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A new JP-8000 emulation in the neighborhood
Old 25th June 2011
  #1
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kilon's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
A new JP-8000 emulation in the neighborhood

Did a search seems none has started a thread about this.

I introduce you to JP8K , a 25 euros synts that claims that is a close emulation to Jp-8000 with emphasis on supersaw sounds. I have not tried it cause I am on mac and there is not a mac version. This vst has been made with using synthmaker so assume there is not going to be a mac version soon , but it sound very nice indeed and so cheap its very hard to resist.



JP6K Β» Adam Szabo | Official Website
Old 25th June 2011
  #2
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Wait... now we're emulating VA's?

The purists will say it doesn't get the aliasing right.
Old 25th June 2011 | Show parent
  #3
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Schwarzwald's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
We digitized your digital so you can digital while you digital.
Old 25th June 2011 | Show parent
  #4
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Cyforce's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
The JP6K is really a sweet plugin, sounds good, fair price, easy to use!

Btw here a review about the JP6K - Review: Adam Szabo JP6K – pro|tone
Old 25th June 2011 | Show parent
  #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NWSooner ➑️
Wait... now we're emulating VA's?

The purists will say it doesn't get the aliasing right.
now ? You should come out of your cave little bit more often, you missed some decades.
Old 25th June 2011 | Show parent
  #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kilon ➑️
now ? You should come out of your cave little bit more often, you missed some decades.
I'm one of the analog purists twiddling knobs by the light of only glowing tubes. What did I miss? I definitely missed when we started emulating VA's though. Emulating analog synths? Sure. Semi-ported digital plugins (Korg, etc.), sure. But EMULATED VA plugins? Next we're going to have emulations of the earliest plugins because the out-of-memory errors caused a certain warm sound that modern plugins don't replicate.
Old 25th June 2011 | Show parent
  #7
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Wasn't the Superwave P8 some sort of JP-8000 emulation as well?
Obviously not as close as this one, though. But OTOH this is only a part of the JP-8000 glory.
Why not go one step further and emulate the whole instruments, plus getting rid of the original's limitations, like no filter for sync sounds?

Cheers,
Bert
Old 25th June 2011 | Show parent
  #8
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by NWSooner ➑️
I'm one of the analog purists twiddling knobs by the light of only glowing tubes. What did I miss? I definitely missed when we started emulating VA's though. Emulating analog synths? Sure. Semi-ported digital plugins (Korg, etc.), sure. But EMULATED VA plugins? Next we're going to have emulations of the earliest plugins because the out-of-memory errors caused a certain warm sound that modern plugins don't replicate.

Should I assume you dont use software much ? heh

Well you may want to sit down for this but here we go.

The list of VA and digital emulation are far lengthier than the list of analogue emulation. A synth that has been emulated to kingdom come much more than the most popular analogue out there and is considered probably the ultimate VA is Virus itself , just mentioning a few here like Vanguard, Sylenth , Predator , Z3ta + etc. , then we got companies that like to port their VAs to VST/AUs like Largo for Blofeld . Even JP8000 has been emulate from an old free vst plugin called Superwave P8 (and its not the only one KVR: buzzroom Lallapallooza lite - Virtual Instrument ).

And of course preset wise you will find many of the classic VAs sound included in most VST/AU vas, like zebra, massive , alchemy etc.

Of course then we got DX7 engine which has been done to death with VST/AUs and even wavetable synth have not escaped the claws of emulation with some very good software synths (see rapture).

You will find tons of reaktors ensemble emulating digital synths as well, I have found several in CSound.

Digital synths like analogue have their character and attitude and since there many more of them compared to the analogues and of course enjoy alot more popularity than analogues it makes sense to have many more emulations.

Though in most cases software developers like to selectively copy from hardware synthesizers, it becomes clear in every single VST I have used where its influenced from.
Old 25th June 2011 | Show parent
  #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kilon ➑️
Should I assume you dont use software much ? heh

Well you may want to sit down for this but here we go.
Actually I use tons of software. You list a bunch of software VA's but are they really all Virus and Blofeld emulations? Seems to me like most of those are VA's in their own right; they may have similar features and sometimes even similar presets but not necessarily something like a "Virus emulation" or a "Blofeld emulation". They seem more like "another flavor of analog emulation" to me.

I suppose some of them might be. But when I look at my software instruments (Digidesign Structure/Strike/Hybrid/Velvet, FxPansion BFD, Guru, Geist, DCAM, NI Komplete, Korg Analog Legacy, Korg Digital Legacy, Arturia V-Collection, SSD 3, Way Out Ware TimewARP 2600, Rob Papen RG, NI Maschine, Spectrasonics Trilian + Omnisphere, GForce Oddity, etc.) I don't see any VA emulations. But perhaps I just avoid the plugins that actually ARE VA emulations, I dunno. Why would you emulate a VA instead of getting the real thing? I can see it for analog since they're often super expensive, but for a VA?

Oh well. To each their own.
Old 25th June 2011 | Show parent
  #10
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Kindred's Avatar
 
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That's a nice looking GUI! Does the actual GUI look like that in use?
Old 25th June 2011 | Show parent
  #11
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kilon's Avatar
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NWSooner ➑️
Actually I use tons of software. You list a bunch of software VA's but are they really all Virus and Blofeld emulations? Seems to me like most of those are VA's in their own right; they may have similar features and sometimes even similar presets but not necessarily something like a "Virus emulation" or a "Blofeld emulation". They seem more like "another flavor of analog emulation" to me.

I suppose some of them might be. But when I look at my software instruments (Digidesign Structure/Strike/Hybrid/Velvet, FxPansion BFD, Guru, Geist, DCAM, NI Komplete, Korg Analog Legacy, Korg Digital Legacy, Arturia V-Collection, SSD 3, Way Out Ware TimewARP 2600, Rob Papen RG, NI Maschine, Spectrasonics Trilian + Omnisphere, GForce Oddity, etc.) I don't see any VA emulations. But perhaps I just avoid the plugins that actually ARE VA emulations, I dunno. Why would you emulate a VA instead of getting the real thing? I can see it for analog since they're often super expensive, but for a VA?

Oh well. To each their own.
Some of them are strict emulations and some of them are partial emulations.

Why bother emulating an analogue ? The same reason really, because VST cost rarely exceeds 300 euros. Also software can offer additional features that they are not found in the real thing, like multipoint envelopes , much better effects etc etc.

So its not rare for a software to exceed the quality of what it emulates since it operates in a less strict environment and available processing power is alot bigger.

Another thing I like about software is that you may not care about the real thing, for example I dont care about minimoog or voyager, sound wise they dont impress me as most analogues, and for the sounds I like to make they are not suitable, but the moog filter is sweet and its certainly something I could use , my Camel Audio Alchemy has a rather nice emulation of it and for me that is a bonus without the limitations of the "real thing".

I call that a sweet deal .
Old 25th June 2011 | Show parent
  #12
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by kilon ➑️
Why bother emulating an analogue ?
No, I understand why software (and hardware) try to emulate analog hardware. My question was why bother emulating a VA? They're already digital representations of something else, why would you emulate something that is already an emulation of something else? And some of them are really pretty decent as long as you consider them a synth of their own instead of expecting them to be a Minimoog Model D for $200. For that matter even a Virus TI doesn't sound, to me, like an analog synth. It sounds like its own thing. Maybe that's what you meant when you said there were emulations of the Virus, but even the original doesn't sound analog. A $400 Dave Smith Mopho sounds WAY more analog than my Virus TI or any of the software I have, and it has DCOs.
Old 25th June 2011 | Show parent
  #13
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Quote:
My question was why bother emulating a VA?
Economic purpose.

And space-saving as well. You don't need another 90cm wide place to hold another synth because you need that JP-8000 supersaw sound when you can have it in tens of MB on your hard-drive.

Needless, to say, emulating digital with digital also leads to conclusion it may sound very close to original and afterall if there is a way to buy something cheaper, that rocks modern world pretty much.

And just for the record, I am hardware and live player.
Old 25th June 2011 | Show parent
  #14
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🎧 10 years
Thats a really shiney GUI, I want it just for that
Old 25th June 2011 | Show parent
  #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wladymeer ➑️
Economic purpose.

And space-saving as well. You don't need another 90cm wide place to hold another synth because you need that JP-8000 supersaw sound when you can have it in tens of MB on your hard-drive.
Ok. I guess I will give you the space-saving thing, especially if you want some specific VA (like the JP-8000, home of the supersaw). I don't buy the economic argument though, plugins are cheap and old hardware VAs are cheaper (and harder to crack for the kiddies...). If you otherwise would buy a JP-8000 and you can get it in plugin form without taking up any space in the room.... I'll buy that for a dollar.

I retract my argument, an emulation of an emulation makes sense in that case.
Old 25th June 2011 | Show parent
  #16
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kilon's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by NWSooner ➑️
No, I understand why software (and hardware) try to emulate analog hardware. My question was why bother emulating a VA? They're already digital representations of something else, why would you emulate something that is already an emulation of something else? And some of them are really pretty decent as long as you consider them a synth of their own instead of expecting them to be a Minimoog Model D for $200. For that matter even a Virus TI doesn't sound, to me, like an analog synth. It sounds like its own thing. Maybe that's what you meant when you said there were emulations of the Virus, but even the original doesn't sound analog. A $400 Dave Smith Mopho sounds WAY more analog than my Virus TI or any of the software I have, and it has DCOs.
They are representations of what ? V.A , virtual analogue, which analogue from what manufacturer ?

You see where I am going with this ?

You really think that VA try to sound like real analogues. You know alot of manufactures of VAs that claim that their synth is an emulation of a specific analogue ? I can only count 1 or 2 . I dont think they care or their users.

VA as a term has nothing, absolutely nothing to do with emulating specific analogue models.

Usually when a hardware manufacturer names its product VA means that the product exhibits common characteristics with analogue synth. For example it has an oscilator, it has the waves that usually an analogue has, it has filter , its has a subtractive architecture that most if not all analogue have etc

If you asking me if a digital synth can sound the same as an specific analogue synth, out of the box. No it cannot , but then an analogue synth cannot sound as a specific digital synth out of the box. If you ask me that whether a digital synth can with ease display sound characteristics that can be found in analogue synths, absolutely. The undeniable proof is that in a mix you will be extremely lucky to pin point that analogue from a digital. There have been countless tests on forums that prove this beyond any reasonable doubt.

The problem is that emulation is not easy to do. Emulating something and its million variations is a problem. We dont have a big problem emulating acoustic instruments via digital means (physical modeling) , even though those accoustic instrument produce very rich textures alot richer than your average analogue synth , they are limited in their variation as there are specified tools on them that customise their sound. Analogue synth have textures that are much easier to emulate but they are synth and as such, they can have a million times billion diffirent variations in sound. The same applies to Not easy at all to do.

But that does not meant that there are people out there that would love to have a soft synth that emulates a jp8000 and dont care any less for analogue emulation. So I dont see why you have hard time understanding that .

I would certainly prefer a very good virus emulation to a very good moog emulation.
Old 25th June 2011 | Show parent
  #17
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by kilon ➑️
You really think that VA try to sound like real analogues. You know alot of manufactures of VAs that claim that their synth is an emulation of a specific analogue ?
Yes. Lots and lots. Arturia, Korg, Way Out Ware, GForce, and many many more. They use UIs that look very similar to the original synth, and that's not an accident. Some of them sound quite good too. I'm not anti-VA. Like I mentioned before, I have numerous VA plugins, a Virus TI, and eventually a Solaris. So I don't have a problem with virtual analog, per se.

Quote:
If you asking me if a digital synth can sound the same as an specific analogue synth, out of the box. No it cannot , but then an analogue synth cannot sound as a specific digital synth out of the box. If you ask me that whether a digital synth can with ease display sound characteristics that can be found in analogue synths, absolutely. The undeniable proof is that in a mix you will be extremely lucky to pin point that analogue from a digital. There have been countless tests on forums that prove this beyond any reasonable doubt.
I don't have a problem with digital. I love digital, both software and hardware. But for what it can do that is original and sounds great, not for trying to be an analog hardware synth. IMO analog hardware, digital hardware, and software all have their place.

Quote:
I would certainly prefer a very good virus emulation to a very good moog emulation.
Why is that the choice? Why not actual analog hardware with no emulation?

But my bad, I didn't mean to divert the thread, carry on. heh Just because I'm not interested in a virtual JP-8000 doesn't mean other people aren't interested.
Old 26th June 2011 | Show parent
  #18
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🎧 5 years
So what are we going to call it? Software VA? Virtual Virtual Analogue? Super Digital. lol
Old 26th June 2011 | Show parent
  #19
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Hardware emulations are getting out of hand. I can see it for something like the Jupiter 8, which is on average on eBay is about $6K USD and 3 decades old, but I can find a JP-80** for $800 USD or less and the synth is less than 2 decades old.
Old 26th June 2011 | Show parent
  #20
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if he could emulate the rest of the jp8000 perfectly and get rid of its click with fast attack id buy it straightaway
Old 26th June 2011 | Show parent
  #21
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CoolColJ's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Ahhh this is bad, software becoming "classics"

Why not just make it an original synth and loose the emulation hypre...?
Old 26th June 2011 | Show parent
  #22
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by rasseru ➑️
if he could emulate the rest of the jp8000 perfectly and get rid of its click with fast attack id buy it straightaway
The SH-101 has the same click in its envelope, It's Rolands Style. I honestly never understood why everyone including Manuel Schleis called this a bug. Clearly they know not much of synth history. All you have to do is raise the attack slightly off its bottom or in otherwords, program it.

The JP-8000 was my first synth, it currently resides under my bed hiding from my all analog setup. I've contemplated selling her many times, but I assure you nothing can replace the 8000 and I just can't let go. She is Legendary. BT used to use a stack of SIX of these sex machines, I remember reading the Interview.

Roland has a Roster of machines that have each individually defined an era of music and countless genre's. The JP-8000 is on that roster.
Old 26th June 2011 | Show parent
  #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NWSooner ➑️
Why would you emulate a VA instead of getting the real thing? I can see it for analog since they're often super expensive, but for a VA?
Weird.. I'm a hardware guy.. so it seems to make much more sense to have a emulation of a V/A rather than an analog synth.. . because you'll actually be more accurate.. seems obvious.
Old 26th June 2011 | Show parent
  #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NWSooner ➑️
I don't buy the economic argument though, plugins are cheap and old hardware VAs are cheaper (and harder to crack for the kiddies...). If you otherwise would buy a JP-8000 and you can get it in plugin form without taking up any space in the room....
Cool... so you have a JP-8000 you'll sell me for less than 25 euros?

I'll pay shipping!!
Old 26th June 2011 | Show parent
  #25
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kilon's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by djugel ➑️
Weird.. I'm a hardware guy.. so it seems to make much more sense to have a emulation of a V/A rather than an analog synth.. . because you'll actually be more accurate.. seems obvious.
the only way it would be easier to create an emulation of a VA , compared to an analogue , is that you have some sort of access to the source code of the VA. But that wont happen in a million years unless you are the company that owns the thing.

Other than that emulating a VA is not any less difficult to emulating an analogue.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NWSooner ➑️
Yes. Lots and lots. Arturia, Korg, Way Out Ware, GForce, and many many more. They use UIs that look very similar to the original synth, and that's not an accident. Some of them sound quite good too.
some examples please, you are too generic. Which of those VA manufactures claims that their VA synthesizer is an emulation of an analogue one ? Oh and by the way you cant "manufacture" software so that means I am talking about hardware VAs . The last time I checked GFORCE made no hardware VA.
Old 26th June 2011 | Show parent
  #26
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I like how they didn't bother with anything else but supersaw... will fit right in along side my D-550.

edit: what country is this from? Ordering stoned is very daunting..... oh, there's a translator function..
Old 26th June 2011 | Show parent
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kreeper_6 ➑️
Roland has a Roster of machines that have each individually defined an era of music and countless genre's.


Truer words were never spoken. Quite an accomplishment.


Regards,
Frank
Old 26th June 2011 | Show parent
  #28
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CoolColJ's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
2011+ The Era of the JP80 - super natural Marmiba
Old 26th June 2011 | Show parent
  #29
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🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by CoolColJ ➑️
2011+ The Era of the JP80 - super natural Marmiba
Why shouldn't the JP80 become a classic over the years? Just because of stupid Roland marketing? I'm sure it's a very capable synth with more than marimba trills up its sleeve.
Most if not all Roland instruments we now consider as "groundbreaking" were marketed with completely different target audiences and uses in mind, and they were taken out of their context and were abused rather than used in their new genres. It's never the instruments that create anything, it's always musicians.
The same can be said about non-Roland stuff as well, like the saxophone, the clavinet and the legendary Alesis 3630 compressor heh ...

Cheers,
Bert
Old 26th June 2011 | Show parent
  #30
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🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Feinstrom ➑️
But OTOH this is only a part of the JP-8000 glory . . .
like no filter for sync sounds?

Cheers,
Bert
I think you're thinking of something else . . .
πŸ“ Reply

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