time programming them. There are certain places they just won't go, vs. analog or FM synths, but what they do well has a unique character, and does not sound cheap.
Old 29th January 2015 | Show parent
  #38
Gear Head
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by percussion boy ➑️
The only thing to add to that is, you can stack two MONOPHONIC sounds on a cz101 using the Tone Mix button. iirc, you pick a patch, hit the button, then pick a second patch the usual way.

To stack different patches in Mono mode, you would need to send the same MIDI notes on different channels from another keyboard or sequencer, via the 101's MIDI in. That's how Mono mode works: You have 4 different patches, each being played on its own MIDI channel.
-------
fwiw, I thought the big CZ I had for a minute (don't remember which) WAS cleaner than the 101, but this might just mean the two 101s I own are showing their age. Both of them give a certain amount of digital background noise, which has become worse on my first 101 as its little electronic body decays. Maybe the third-party wall wart exacerbates this, I dunno.

The CZs are very worthwhile if you are willling to spend time programming them. There are certain places they just won't go, vs. analog or FM synths, but what they do well has a unique character, and does not sound cheap.
is 101 multitimbral? can you trigger four different patches each on its own midi channel?
Old 29th January 2015
  #39
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
Feeling a lot of CZ love on this thread. I've had a CZ101 for ages, occasionally it comes out to play. I like it, it's a lot of fun. Reading this makes me want to dig it out again.

I seem to remember it was fun to sequence with short gate times, fast envelopes perhaps (or maybe I imagined this, it's been a while)...

Given my new fondness for outboard, I think I'll plug this in over the weekend. So are the CZ range all programmable over MIDI? Sys-ex or CC or both?
Old 30th January 2015 | Show parent
  #40
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by utrop ➑️
is 101 multitimbral? can you trigger four different patches each on its own midi channel?
Yes.

If any CZ people are curious, I will pull my cz tonight and post instructions.

(One book I have claims you can do up to 8 patches on 8 channels, but I only remember ever getting 4 patches on a CZ101, which only has four voice polyphony with 2-osc patches. . . . Maybe some/all of the big CZs offer greater polyphony, and more patches/channels in mono mode?)
Old 30th January 2015
  #41
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
My favourite patch with the CZ300 is taking a fairly bright "Jump"ish obie type sound and then layering it with an FM-esque tinkly sound - was something unique that most analogues or DX7's couldn't do at the time (like I said, bought mine new in the 80's as an "inbetween analogue and FM" type synth) - was useful live - padded things out and cut through simultaneously.
Old 30th January 2015 | Show parent
  #42
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nowaysj's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Not to dampen the love, but what do you say to

CZ 5000

vs.

Esq-1


READY!

FIGHT!
Old 30th January 2015 | Show parent
  #43
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Spectralwaves's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
There is the newly designed Virtual CZ , which CZ users seem to be really pleased about. Its supposed to sound exactly the same & can load all CZ patches .

I think there was a thread on here about it?

or see Page 1 of 'Keyboards & Synthesis' on the Sound On Sound Forums,

"My favourite synth goes 'soft' Virtual CZ"
Old 30th January 2015 | Show parent
  #44
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robot gigante's Avatar
 
2 Reviews written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by nowaysj ➑️
Not to dampen the love, but what do you say to

CZ 5000

vs.

Esq-1


READY!

FIGHT!
Different sounds! Get both.

As a CZ owner, I love the sound of Virtual CZ. A+
Old 30th January 2015 | Show parent
  #45
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nowaysj's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by robot gigante ➑️
Different sounds! Get both.

As a CZ owner, I love the sound of Virtual CZ. A+
When I saw Virtual CZ released, my eyeballs rolled around in my head.

Okay then, new fight:

Virtual CZ

vs.

SQ8L


READY!

FIGHT!



I ask because both of these (hardware) synths are selling locally to me. I'm desperately seeking a raw 80's synth, I like both of the sounds, but I don't know much about the actual hardware of each. Like how much range each has in terms of synth engine, how robust the hardware is...

Say I could get each for $200, is one a better deal than the other?

I think if it were just down to sound, maybe I'd go Esq-1... I don't know. You slutz are so knowledgeable, I'd love to just be able to sit in and listen to a convo directly comparing these units. Unfortunately, I don't have much to say, but I do have a great amount to benefit.

Old 30th January 2015 | Show parent
  #46
Lives for gear
 
robot gigante's Avatar
 
2 Reviews written
🎧 15 years
Oh damn, tough call.

But personally I would go with the ESQ-1. I just like the Ensoniq sound, there is the filter which the CZ's don't have, and they seem to be harder to find - I see CZ's popping up all over the place but not the Ensoniqs. So you could probably find a 101 or a 1000 for super cheap later or use Virtual CZ which is excellent and imho as good as the hardware, just a little cleaner. SQ8L is excellent too... Win/win. I don't own an ESQ-1 though, so take that with a grain of salt. There is an ESQ-M available locally here, I am very tempted... love the PPG-ish bell tones.
Old 30th January 2015
  #47
Gear Head
 
🎧 5 years
Esq 1 has got an excellent 8 track sequencer
Old 30th January 2015 | Show parent
  #48
Gear Head
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by percussion boy ➑️
Yes.

If any CZ people are curious, I will pull my cz tonight and post instructions.

(One book I have claims you can do up to 8 patches on 8 channels, but I only remember ever getting 4 patches on a CZ101, which only has four voice polyphony with 2-osc patches. . . . Maybe some/all of the big CZs offer greater polyphony, and more patches/channels in mono mode?)
I would really like instructions btw

Last edited by utrop; 30th January 2015 at 09:38 AM..
Old 30th January 2015 | Show parent
  #49
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robot gigante's Avatar
 
2 Reviews written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by utrop ➑️
I would really like instructions ????
Select patch
Go into mono mode (press solo button)
Press MIDI button
Set MIDI channel for the first patch
The next three patches will be on the next three MIDI channels, so if the first patch is patch one on MIDI channel one, patches two three and four will be on MIDI channels two three and four.

It's been a sec since I have done this, so please excuse any inaccuracies.
Old 30th January 2015 | Show parent
  #50
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Spectralwaves's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Well I would go for the ESQ1 myself, because Ive always wanted one.

They are not at all comparable sound wise in my opinion, apart from they are both 80s synths & they can both do pleasing bell like tones.

I don't know either well enough to say , but from what I do know is that the ESQ1 has CEM analogue filters so it is a hybrid & can produce that hybrid- with- CEM -filters sound that the Korg DW8000 can somewhat ,but with its own version of analogue filters, & the Prophet VS & Waldorf Microwave 1, all being digital oscillator based synths,with CEM analogue filters & amps.

The CZ seems to me to produce a more 'digital' refined sound , from what Ive heard, but it does sound nice.

The ESQ1 can get more raw / 80s analogy in its tones & is set up much more traditionally in its architecture than the CZ which is more like Yamahas FM in its implementation.
Old 30th January 2015 | Show parent
  #51
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robot gigante's Avatar
 
2 Reviews written
🎧 15 years
Digital yes, refined, no! It can sound nice, but PD is like FM's skanky cigarette-smoking cousin.

Otherwise I agree.
Old 30th January 2015 | Show parent
  #52
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by robot gigante ➑️
Digital yes, refined, no! It can sound nice, but PD is like FM's skanky cigarette-smoking cousin.

Otherwise I agree.
Hehe, maybe it's that FM is just too polite, sometimes...
Old 30th January 2015 | Show parent
  #53
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by SEED78 ➑️
I can't take one over a DX7IID though and that will fill last space in my rack - CZ101 it is.
I just have to ask. You know the DX7IID is a keyboard synth, right?
Old 30th January 2015 | Show parent
  #54
Gear Head
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by robot gigante ➑️
Select patch
Go into mono mode (press solo button)
Press MIDI button
Set MIDI channel for the first patch
The next three patches will be on the next three MIDI channels, so if the first patch is patch one on MIDI channel one, patches two three and four will be on MIDI channels two three and four.

It's been a sec since I have done this, so please excuse any inaccuracies.
Thanks alot, can't wait until try it out!
Old 30th January 2015 | Show parent
  #55
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by robot gigante ➑️
Select patch
Go into mono mode (press solo button)
Press MIDI button
Set MIDI channel for the first patch
The next three patches will be on the next three MIDI channels, so if the first patch is patch one on MIDI channel one, patches two three and four will be on MIDI channels two three and four.

It's been a sec since I have done this, so please excuse any inaccuracies.
The above is right, but I'm going to add the details since it can be a little confusing . . . the first time.

(As always with the CZ, use the CURSOR and VALUE buttons to get around and change values.)

------------
1. Press MIDI button.

2. Press SOLO button.

*You will see something like this:

MIDI CH=01 VO=1
PROG CHANGE = ENA

"MIDI CH" sets the LOWEST of the four channel numbers. You will always have your four sounds assigned to a block of four channels -- 3,4,5,6 or 9,10,11,12, etc.

"VO" represents the "voice" (patch) for each of the four sounds. As we will soon see, the numbering on-screen does not always behave the way you might expect.

"PROG CHANGE" allows you to set whether program changes are sent by MIDI. (I'm going to ignore that setting.)

3. Change the "MIDI CH" number to the MIDI channel you want as the lowest of the four channels. Let's say I want channels 2-3-4-5, so I will do this: "MIDI CH=02."

*When you change the MIDI CH number, the voice number will automatically change to match it . . . God knows why: "MIDI CH=02 VO=2." Don't worry about it.

4. Using the 8 preset buttons, the SELECT button, and the PRESET/INTERNAL/CARTRIDGE buttons as needed, choose the sound/patch you want for the lowest of the four channels -- in our example, Channel 2.

*You can play the sound from the keyboard if you need to hear it as you choose.

5. Move the cursor right, so it's under "VO=[the voice number]." Now INCREASE the voice number by one -- in our example "VO=3." This will be the SECOND patch, playing on MIDI channel 3.

*Notice that even though you changed the voice number, the channel number did not change on-screen. Don't worry about it.

6. Choose your second sound. Again, you can play the sound from the keyboard as you're choosing.

7. Repeat Steps 5 and 6, twice, to choose your third and fourth sounds. In our example, these would play on MIDI channels 4 and 5, respectively.

8. You're there.

******Don't turn SOLO off after doing all this, or the CZ will "forget" your four sound choices and you will have to do the entire procedure again.

*The CZ doesn't remember these multitimbral assignments when powered down.

*The procedure is apparently different for some of the other CZs, from what I've read. I haven't done it but can try to post the info I've seen if people want it.

--------
Hope this helps. Let me know if something doesn't work for you all as advertised..
Old 30th January 2015 | Show parent
  #56
Gear Head
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by percussion boy ➑️
The above is right, but I'm going to add the details since it can be a little confusing . . . the first time.

(As always with the CZ, use the CURSOR and VALUE buttons to get around and change values.)

------------
1. Press MIDI button.

2. Press SOLO button.

*You will see something like this:

MIDI CH=01 VO=1
PROG CHANGE = ENA

"MIDI CH" sets the LOWEST of the four channel numbers. You will always have your four sounds assigned to a block of four channels -- 3,4,5,6 or 9,10,11,12, etc.

"VO" represents the "voice" (patch) for each of the four sounds. As we will soon see, the numbering on-screen does not always behave the way you might expect.

"PROG CHANGE" allows you to set whether program changes are sent by MIDI. (I'm going to ignore that setting.)

3. Change the "MIDI CH" number to the MIDI channel you want as the lowest of the four channels. Let's say I want channels 2-3-4-5, so I will do this: "MIDI CH=02."

*When you change the MIDI CH number, the voice number will automatically change to match it . . . God knows why: "MIDI CH=02 VO=2." Don't worry about it.

4. Using the 8 preset buttons, the SELECT button, and the PRESET/INTERNAL/CARTRIDGE buttons as needed, choose the sound/patch you want for the lowest of the four channels -- in our example, Channel 2.

*You can play the sound from the keyboard if you need to hear it as you choose.

5. Move the cursor right, so it's under "VO=[the voice number]." Now INCREASE the voice number by one -- in our example "VO=3." This will be the SECOND patch, playing on MIDI channel 3.

*Notice that even though you changed the voice number, the channel number did not change on-screen. Don't worry about it.

6. Choose your second sound. Again, you can play the sound from the keyboard as you're choosing.

7. Repeat Steps 5 and 6, twice, to choose your third and fourth sounds. In our example, these would play on MIDI channels 4 and 5, respectively.

8. You're there.

******Don't turn SOLO off after doing all this, or the CZ will "forget" your four sound choices and you will have to do the entire procedure again.

*The CZ doesn't remember these multitimbral assignments when powered down.

*The procedure is apparently different for some of the other CZs, from what I've read. I haven't done it but can try to post the info I've seen if people want it.

--------
Hope this helps. Let me know if something doesn't work for you all as advertised..
Big fat like!

Thanks alot percussion boy
Old 30th January 2015 | Show parent
  #57
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by utrop ➑️
Big fat like!

Thanks alot percussion boy
You're welcome.

Enjoy the CZ, it's a little digital beast.
Old 30th January 2015 | Show parent
  #58
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Spectralwaves's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by robot gigante ➑️
Digital yes, refined, no! It can sound nice, but PD is like FM's skanky cigarette-smoking cousin.

Otherwise I agree.
Nice ..I like it!

I don't really have any hands on experience with the CZ I admit.
I think I know what it sounds like, but not in depth or to program.

Your description makes me want one now.
Old 30th January 2015
  #59
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
this thread got me thinking, my CZ is now out and ready for a clean and wiring up later. Time to remember what it can do...
Old 30th January 2015
  #60
Lives for gear
 
3 Reviews written
🎧 10 years
Had a CZ-1 for a few months, it was nice to noodle around with and had a fairly nice tone on the right sounds. Ultimately sold it as it was another one of the 'weaker' synths in my stash and don't miss it, but everyone should try one as they are so cheap anyway!
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