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New gear from Roland and BOSS, looking good!
Old 17th February 2013 | Show parent
  #211
Lives for gear
 
robot gigante's Avatar
 
2 Reviews written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by synthguy ➑️
It's only tough around here, where too many people pretend that live shows are full of Macbeths, GRP A8s, Pittsburgh Modulars and racks loaded with Doepfers or Dotcoms. Oh, and vintage MS-20s to the rafters. When in reality, most musicians are using Tritons, Fantoms, Motifs Kurzweils, Jupiters and Kronoses, with an occasional Voyager, Prophet 08 and Andromeda.

Chin up man, remember where you're at.
The reason for a lot of the hate is that, years ago, Roland alienated a major part of their fanbase. Their design aesthetic completely changed.

Still passionate fans of the old stuff, so we're still pissed about being given the cold shoulder by the big R.

I don't think that anyone assumes that peoples' live shows are full of the above synths, but it is an undeniable fact that vintage Roland synths and machines are featured on a huge amount of recordings from the past, nonstop to the present, that many people are inspired by. The sheer amount of recordings with this gear, and the fact that producers have always found new twists to this old technology is a good indication that the phenomenon is not limited to a few vocal posters on this forum.

So... there are many Roland fans here and elsewhere, actually... maybe we won't be buying the new stuff when the old stuff is more what we're into.... maybe we will rant about the new stuff especially now that prices for gear we like have been jacked by collectors and wannabe's out for cred and the synths themselves are getting old... it happens...
Old 17th February 2013 | Show parent
  #212
Lives for gear
 
synthguy's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by robot gigante ➑️
The reason for a lot of the hate is that, years ago, Roland alienated a major part of their fanbase. Their design aesthetic completely changed.
And how is that? By going digital? Well, guess who else did.

Alesis - and fast, sadly
AKAI
E-mu
Ensoniq
Kawai
KORG
Yamaha

Off the top of my head. And who rants at them all the day long?

Dave Smith accomplished the amazing feat of returning to analog AND alienating a substantial section of his fanbase! For that matter, Moog isn't without some scars too.

Arturia and KORG have managed to toss a couple of basic analog synths on the market - which of course some people STILL complain about - but I will admit that they are there. But don't you think Roland hasn't looked into this?

For instance, what would Roland be able to produce like the MiniBrute? Wracking my brain, I'm thinking the SH-101. Which right now is one of the most unpopular synths on the used market. People rant and rave about the TB-303 and Junos, and the only synths that really get fought over are the Juno-6 and 60. The a-Juno and MKS-50 which are similar, and which people swear are worthy analogs, usually just sit there or go for a couple of hundred.

Like most of you guys, I'd look farther back in the food chain to something like an SH-7. And of course it's made with discrete components, which even bought in bulk if possible would be an expensive purchase for any company. So Roland could make an expensive mono/duo synth with them, or try and make it affordable with cheaper off-the-shelf parts. And the first one wouldn't sound the same, and the second one would probly sound like a Mopho. And either way, Roland would get slammed for it unmercifully, sell a few, and possibly die for their trouble.

And what about something even MORE expensive, like a Jupiter-4 or Juno-60? HOW can that scenario go any better? Is it any wonder that KORG hasn't produced a polyanalog like a simple Polysix either? How about a Jupiter-8? Well, priced a Code-8 lately?

Face it. While your argument has all kinds of merit, it's very partisan - no one slams Yammy all year long for not producing a CS-80 - and I have no doubt whatsoever that my examples would take place. Maybe worse.

Roland might produce something for MusikMesse. If they do, will you run out and place a pre-order?
Old 17th February 2013 | Show parent
  #213
Gear Guru
 
Yoozer's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by synthguy ➑️
And who rants at them all the day long?
Well, that's the curse of making an SH-101, TB-303, TR-808, TR-909, Juno-60, Jupiter-8, I guess. That's like, 6 icons in one go.The rest never managed such a home run.

Quote:
SH-101. Which right now is one of the most unpopular synths
Are we living on the same planet? It hasn't gone to crazy Juno-60 prices yet but it's on a steady rise.
Old 17th February 2013 | Show parent
  #214
Lives for gear
 
robot gigante's Avatar
 
2 Reviews written
🎧 15 years
I wouldn't say that the move to digital was the problem so much as releasing gear that was/is... shall we say... unappealing... to people who love their older designs.

I can't say I hate all their digital gear. I even love the humble TR-707.

MC-505 on the other hand, not so much.

Actually I did rant a little about the starved plate tube section in the King Korg. Have dissed the Radias more than once, which I can't stand the sound of, ugh. And don't get me started about the sound of Electribes, dear lord. The Triton is the worst too, I hate those things. That said I still like Korg. I hate my Motif too, a necessary evil I guess, mostly use it as a controller and for quick and dirty stuff.
Old 17th February 2013
  #215
Lives for gear
 
synthguy's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Eh, I dunno. I think anyone who hates anything which makes musical sounds are weirdoes. Like, I'm tired of Yamaha cranking out Motifs, and Kurzweil PC3s and pianos, but I still like those keyboards. And I know that there are people who will buy anything analog, but for the most part I see a lot of those non-Junos sitting on ebay, and not always because they have stupid prices on them.

I guess we'll see what happens at MusikMesse. Even Nord is supposed to be dropping a shoe there.
Old 17th February 2013
  #216
Gear Addict
 
🎧 5 years
If only Roland would design small retro drum machines (606,707,808,909) based around their original design/circuitry with some modern day tweakability for say Β£299 per unit...

I reckon they may sell one or two.
Old 17th February 2013 | Show parent
  #217
Gear Addict
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by .Russ. ➑️
If only Roland would design small retro drum machines (606,707,808,909) based around their original design/circuitry with some modern day tweakability for say Β£299 per unit...

I reckon they may sell one or two.
Agreed.
Old 18th February 2013 | Show parent
  #218
MusicFan
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by Diametro ➑️
Don't worry about it ... Any thread generically about Roland is always a train wreck ...

I've had the opportunity to play the Big O on a couple of occasions and it definitely left a favorable impression ...

However nothing -- and I honestly mean it -- nothing has convinced me to get rid of my fully expanded Fan-X7 ... It still looks and plays like the day I got it ... sRX And the four cards I installed give me an incredible wealth of sound creation possibilities ...

So many synths have come and gone Including a Jupiter 8 and Jupiter 6, But the Fantom stays ... To me it's just an incredibly versatile synthesizer and performance machine ...

The oasys is actually very similar IMO ... But if something ever happened to my Fantom I would definitely consider one ...


I mean, I really appreciate your fondness for your fully expanded Fantom-X7. It's certainly a great tool if you've learned how to master it.

But the OASYS plays in a completely different league. So just a few OASYS facts:

Offers the originally monophonic MS-20, in a physical modeling based version (with a very accurate mathematical real-time modeling of all the orignal MS-20 hardware components), but with 48 voices of polyphony, with many additional features (like AMS modulation for all original MS-20 controls, plus four additional EGs, four additional LFOs, and four AMS mixers, plus access to all standard EXi Program features, including dual key tracking generators, the Common LFO and Common Step Sequencer, Vector, KARMA, EQ and effects) and it is much better sounding than the MS-20 soft Plugin and iPad versions, and it comes really incredibly close to the original analog MS-20 sound.

Ultra-low-aliasing PCM oscillators - the best realtime bandlimiting interpolation available, bar none. Uncompressed PCM wave data!

Fast, smooth modulation - all envelopes, LFOs, step sequencers, Wave Sequences, and Mod Mixers are updated every 2/3 of a millisecond, and then filtered at the sample rate. They're also locked to the sample clock, so they won't slow down or glitch, regardless of how many notes you play. LFOs, vector EG, step sequencers, and Wave Sequences all can sync to tempo. Envelopes can be reset from any modulation source, and have adjustable curvature per segment, for emulation of various classic envelope shapes. Mod Mixers build on the concept of Kurzweil FUNs, allowing processing of one or two modulation sources, from simple adding to scaling to lag processing, curvature control, and quantization.

Low-aliasing
Virtual Analog oscillators (AL-1); with Drive and ring mod disabled, they have no audible aliasing throughout the entire 88-note range, even with sync enabled - without need for "wrapping" as on some other synths. MultiFilter. Lots of modulation, with 5 EGs, 4 LFOs, and a step sequencer per voice, plus an additional LFO, step sequencer, and Vector EG.

MOD-7 offers many features, but can also replicate all Yamaha's DX synths (original DX programs can directly be loaded) and perfectly replicates the SY77 and SY99's RCM synthesis (AFM with AWM2 samples as modulator or carrier) and much more.

All with dynamic voice allocation:
HD-1: β€”β€”β€” 172 voices
AL-1: β€”β€”β€” 96
CX-3: β€”β€”β€” 172
STR-1: β€”β€”β€” 48
MOD-7: β€”β€”β€” 52
MS-20EX: β€”β€”β€” 48
PolysixEX: β€”β€”β€”172

Sorry, I will stop mow. But I could continue to list more unique features without end and I didn't even mention the physical modeling synth engine STR-1 or the very accurately modeled Polysix...

PS: [Fantom X specs: Maximum Polyphony: 128 voices (shared with the sampling section)
Multitimbral Parts: 16 Parts
Standard Wave Memory: 128 M bytes (16-bit linear equivalent)
Standard Waveforms: 1,480]

Old 18th February 2013
  #219
Lives for gear
 
synthguy's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
You OASYS owners are sure a proud lot.

But I will have to say that the beast is a beast. I've only been able to encounter a Kronos - only! - but I'll have to say that only it and the new Jupiters really impress me. Till the King KORG and Prophet 12 hit the market, but that's another story.

But having spent some quality time with the Kronos, I'm sorely impressed with the synth engines on it. MOD-7 takes the DX7/SY99 and turns it into a patchable modular synth. MS-20EX is a little polite compared to the original but who cares! The Polysix isn't as much an "afterthought" synth as I thought it would be, it's quite useful and accurate sounding. AL-1 is a delicious virtual synth with some modular patchability too, and does things it shouldn't be able to. And I simply can't believe what the programmers can do with the STR-1 modeling synth. Running a sample through it takes it into V-Synth territory. The pianos with their pseudo-modeling features are delightfully accurate, and even a few classical pianists will admit that the grand pianos are "pretty good." And the HD-1 engine is loaded with goodies, the best sampling rompler on the market. The organ model is a bit weak, but only because of how it's programmed. Tweaked a bit, it sounds as good as anything not running through a Ventilator or actual Leslie.

I like the Fantoms too. Roland has some of the best samples available in a keyboard, which is why I put the SN acoustic sound of the Jupiters just a cut above those of even the OASYS and Kronos. The weak point in the Fantom is that the filters have a squelchy shade to them, making them sound kind of like a digital ARP, so getting a Moog patch out of them is like pulling teeth. But stop trying to make it into what it isn't, let it be itself, use those almost Kurzweil-like algorithms and it comes alive. The presets are really pretty cool, and I've actually heard them as is on shows and movies. And it has some of the best sound libraries this side of a Gigasampler. It's still not a slouch, and I happily use it when it's available for tracks. I'd rather use a Jupiter or Integra by far, but those guys are still pretty rare where I live, so I'll probably have to buy one when I has some monies.
Old 18th April 2013 | Show parent
  #220
MusicFan
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by synthguy ➑️
You OASYS owners are sure a proud lot.
I didn't mean to show off or vilify other musicians synth choice.
But as distinguished member "Diametro" has stated, that the OASYS was in his opinion very similar to the Fantom-X, I couldn't help posting the enormous technical differences, so that readers have an objective base to form their own opinion...

πŸ“ Reply

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