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eSPi 1200 by Low Hiss
Old 3rd March 2019
  #151
mp3
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🎧 10 years
Shoulda kept in in the hip hop forum
Old 3rd March 2019 | Show parent
  #152
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drockfresh's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Low Hiss ➡️
The foundation for the sequencer is already done, I'd say maybe a couple more weeks of work at most and I'll have a complete re-creation of the sequencer and its settings (not counting song mode).

I can honestly say I think once the analog stage is there the sound will be nailed by any honest people's standards, the digital implementation is truly a 1:1 rendition (midi-dumping a pitched sound in the SP is virtually identical to my emulation), and the analog circuitry will be very close.


I do agree that the focus should be on getting all the original features done, and aside from the effects I messed with that's what I'm focusing on.

Trust me the build quality and durability of the components is very important to me and my partner, we're not cutting corners. However as I'm sure you understand, it's always a balancing act. If it was just me I'd have motorized faders, VU meters and all types of fancy things that would be cool but just don't make sense.
Just make sure it has

VU meters and a tube compressor per channel

Old 3rd March 2019 | Show parent
  #153
Gear Guru
 
Bignatius's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coorec ➡️
Does it really need to be semi-modular (aka eurorack levels, eurorack voltages, etc.) for this?
Its going to have 8 individual outputs and a midi out. Thats all you need to bring it into your eurorack.
On second thought, I think you're right.
Old 4th March 2019
  #154
Here for the gear
 
🎧 5 years
Great project man. It sounds great already! Much respect!

Now I was wondering if you plan to add an effects section. The effects on the sp404 and sp303 defined pretty much the sound of the whole lofi hip hop scene today. All those stutter, wobble and distortion effects.

I don't know if Isla implemented something like that. But I'm sure many beat beatmakers would prefer the one with the effects.
Old 4th March 2019
  #155
Gear Maniac
Low_hiss has implemented some effects.
You can find some sound snippets on his instagram page.
Old 4th March 2019
  #156
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Personally - I'd be happy with a bare bones kit (PCB and a few parts)
I'm happy to make my own chassis etc.

Stay true to the goals and don't get destructed by all the requests for features XYZ.

A camel is a horse designed by a committee .... you don't want a camel.
Old 4th March 2019
  #157
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xanax's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
I think an official name for the product would probably help distinguish the 2 projects. People not paying close attention seem really confused.
Old 4th March 2019 | Show parent
  #158
Quote:
Originally Posted by xanax ➡️
I think an official name for the product would probably help distinguish the 2 projects. People not paying close attention seem really confused.
Good point, for now we have an internal project name but I don't want to call it that now if it's gonna change later and cause even more confusion.
Will try to announce a definite name asap.
Old 4th March 2019
  #159
Gear Nut
 
Thomaz's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Normally I'm very sceptic about all these crowdfunded/kickstarter/homemade/small business projects ( also had some bad experiences in the past ), but this here looks very promising and so far I absolutely love the way how Low Hiss handles the way of communicating and how he provides us with useful and zero-BS information.
Very transparent so far, he definitely knows what he's talking about and it seems he also pays attention to the "important little things" ( Cherry MX, thank you!!!! ).

The sound examples definitely sound dope!

Old 4th March 2019
  #160
Lives for gear
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
I'm also liking what I'm seeing, but also remember the micro rhythm kickstarter thread on here so am cautious.

I hope it can end up more along the lines of the Yocto, which isn't "cheap" but can result in a high-quality, highly-authentic final product.
Old 4th March 2019
  #161
I can definitely understand the concerns about crowdfunding, but we're won't launch our campaign until we have a fully finalized protoype ready, you're funding the production of units not the R&D.
You'll have all the details and demos of the device to make an informed purchase prior to it launching.

Thanks for the kind words guys, much appreciated.
Old 4th March 2019 | Show parent
  #162
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Yoozer's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Low Hiss ➡️
things
I'm sure you've considered all of the things below already, but I'd go with this over GS members wishes/desires

Product Development - How to get started?

Also, much like farts and burps being the first things sampled, any demo of timestretching needs the Amen break!

Here's rooting for you that this is going to be a success!
Old 4th March 2019 | Show parent
  #163
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yoozer ➡️
I'm sure you've considered all of the things below already, but I'd go with this over GS members wishes/desires

Product Development - How to get started?

Here's rooting for you that this is going to be a success!
Thanks for the link, community feedback is always good though even if there's a lot to filter through. Of course I'm not going to implement everything that's suggested, but I did receive a few good ideas so far.

Quote:
Also, much like farts and burps being the first things sampled, any demo of timestretching needs the Amen break!
Haha you're right, can't forget the DnB heads, will post an audio example.
Old 4th March 2019
  #164
Gear Guru
 
Bignatius's Avatar
I'd pledge money right now if the Kickstarter was active and included a PCB and crucial parts option. It wouldn't even need any more features...

I might choose an already assembled option, depending on price, but a DIY option would rock.

Very impressed so far. Will be watching closely.
Old 4th March 2019 | Show parent
  #165
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drockfresh's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
One thing I do vote for is a bigger screen. More than a two line LCD. You can never make the screen bigger but you might think of more stuff to display on it. I think it’s better the screen be “too big” than “tok small”
Old 4th March 2019 | Show parent
  #166
Quote:
Originally Posted by drockfresh ➡️
One thing I do vote for is a bigger screen. More than a two line LCD. You can never make the screen bigger but you might think of more stuff to display on it. I think it’s better the screen be “too big” than “tok small”
Yeah we're already using a 20x4 display instead of the 16x2 in the SP, it allows to display some additional things and features (like octave shifting in the tuning screen), while still staying true to the SP's spirit and workflow.
The additional height gives you twice the amount of pitch and volume steps in the tune & mixer screens for example.
Demo here:
Low Hiss on Instagram: “Switched to a 20x4 display, that'll allow more info to be displayed at a time and more vertical steps in the mixer and tune screens. As you…”
Old 4th March 2019 | Show parent
  #167
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Rob Ocelot's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by snd_unit ➡️
Much more interested in this project than the other. This one is made with love and passion, in the open. The other project seems made for the money only. That's my feeling.
Worse, my gut feeling is they are making noise now in a purile attempt to throw a wet blanket on Low Hiss' project. A total dick move (with not even a product to show) to make it more confusing for consumers. They need to put their money where their mouth is and show us a working proto or get off the pot.

Anyway, enough about that. I don't want to give them any more oxygen.

edit: I wrote the above before I saw that hour long circle jerk interview with (surprise!) no demonstration of the hardware but it sure looks purdy, don't it?

Oi vey...

Last edited by Rob Ocelot; 4th March 2019 at 06:16 PM..
Old 4th March 2019 | Show parent
  #168
Gear Guru
 
Bignatius's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Ocelot ➡️
Worse, my gut feeling is they are making noise now in a purile attempt to throw a wet blanket on Low Hiss' project. A total dick move (with not even a product to show) to make it more confusing for consumers. They need to put their money where their mouth is and show us a working proto or get off the pot.

Anyway, enough about that. I don't want to give them any more oxygen.
2min in that other thread had me nearly running back here for the superior attitude and project that's farther along. The differences are immediately recognizable and large.
Old 4th March 2019
  #169
Gear Guru
 
Bignatius's Avatar
I do think, after looking at the photos of both prototypes, that I'd much prefer if this one used Faders rather than Knobs and if it had bigger Pad like buttons. That's why I'm hoping for a DIY kit, to customize those aspects of the Interface myself.

Keep up the good work.
Old 4th March 2019 | Show parent
  #170
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bignatius ➡️
I do think, after looking at the photos of both prototypes, that I'd much prefer if this one used Faders rather than Knobs and if it had bigger Pad like buttons. That's why I'm hoping for a DIY kit, to customize those aspects of the Interface myself.

Keep up the good work.
The final design does use faders, the pots are just temporary for development (faders are a drop-in replacement).
However the pads will remain Cherry MX switches, much more durable than mpc type pads and a lot closer to the original feeling of the pads which is important to me and most SP-1200 users
Old 4th March 2019
  #171
Gear Guru
 
Bignatius's Avatar
Sounds great. Thanks for the updates and info.
Old 4th March 2019 | Show parent
  #172
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Low Hiss ➡️
The problem with the arduino is even the mega doesn't have enough pins for what we're doing, so we have to use an smd microcontroller. I could however release arduino code that does the same thing if you wanted to replace it with a couple arduinos.

The CPU used for all the audio and UI stuff is the Raspberry Pi (well PocketBeagle actually, in the final design), the microcontroller just handles the buttons and faders/pots and communicates their state to the pi/beagle.
Pocket beagle is not a PI. Why not use the PRU's for frontpanel tasks, tons of computing powers in them. You can always multiplex the analog and digital IO pins.

Quote:
The final design does use faders, the pots are just temporary for development (faders are a drop-in replacement).
However the pads will remain Cherry MX switches, much more durable than mpc type pads and a lot closer to the original feeling of the pads which is important to me and most SP-1200 users
Why not make room for both? People could buy a strip of MPC silicones if they like, takes one muxed analog IO for scan.
Good you choosed the Pocket beagle, much better then the PI stuff.
Old 4th March 2019
  #173
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
You could probably drive the frontpanel from Linux with no problems, really, buttons/LEDs directly on GPIO and e.g. an I2C ADC for the faders.

But THB if you have a good working design and you're happy with the BOM costs, don't change anything now. I don't think a microcontroller for the UI is necessarily a bad choice. I'd definitely focus on the more important parts of the software, and just keep in mind that you might be able to simplify the front panel a little in a later revision.

I like the use of Cherry MXs, really. I built a prototype of a groovebox sampler a few years ago and was set on using them as well. The prototype was MECs, which is nice because they're smaller, but the MXs have easily available alternate keycaps means there's a nice way for people to customize the look of their machine.
Old 4th March 2019
  #174
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Im hoping for a run of DIY PCBs with SMD premounted lol.
Old 4th March 2019 | Show parent
  #175
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TornadoTed's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bungle ➡️
Im hoping for a run of DIY PCBs with SMD premounted lol.
That's a good idea. I am perfectly comfortable with through hole but SMD scares me!
Old 4th March 2019 | Show parent
  #176
Quote:
Originally Posted by niklasni1 ➡️
You could probably drive the frontpanel from Linux with no problems, really, buttons/LEDs directly on GPIO and e.g. an I2C ADC for the faders.

But THB if you have a good working design and you're happy with the BOM costs, don't change anything now. I don't think a microcontroller for the UI is necessarily a bad choice. I'd definitely focus on the more important parts of the software, and just keep in mind that you might be able to simplify the front panel a little in a later revision.

I like the use of Cherry MXs, really. I built a prototype of a groovebox sampler a few years ago and was set on using them as well. The prototype was MECs, which is nice because they're smaller, but the MXs have easily available alternate keycaps means there's a nice way for people to customize the look of their machine.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Klonfocius ➡️
Pocket beagle is not a PI. Why not use the PRU's for frontpanel tasks, tons of computing powers in them. You can always multiplex the analog and digital IO pins.



Why not make room for both? People could buy a strip of MPC silicones if they like, takes one muxed analog IO for scan.
Good you choosed the Pocket beagle, much better then the PI stuff.
Thanks a lot to you both for the feedback.
We're reserving the PRU's for some real time DSP stuff, we're based on Bela. With the way our architecture is made we think it's better to offload the hardware UI handling to an actual microcontroller.

People who would be likely to mod their unit with an mpc pad sensor strip would probably be able to modify the pcb design and print their own I guess. Can't cater to every usecase possible, cherry mx switches really do seem like the best option out of the box to me.

Our PCB is one solid piece that includes all the UI, I/O, SSI filters, microcontroller, DAC, everything. My friend honestly did a stellar job with the design in my opinion. We're in the final stages so there probably won't be any drastic changes.

The keycaps thing is definitely one of the factors that helped make that decision haha, who doesn't love to customize their gear? Some nice wooden caps must feel really nice
Old 4th March 2019 | Show parent
  #177
Lives for gear
 
5 Reviews written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Low Hiss ➡️
The final design does use faders, the pots are just temporary for development (faders are a drop-in replacement).
However the pads will remain Cherry MX switches, much more durable than mpc type pads and a lot closer to the original feeling of the pads which is important to me and most SP-1200 users
No project bashing here but I've listened to the 1 hour long interview of the other guy this morning and seeing this post about you following the original design of the Machine definitely makes me go on your side. His point was that his project was going to be '' a good sounding machine''.
Its nice to be inspired by a certain person/prohect/concept but I dont need a new remake of an already legendary machine ( We saw what happened with the following MPC after the 3000 ( Sorry for the 2KXL guys, I sold mine, thats not what I'm after )
I'm after a SP1200 clone....because theres too many '' good sounding machine'' already and I already own quite a few.

I'm following your project from now on.
Old 5th March 2019
  #178
Gear Guru
 
Bignatius's Avatar
I've come around to my senses regarding the switches - bring on the Cherry.
Old 5th March 2019 | Show parent
  #179
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
@ Low Hiss there was a lengthy thread on the FB SP-1200 user group with stuff people would add to an "improved" SP. Of course I can't seem to find the posting now! But here a few things that were mentioned there that absolutely need to be changed when you get to the sequencer (and then some more things that I've been thinking about!).

-remove the 120 bpm tempo limitation (keep the weird jazz swing if you want, but just make sure we can either a) raise the tempo above 240 bpm, OR implement the double-time swing with regular tempos).

-remove the inability to edit samples once you've copied and pasted into other slots. Currently, if you copy a sample from pad A to B, the two become linked and you can't edit the one on pad B separately (you can still route them to separate channels and also change the pitch separately). From what I recall you also can't edit the pad B sample even if you delete pad A. So ideally--when copying and pasting you would have the ability to keep them "linked" or make them separate, but with the ability to always be able to edit the original sample even if linked.

-similarly, realtime sample editing while patterns are playing would also be amazing

-allow on the fly recording on/off so that you don't have to stop sequencer.

-allow proper naming of patterns so they can be grouped together for easy song construction, e.g., Beat #1 , Beat #2 ). Currently it's just numeric

-allow true copy and past and truncate of patterns (right now you can only paste patterns together; you can't delete/truncate after the initial length has been set).

-allow individual channel parts in a pattern to be copy/pasted to other patterns

-higher resolution for sample editing (maybe have a quick switch option for "rough-original" mode, and a new high-res mode?)

-include some sort of "free voice" polyphony so that one voice can use another free channel instead of cutting off the current sample? The 1200 has a version of this, but only for channel pairs (and the cutting off limitation is very much part of the sound, so don't get rid of it entirely). would be useful in conjunction with feature below:

-would there be a way to make a true polyphonic/pitched MIDI mode where you can play all samples chromatically from an external sequencer/keyboard? Currently you can only play one and it's fiddly to set up. I imagine you would basically have to assign an individual midi channel to each voice.

-lastly, how are you planning to implement file management? Will all samples be saved with a given pattern, but also be available to load in other patterns? I'm not sure what the best approach is here, but keeping with the simplicity = productivity nature of the SP-12/1200, i would suggest making the file management side clean and streamlined for those who plan to do everything (including external sampling) ITB. I.e., design it from the live sampling perspective, not for those who plan to do a lot of dragging and dropping from a DAW. If memory is not an issue, I envisage a scenario where any new edits made to a sample for a new sample to be saved, so you don't risk messing up other patterns that already use it.

Sorry for the mega-post, but wanted to get this out there while you are still developing. I'm sure a lot can also be added down the line but the things mentioned above are largely annoying issues rather than creative limitations.

Last edited by Sir Ruff; 6th March 2019 at 05:02 AM..
Old 5th March 2019
  #180
Gear Guru
 
Bignatius's Avatar
Quote:
hi-fi mode
Quote:
polyphonic chromatic sequencing
Eh? It's a (The) gritty old drum machine.

How about a built in coffee maker, too?

Geez.

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