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Propellerheads Rack Extensions
Old 23rd March 2012
  #1
Propellerheads Rack Extensions

heard about it from this video: MESSE12: New Prototypes From U-He, New Hardware and Software from U-He (Video) -Sonicstate.com

they talk about the Uhbik rack extensions they're working on near the end

more info: Newspages

I'm no longer a Reason user, but this looks like huge step up

I wonder what the prices/deal will be (eg. if you'd have to buy Uhbik again for Reason if you already own the plug-ins or if you'd get them as a free upgrade)

there's also this thread (sort of) about it btw https://gearspace.com/board/new-prod...es-figure.html
Old 23rd March 2012
  #2
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🎧 10 years
Quite a bit of info and chatter about it here:
https://gearspace.com/board/electron...ting-news.html
But yeah, I say this is a good thing. It really isn't just another plugin format. This is advancing plugins as we know them by quite some way.
As for U-he. Initial talk suggests the plugs will be quite inexpensive. But crossgrade paths have not been discussed by anyone to my knowledge.
It's early days for this yet for this stuff, but it's looking good so far
Old 23rd March 2012
  #3
Ohx
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🎧 10 years
Figure will be the best!

Old 23rd March 2012
  #4
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Optical Lens's Avatar
 
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It will be like an app store for plugins, so all companies interested have to completely port their plugins over to this sandboxed format. You won't be able to just load a DLL I think. So that means goodbye to the dream of having a rack extension to VST adapter! They would never let that pass
Old 23rd March 2012
  #5
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🎧 10 years
NIFTY!!!

I love this idea I have stopped at Reason 5, and moved onto Ableton and Rewire, but this is really exciting. Glad to see they've got a great company like U-He to start this off
Old 23rd March 2012
  #6
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you'll get to pay for plug ins twice. i'd be surprised if there's any kind of cross grade type deal with developers who get on board with the propellerheads app store. they're already giving up 30% to propellerheads.
Old 24th March 2012 | Show parent
  #7
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by boon ➑️
you'll get to pay for plug ins twice. i'd be surprised if there's any kind of cross grade type deal with developers who get on board with the propellerheads app store. they're already giving up 30% to propellerheads.
This has been discussed quite a bit on the Props forums. It's unclear how this will work at the moment. But I imagined bespoke devices for the Reason rack rather than straight ports of existing plug-ins. But it looks like this will be happening also so I'm not sure how the companies will deal with the pricing could be a bit messy! In any case as a Reason user I'm stoked about RE's
Old 24th March 2012
  #8
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🎧 15 years
Propellerhead are just a bunch of control freaks when the decided to create yet another plugin standard of their own. Like said before it's not clear if users can get any cross platform options so they may end up with some plugins they paid for but can't use them anymore with alternative software.
Be smart and avoid these kind of vendor-lockin traps and use open standards.
Old 24th March 2012 | Show parent
  #9
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by fuse ➑️
Propellerhead are just a bunch of control freaks when the decided to create yet another plugin standard of their own. Like said before it's not clear if users can get any cross platform options so they may end up with some plugins they paid for but can't use them anymore with alternative software.
Be smart and avoid these kind of vendor-lockin traps and use open standards.
If they were control freaks, they would still be keeping 3rd party developers away altogether.
I think I also read, or saw in one of the vids, that potentially this plugin tech could be opened up to other companies in future. It wouldn't be the first time the Props licensed out their tech. So ultimately, Re's might not be only for Reason. Remember, it's new. Widespread support isn't going to happen right from the get go.

Anyway, why shouldn't they move the plugin game onwards? After all, it hasn't really changed all that much since we first saw them. Until now.
Whats not to like about plugs that are fully patchable with each other? This is what Reason users are already used to doing, so it makes sense that 3rd party plugs should be capable of the same. A VST or AU wouldn't have worked so well.

I also don't think the Props are that interested in appealing to users of other DAW systems. They already got a pretty sizeable user base. And all the Props are doing is granting those users more flexibility.
So Reason users are generally happy it seems. Users of other DAW's with a clutch of 3rd party plugins, not so much. But the latter don't appear to be of much concern to the Props anyway.
Old 24th March 2012
  #10
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I wish they would make the 303, 808, and 909 in ReBirth a rack extension.
Old 24th March 2012 | Show parent
  #11
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogue Ai ➑️
I wish they would make the 303, 808, and 909 in ReBirth a rack extension.
Im sure it will happen. The drum stuff you can largely cover with Redrum and good samples though (not the crap stock ones..)
Still, I expect the whole x0x thing is going to be pounced on by a lot of Re developers. So we'll probably see 303's and 808's etc from more than one dev!?
We already know that Peff is onboard for Rack Extensions. He made his name hacking Rebirth back in the day, and is a known fan of the 303. So i'd be surprised if he doesn't contribute in some way towards this.
Old 24th March 2012
  #12
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🎧 10 years
Silent Way Rack Extension... now that'd be something
Old 24th March 2012 | Show parent
  #13
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Night_Suit ➑️
Silent Way Rack Extension... now that'd be something
thats the first thing i though of. F*** MIDI out, i want Silent Way!

i'd be happy if it only did 3 things.

simple CV to Audio converter
OSC calibration thingy
delay compensation for external effects
Old 24th March 2012 | Show parent
  #14
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by AJ Reynolds ➑️
thats the first thing i though of. F*** MIDI out, i want Silent Way!

i'd be happy if it only did 3 things.

simple CV to Audio converter
OSC calibration thingy
delay compensation for external effects
Perhaps even software envs. and lfos... in any case, I like Reason for how "friendly" it feels (the opposite of the learning curve in trackers, which is my primary music making method), if it could be just that teensy bit friendlier to external gear, I'd probably be all over it.
Old 24th March 2012
  #15
Ohx
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🎧 10 years
Come on Apple, I'm tired of refreshing the app store window every 3.6 minutes!!
Old 25th March 2012 | Show parent
  #16
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Night_Suit ➑️
Perhaps even software envs. and lfos... in any case, I like Reason for how "friendly" it feels (the opposite of the learning curve in trackers, which is my primary music making method), if it could be just that teensy bit friendlier to external gear, I'd probably be all over it.
Reason has got those anyway so it's not so important.

i'm pretty much the same. i love the program but because you can't do much with external gear and i don't really like it's compressors, i end up doing most of my work in Logic. i don't even like Logic but use it because it's a plugin host and always had Silent Way on my mind.
Old 25th March 2012 | Show parent
  #17
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by AJ Reynolds ➑️
Reason has got those anyway so it's not so important.

i'm pretty much the same. i love the program but because you can't do much with external gear and i don't really like it's compressors, i end up doing most of my work in Logic. i don't even like Logic but use it because it's a plugin host and always had Silent Way on my mind.
Logic makes me feel like my eyes are failing me...I'm 27 years old... :D
Old 25th March 2012
  #18
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🎧 10 years
I suppose worst-to-worst, one could sync an MPC or similar groovebox/sampler to Reason, to drive external gear.

And I could always use it as a sound module within/alongside Renoise for tracker-y skittishness.

ReWire - Renoise User Manual

Of course, this whole "sandboxing" tendency, while promising interesting new devices and stability makes me slightly paranoid that ReWire will be phased out...
Old 25th March 2012
  #19
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🎧 10 years
i don't know if Rewire will be phased out but less people will use it. the less i have to use it the better but it's always good to have that option.
Old 25th March 2012
  #20
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🎧 10 years
I like the rewire feature. I don't use reason anymore however. I will be adding it back to my collection soon, unless they completely open it up to VSTi's I'd like rewire to stay around.

Sent from my LG-P925 using Gearslutz App
Old 25th March 2012 | Show parent
  #21
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by projektk ➑️
I like the rewire feature. I don't use reason anymore however. I will be adding it back to my collection soon, unless they completely open it up to VSTi's I'd like rewire to stay around.

Sent from my LG-P925 using Gearslutz App
Pure paranoia on my part, let me assure you.
Old 25th March 2012 | Show parent
  #22
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🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Llitsor ➑️
I also don't think the Props are that interested in appealing to users of other DAW systems. They already got a pretty sizeable user base. And all the Props are doing is granting those users more flexibility.
So Reason users are generally happy it seems. Users of other DAW's with a clutch of 3rd party plugins, not so much. But the latter don't appear to be of much concern to the Props anyway.
That's the whole point. Propellerheads are struggeling to keep up with the feature frenzy that is going on with sequencers atm. How many of their users have been whining for 3rd party plugins? How long did them take it to implement that you could separate the arrangement window from the rack window? Besides with huge resolutions and if not multiple screens you're still stuck with this tiny rack layout. And until Rekord you even couldn't use samples in a simple way.
You may like the special way Reason works but when it comes to putting down some tunes Live is something quite different. And how much market share did the lose against Live? If they want to be unique and be one of the few DAW that doesn't support AU/VST/RTAS/AAX. Or you could use Rewire to another DAW and get the best of both worlds and pay for two proggys.
Old 25th March 2012
  #23
Ohx
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by fuse ➑️
That's the whole point. Propellerheads are struggeling to keep up with the feature frenzy that is going on with sequencers atm. How many of their users have been whining for 3rd party plugins? How long did them take it to implement that you could separate the arrangement window from the rack window? Besides with huge resolutions and if not multiple screens you're still stuck with this tiny rack layout. And until Rekord you even couldn't use samples in a simple way.
You may like the special way Reason works but when it comes to putting down some tunes Live is something quite different. And how much market share did the lose against Live? If they want to be unique and be one of the few DAW that doesn't support AU/VST/RTAS/AAX. Or you could use Rewire to another DAW and get the best of both worlds and pay for two proggys.
Hey guess what friend, if you don't want to use Reason, or if you do but you don't want to buy REs...

Here it comes, get ready...

You don't have to!!!

Wow!!

So, uh, why complain if you don't use it? If something else is clearly better than maybe it's a good idea to use that!

But, since you're the same guy that said folks like Flood/Butch Vig/many others "don't know how to mix properly" I'm not so sure your sanity is completely intact, so this really shouldn't seem all that silly afterall.
Old 25th March 2012
  #24
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🎧 10 years
i think Reason has improved massively over the last 2 years. hopefully this time next year i'll have all the rack extensions i'll ever need, and i won't have to use Logic or any other DAW ever again!
Old 25th March 2012
  #25
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Figure seems neat, hope you can port the files back to Reason somehow though, that'd make it the ultimate scratchpad. Rack Extensions is a brilliant scheme, but I'm not sold yet. Re-buying plugins in a PH store seems scammy unless they are VERY reasonably priced (6.5 update is free, so I'm not against paying for cool plugs).

Also, still no mention of MIDI OUT - Reason came out twelve years ago and I still can't sequence my hardware synths with it. This very simply lack of utility stops me from ever considering even trying jumping ship, which probably wouldn't happen anyway with Cubase's superior audio editing capabilities.

Seriously though. MIDI OUT PH.... I'll laugh if a plugin developer makes an extension to do it before you do.
Old 26th March 2012 | Show parent
  #26
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🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by fuse ➑️
Propellerhead are just a bunch of control freaks when the decided to create yet another plugin standard of their own. Like said before it's not clear if users can get any cross platform options so they may end up with some plugins they paid for but can't use them anymore with alternative software.
Be smart and avoid these kind of vendor-lockin traps and use open standards.
Yes they are control freaks !!!!

They dont let the other develop the plugin, but take the code and adapt it to fit into the Reason software. That's not the worst thing, but some plugin evaluation procedure would have been enough, like Logic does.
Old 26th March 2012 | Show parent
  #27
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🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by AJ Reynolds ➑️
i think Reason has improved massively over the last 2 years. hopefully this time next year i'll have all the rack extensions i'll ever need, and i won't have to use Logic or any other DAW ever again!
LOL! Come on, use that arachaic software, if you dont hear the difference.

Propellerheads was not able to make a single vintage emulation. So now we get rack extensions.
If Reason was so succesful, why on earth they could not hire more developers to do it themself?
Old 26th March 2012 | Show parent
  #28
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by HomeProducer ➑️
LOL! Come on, use that arachaic software, if you dont hear the difference.

Propellerheads was not able to make a single vintage emulation. So now we get rack extensions.
If Reason was so succesful, why on earth they could not hire more developers to do it themself?
LOL i know your said some shit about Reason but that is the funniest.

wasn't Rebirth the first vintage emulation?
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