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Now that Reason 11 will be a VST synth, who is thinking about finally grabbing it?
Old 30th August 2019
  #1
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🎧 15 years
Now that Reason 11 will be a VST synth, who is thinking about finally grabbing it?

I will raise my hand here. I have always really liked the sound of Reason’s synths, and I really like the simplicity of the environment. What sucked was editing audio and MIDI in it.

So now we can (theoretically) have it all - Reason inside of Ableton. This is pretty amazing, IMO. I love Ableton’s drum racks but to have the option of using Kong instead is pretty great. I also think Reason’s synths sound great as well. The other thing they really get is their sequencer racks. They have all the little functions that I like in hardware sequencers - clean GUI, simple randomization options, P-lock style automation for example.

The other thing is that of course you can fire it up standalone as a DAW. I am wondering if Reason’s bet is that some producers will get hooked on making tunes in their DAW and use it completely for some tracks and maybe move to it full time?

Very interesting times. Dare I say this excites me more than any recent hardware release? Before the flames come - the cost of Reason Suite is $600. That’s a lot sequencing and synth power for that cost. No diss against hardware at all, this just seems like a huge value to me.
Old 30th August 2019
  #2
Gear Guru
 
fiddlestickz's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
so just the rack is a vst plug in, that's cool for other DAW users I guess...what's wrong with editing audio in Reason..? I've always used it and it's fine..?

Old 30th August 2019 | Show parent
  #3
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🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by fiddlestickz ➡️
so just the rack is a vst plug in, that's cool for other DAW users I guess...what's wrong with editing audio in Reason..? I've always used it and it's fine..?

Good to hear. I am going by what others say. They seem to hate the piano roll sequencer in it as well, but I have not dove into it. I will start by making a track in Reason to really learn what synths I like and how I like it’s workflow.

Do you mix in Reason as well? That analogue console emulation is a very cool concept.
Old 30th August 2019
  #4
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fiddlestickz's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
I do everything in Reason it's a lot deeper than people realise, it's simplicity and logical layout are just beautiful to my mind, and the new workflow enhancements make it as powerful as any other DAW imo.
Old 30th August 2019
  #5
Gear Nut
 
🎧 10 years
I'll definitely be upgrading to v11, if only to get specific Reason instruments in Logic (although AU won't come until end of this year).
Old 30th August 2019
  #6
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syntonica's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
Aw, crap... (...checks bank account...)
Old 30th August 2019 | Show parent
  #7
Deleted 8ace8bf
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fiddlestickz ➡️
so just the rack is a vst plug in, that's cool for other DAW users I guess...what's wrong with editing audio in Reason..? I've always used it and it's fine..?

I think this is aimed at bringing in new users. A cracking deal for all reason offers in a vst.

For me (existing user) Ima gonna sit this one out
Old 30th August 2019
  #8
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
What's interesting is that the feedback I read so far (GS and other forums) has been nothing but positive -- except for the (unofficial) Reason forum where the majority voted to be "not excited" about this upcoming release (maybe b/c they were hoping for more work on the standalone version ?)

I for one find the VST Rack feature very exciting and am looking forward to using my (vast) collection of Reason synths+FX in other DAWs.
It's also worth mentioning that besides the VST Rack feature, R11 will finally support clip crossfading, curved automation and mutable sequencer notes (all long-awaited features).
So yes, I'll definitely upgrade to R11 (been using Reason since R8).

What's also quite neat about this is that it will finally be possible to run specific synths (or processing chains) at higher sample rates, e.g. via the DDMF Metaplugin (up to 4x oversamping).
I.e. this can be used to increase the CV update rate from (44100/64) = ~689Hz to e.g. (176400/64) = ~2756 Hz, which makes quite a difference in terms of snappy envelope modulation.
Old 30th August 2019
  #9
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Data_Shrine's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
This is cool, but as a dedicated Rewire user, I am left with doubts and questions, as it will be abandoned in Reason 11. They will also stop supporting it at all, so you can expect Rewire to disappear gradually from every DAW.

My fears about the Rack VST :

- Will it have Remote implementation ? If not, I will lose all of my MIDI mapping, and be stuck with something like Ableton macros (8 knobs per instrument.. great). I have up to around a 100 dedicated knobs/faders/buttons controls linked per instruments/fx with Remote. This enables Reason instruments to be used, well, like instruments, and it helps a lot to be creative with the software. If Remote is gone, I most likely won't update Reason, and will move on.

- Will Redrum, and other sequencers, have Patterns enabled ? Granted, this could be solved with simple automation, but it's annoying to use that way.

- And will the sequencers have access to ReGroove, or the DAW Groove settings while in Pattern mode ? Is that even possible ? Unless i'm making 4/4 techno, it's difficult to make great beats without groove & shuffle settings.

Anyway, it's a cool release for everyone else but me I guess
Old 30th August 2019
  #10
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Mr. Varaldo's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
I've been using Reason since it came out, and usually upgrade every couple of releases - so I'm definitely upgrading to this version. I've always liked the sound of Reason, and these days it's very modern sounding (like Ableton)
Old 30th August 2019
  #11
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skoolafish's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
been a reason user since 2. I fell in love with sound of it...I fell out of love with the restrictive 3 screen workflow, jumping to and fro to do ****. I’ve been using studio one for the past few months and have barely opened reason...all that said, this update is perfect for me. I hate rewire-ing. Using scream4 and dr rex directly in studio one? I really can’t wait
Old 30th August 2019
  #12
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Arthur Stone's Avatar
 
92 Reviews written
🎧 10 years
Been using Reason since early 00's; upgrade every couple of versions; on 9 now. Definitely up for 11 (as soon as I get time); looking forward to using Reason in Harrison Mixbus.
Well done Propellerheads
Old 31st August 2019
  #13
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gentleclockdivid's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Rack vst has one midi input channel
Old 31st August 2019 | Show parent
  #14
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Varaldo ➡️
I've been using Reason since it came out, and usually upgrade every couple of releases - so I'm definitely upgrading to this version. I've always liked the sound of Reason, and these days it's very modern sounding (like Ableton)
Thats awesome. I watch your channel when I can for all the hardware goodness, but I didnt know you used Reason too. Very cool. I’m learning how to route now (got the 30 day demo and trialed out a lot of the packs that Suite will come with) with Kong. Got my Linn drum samples loaded into it and now I want to learn tricks with routing each pad to its own mixer and doing some parallel processing.

The Drum Sequencer is rather awesome. I love how easy it is to get a beat going that has some variety to it. Don’t have a sequencer that works this way exactly in Ableton so its a nice change. Still need to learn how to modulate velocities with an LFO and stuff like that though. With Ableton its super easy for me to map those things, but I’m not there yet with Reason.
Old 31st August 2019
  #15
Gear Guru
 
fiddlestickz's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
it's actually a little expensive for existing users to upgrade, I say that because I'm not really one who uses other DAW's even though I have Ableton 10 suite I still default to using what I know and love the most. having said that there are some killer workflow audio enhancements & that modulating rack extension looks cool as fk, but still a little heavy handed in the price upgrade imo, such is the world nowadays tho everything seems expensive when you are tight budgeted.
Old 31st August 2019 | Show parent
  #16
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by fiddlestickz ➡️
it's actually a little expensive for existing users to upgrade, I say that because I'm not really one who uses other DAW's even though I have Ableton 10 suite I still default to using what I know and love the most. having said that there are some killer workflow audio enhancements & that modulating rack extension looks cool as fk, but still a little heavy handed in the price upgrade imo, such is the world nowadays tho everything seems expensive when you are tight budgeted.
YEah for real. I got lucky since I never owned reason and I can get the Suite version for $599. For what it comes with, it's loaded.

Plus this free 30 day demo is seriously cool. I grabbed a lot of the Suite plugins to see if I liked them, and yeah, they are awesome. The other thing is that the presets on the synths are incredible. The sound design detail is crazy, especially on the layered stuff. I could see myself making a lot of tunes with just the Reason synths quite honestly.
Old 31st August 2019
  #17
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WozNYC's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
I used Reason heavily from version 1 through 5. (I even used to do clinics for Sam Ash stores and taught it at DubSpot.)
Being able to pull up the synths and REX players in Logic Pro should be AWESOME.
And remember, you can upgrade to version 11 from *any* full version going all the way back to version 1 for $129.

Old 31st August 2019
  #18
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deondamage's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Methlab ➡️
What sucked was editing audio and MIDI in it.
It used to back in the day, but not for the past couple of years. Many producers give Reason crap, because they think of it as the Reason from back in the early 2000`s. Reason is a beast now! I`m happy about the fade curves that comes with Reason 11. This was something I`ve requested, so good to finally have this feature.
Old 31st August 2019 | Show parent
  #19
Gear Nut
 
Cotton Mather's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by fiddlestickz ➡️
it's actually a little expensive for existing users to upgrade, I say that because I'm not really one who uses other DAW's even though I have Ableton 10 suite I still default to using what I know and love the most. having said that there are some killer workflow audio enhancements & that modulating rack extension looks cool as fk, but still a little heavy handed in the price upgrade imo, such is the world nowadays tho everything seems expensive when you are tight budgeted.
i dunno. propellerheads seem almost perversely to reward folks for skipping an upgrade or ten. compare the prop's upgrade cost from reason 1 to 11 to ableton's upgrade cost from live suite 9 to to live suite 10.
Old 31st August 2019
  #20
Gear Guru
 
fiddlestickz's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
One of the key feature requests I've been asking for is to able to send MIDI clock to multiple MIDI outs at the same time, I don't think that has been sorted yet, I'm not 100% sure but would love it if it was.. I still can't make a work around apart from using a thru box externally. In Ableton preferences you can simply select as many or as little MIDI outs for clock to your MIDI interface as you want, in Reason you can only select one MIDI port as your MIDI clock out, this sucks if you have an 8 in 8 out MIDI interface where only one port can be the out and you want to sync multiple devices to the DAW clock.

* edit actually I have a work around I used the MX1 as the receiver of the one MIDI port DAW clock, this clock then gets sent to TR8S via USB, MIDI out of MX1 goes to MIDI thru box and those MIDI outs go to various other synths/sequencers. I'd much rather everything had it's own dedicated MIDI port direct from the MIDI interface but until Reason fixes this I have to continue with this clunky workaround.
Old 31st August 2019 | Show parent
  #21
Gear Guru
 
maisonvague's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Varaldo ➡️
I've been using Reason since it came out...
Same here.

I'm not surprised you like it, too. For those who grew up with hardware, Reason is a blast because you know how it all works. Everything makes sense--because you've done it all before.

For software users, Reason can be a stepping stone to hardware. But for hardware users it's like a break from it--a reprieve--a relief. I love it.

I will definitely be upgrading to version 11.
Old 31st August 2019
  #22
Gear Guru
 
fiddlestickz's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
oh shoot it is only $129 upgrade, I thought I kept seeing it was $249 last week.. $129 is ok then.. that will translate to around $180 aus so not bad actually.
Old 31st August 2019 | Show parent
  #23
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Arthur Stone's Avatar
 
92 Reviews written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cotton Mather ➡️
i dunno. propellerheads seem almost perversely to reward folks for skipping an upgrade or ten. compare the prop's upgrade cost from reason 1 to 11 to ableton's upgrade cost from live suite 9 to to live suite 10.
I think the customer pays for novelty with new releases - new unique tools. I've invested a fair chunk of cash into Propellerheads and I don't mind waiting until I can afford the product.
Old 31st August 2019 | Show parent
  #24
Gear Nut
 
Cotton Mather's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by fiddlestickz ➡️
oh shoot it is only $129 upgrade, I thought I kept seeing it was $249 last week.. $129 is ok then.. that will translate to around $180 aus so not bad actually.
There is a $249 upgrade path from Reason standard to something they're calling "Reason Suite" which comes with a bunch of additional rack extensions. I already have most of them, so I won't being going that route.
Old 31st August 2019
  #25
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
I was a Reason user back in the day between 2.5 and version 3. I bought Reason Rekord when that came out and upgrade to 6 when that came out as well, but frankly I couldn't get into Reason then. the small UI, the way too rudimentary piano roll. All the things I loved when I was using Reason so many years ago became a liability after having used other DAWs and coming back. The rack was great but creating complex bussing or routing a multi-out drum to a mixer (something you can do super easily in DAWs like Ableton, Logic, Studio One) are super tedious to do in Reason. I upgrade to version 9 because I have so many old Reason projects that I still go back to every now and then, but I've actually opened a handful of times at most.

One thing I really like about Reason is it's great instruments and great library of presets and sounds. I still have combinator patches that I've never found an equivalent of even now. Reason was always so inspiring because of the sounds. So this news definitely means I'm going to upgrade to 11. To be able to use those greats sounds inside of my DAW without having to deal with rewire will be amazing.
Old 31st August 2019
  #26
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Mr. Varaldo's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Methlab ➡️
Thats awesome. I watch your channel when I can for all the hardware goodness, but I didnt know you used Reason too. Very cool. I’m learning how to route now (got the 30 day demo and trialed out a lot of the packs that Suite will come with) with Kong. Got my Linn drum samples loaded into it and now I want to learn tricks with routing each pad to its own mixer and doing some parallel processing.

The Drum Sequencer is rather awesome. I love how easy it is to get a beat going that has some variety to it. Don’t have a sequencer that works this way exactly in Ableton so its a nice change. Still need to learn how to modulate velocities with an LFO and stuff like that though. With Ableton its super easy for me to map those things, but I’m not there yet with Reason.
Thank you very much and fully agree, actually this makes me think I need to use Reason more - I used to use it a lot more a few years ago (I remember certain Indian female vocal samples that were so nice in one of the releases) and these days it really sounds like basically a finished record when you render the final wav... I don't know, it's got that polished, modern sound, these days.


Quote:
Originally Posted by deondamage ➡️
It used to back in the day, but not for the past couple of years. Many producers give Reason crap, because they think of it as the Reason from back in the early 2000`s. Reason is a beast now! I`m happy about the fade curves that comes with Reason 11. This was something I`ve requested, so good to finally have this feature.
Same for FL Studio FKA Fruity Loops - in fact, this also reminds me that I want to get FL Studio, it sounds awesome these days too. AND if I'm not mistaken, it's got perennial free upgrade - once you buy it once, you never have to pay for upgrades anymore. Rare in the industry...


Quote:
Originally Posted by maisonvague ➡️
Same here.

I'm not surprised you like it, too. For those who grew up with hardware, Reason is a blast because you know how it all works. Everything makes sense--because you've done it all before.

For software users, Reason can be a stepping stone to hardware. But for hardware users it's like a break from it--a reprieve--a relief. I love it.

I will definitely be upgrading to version 11.
Ah, yes, exactly, MaisonVague! I remember when first using it, it was a blast continuously switching from front to back of the rack and see the cables "wiggle" I remember patching a "self-made" "vocoder" by using the filter and equalizer back at version 2 or 3... it was (and still is) great.
Old 31st August 2019 | Show parent
  #27
Lives for gear
 
Mr. Varaldo's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Methlab ➡️
Thats awesome. I watch your channel when I can for all the hardware goodness, but I didnt know you used Reason too. Very cool. I’m learning how to route now (got the 30 day demo and trialed out a lot of the packs that Suite will come with) with Kong. Got my Linn drum samples loaded into it and now I want to learn tricks with routing each pad to its own mixer and doing some parallel processing.
Apologies for spamming , but actually I went to look the ones I created with Reason, and I had completely forgotten about this 'Arabian Phoenix' piece, all done in Reason 8

I think this DAW sounds great!

Old 31st August 2019
  #28
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jm2c's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Ahh so finally I get malmström and that blue reverb fx module as VSTs? Always loved those two, something unique about them that I find difficult to imitate using my other stuff. Will be upgrading for sure.

I hope the CPU cost will be around the same as before.. reason has always been very smooth and CPU efficient in that regard.
Old 31st August 2019 | Show parent
  #29
Lives for gear
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Varaldo ➡️
Apologies for spamming , but actually I went to look the ones I created with Reason, and I had completely forgotten about this 'Arabian Phoenix' piece, all done in Reason 8

I think this DAW sounds great!

Yeah it does..sounds warm and thick, which is awesome.
Old 31st August 2019
  #30
Gear Addict
 
Exe2479's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Why? What does that mean..?

A DAW has no "sound". Maybe you like this or that plugin, or this synth, compressor, or that reverb, or presets that go in a certain direction, but as far as a DAW is concerned such statements are rather mystical.

Anyway. The update is good for those who have abandoned Reason in the recent years in favor of another DAW with more advanced or modern capabilities (long list from vst plugins earlier to video support to more powerful sequencer functions). They may now use their Reason devices if they wanted to use them in their other DAW.

For users who used Reason excusively this update isn't good. In fact is smells as if Prop... Reason Studios forfeits in the battle with DAWs, and users are best advised if the start looking for a new contemporary other DAW altogether. And then... why even bother with reason devices, as all other DAWs also have nice stock plugins and stuff.
It's as if the developer said: "Yeah, we know that our DAW isn't all too great, and please, just use something else instead. And if you still really must use Reason, please, just load the devices as a vst plugin in your new DAW."

What was cool about reason is, that is was a lot, all in one piece of reliable software. That path seems to crumble.
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