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Emu SP-12 and EMXP
Old 5th December 2015
  #1
Here for the gear
 
🎧 5 years
Emu SP-12 and EMXP

I'm curious if anyone here using their SP-12 with EMXP. The download is here:
http://www.emxp.net/

It's really nice! It gives sp12 owners the opportunity to transfer 16 bit wav files from a Windows PC. I have just started using it. As wonderful as it is, I have not been able to load anything to my sp longer than somewhere about 0.6 to 0.7 seconds, which kinda sucks (I have an sp12 turbo)

So I am curious if anyone around here has tried the software and has been able to get wav files at the full 2.5 second capacity into their SP.

Yes, my SP sample memory is clear and empty and ready to accept 2.5 seconds. My SP doesn't seem to want to wait the amount of time that the software is taking to dump the wav file.

Anyhow, it's great for drum hits...butt the SP shakes the booty of all types of sounds.

I'm using my girlfriends laptop (a flimsy little thinkpad with i7 processor) as I own a mac, and an Evolution UC-33 to midi interface (my main interface is firewire only)- perhaps the UC-33 is the culprit?...don't know.
Old 5th December 2015
  #2
Deleted 0ea68bb
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This is a great, much needed feature for SP-12 users. I have only re-loaded samples that I dumped from the SP-12, but not raw .wave files. But curious why you wouldn't just record them first (and them dump them)? Part of the "SP-12/1200 sound" is undoubtedly whatever happens at the ADC input stage. I'm always wary of bypassing the ADC on vintage samplers for that reason.
Old 5th December 2015
  #3
Here for the gear
 
🎧 5 years
For sure that is part of the magic. It is because I lack money basically and don't have the means of sampling loud enough into the SP to be satisfied. Luckily I purchased scored my sp back in '07 for $325, and before running into financial struggles did have the means to get samples into it at sufficient levels. I should be able to get boost pedal soon to use which will take care of the problem. I always sample my sh-101 straight in as it's output is hot enough. I have been really liking bypassing the ADC for it's own flavor too - cleaner and the aliasing is pristine in it's own way. Try transferring a sub heavy kick into it, and pitch it down a couple steps, there's an amazing sweet spot there, sweet spots at all pitches, but that one I have found to be uniquely tasty. The punch soo good, and the ring sings! I love and prefer low bit samples (have a mirage and TX16W), no problems getting good levels into them, as they don't need as hot a signal as the SP wants. These vintage samplers - pure love for them!

So you have been successful at reloading 2.5 memory samples? If so, I'm on it when the lady brings her computer home with her from work.
Old 5th December 2015
  #4
Gear Head
 
🎧 5 years
Before you sample though on the SP you can change the input gain setting then you have the gain knob to adjust that - you can record almost anything very hot doing this.
Old 5th December 2015
  #5
Here for the gear
 
🎧 5 years
mmm, yes. I should have better explained the process that can't get hot enough into the SP, even with it's preamp gain all the way up. Only when sampling off of my computer through my focusrite pro14 is there a problem. The hottest line level out of the interface is via the headphone out, which is not much, and noisy when up all the way. With the SP's gain up at +40db, and knob all the way up, the noise floor coupled with the noise from the interface's headphone jack at max volume = too much noise in most instances (at least to my ear).

I was in Los Angeles a few months ago hanging out with Bruce Forat while he fixed my SP's memory problems it had been having. Brilliant guy. He verified the 00db is actually 20db lower than the signal your putting into the SP. So, 20db is flat, and 40db is really boosting 20db.

Anyhow, I really should have done more with EMXP before coming hear with questions. I will be thoroughly testing and report back. This is really exciting software for us SP-12 users to be able to save our sounds and sequences on current computers. I was bummed that HxC never seemed like it was going to work with a Commodore 1541 diskdrive. So ya, super stoked about EMXP. The creator of this software will get my donation for sure.
Old 5th December 2015 | Show parent
  #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ominik ➑️
For sure that is part of the magic. It is because I lack money basically and don't have the means of sampling loud enough into the SP to be satisfied. Luckily I purchased scored my sp back in '07 for $325, and before running into financial struggles did have the means to get samples into it at sufficient levels. I should be able to get boost pedal soon to use which will take care of the problem. I always sample my sh-101 straight in as it's output is hot enough. I have been really liking bypassing the ADC for it's own flavor too - cleaner and the aliasing is pristine in it's own way. Try transferring a sub heavy kick into it, and pitch it down a couple steps, there's an amazing sweet spot there, sweet spots at all pitches, but that one I have found to be uniquely tasty. The punch soo good, and the ring sings! I love and prefer low bit samples (have a mirage and TX16W), no problems getting good levels into them, as they don't need as hot a signal as the SP wants. These vintage samplers - pure love for them!
Interesting! I will definitely be doing some comparisons to see how raw sounds differ when transferred via audio in or midi in. I can't get enough aliasing, so would be nice to be able to have different flavors (which you really couldn't do before now!).

The longest samples I have loaded in have probably been 1.5 secs or so. But again, this was from stuff already dumped (in whatever format EMXP uses), so I'm not sure that helps if you're using raw .wavs. The only transfer errors I ran into were when I was trying to name samples with overly long names.
Old 6th December 2015
  #7
Here for the gear
 
🎧 5 years
Thanks for the interaction on this Sir Ruff and yes I'll watch the name lengths. Have fun with putting raw wavs in, new flavors yes.

I've wrapped my head around the sounds side of EMXP better, and it's a fast workflow now. I'm not sure what I was doing wrong before but the SP will indeed load 2499ms WAVs from EMXP. Samples that have been directly recorded into the SP are extracted into an SP12 format, which can be converted into a wav file from there, which means we can chuck the wav file into our DAWs, manipulate, and load back into our machines. EMXP can convert a wave files into SP12 formats too (along with various Emu samplers and Akai s1000). This program is a godsend!! The Emu SP-12 is a brand new beast, worlds have opened up!!!

I'm with you Sir Ruff, I can't get enough of aliasing either-> mirage into the SP...super sick aliasing madness...and now I can save the sounds properly!

I've not experimented with saving songs and segments yet, but am on it tomorrow.

now...outa tech mode and back to creation mode. Big ups to the creators of EMXP!
Old 6th December 2015 | Show parent
  #8
Deleted 0ea68bb
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ominik ➑️
I'm with you Sir Ruff, I can't get enough of aliasing either-> mirage into the SP...super sick aliasing madness...and now I can save the sounds properly!
I used to own (and love) the Mirage... but I really could never get on with the interface (beyond getting single samples in) and I could justify selling it to a friend when I found a way to bypass the anti-aliasing filter on my S-612. Now that thing aliases out the rear end... Only downside is no way to save (my disk drive never works). I want to get an S-900 to try this on too (although those early Akai filters are nice to have).

I have no doubt the Mirage into the SP sounds pretty incredible too!

Quote:
I've not experimented with saving songs and segments yet, but am on it tomorrow.
This also worked fine for me...
Old 15th December 2016
  #9
Gear Nut
 
KlangGenerator's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
I just tried out EMXP with my SP12. It is awesome! Saving, loading and organizing samples and sequences is a piece of cake with EMXP. Big Kudos to the developer!!!

Copping an SP1200 makes no more sense to me, considering that it costs more than twice as much as the SP12 and the only advantage now is the sampling time. I personally find 5 seconds for drums absolutely enough. No way I would pay so much more just for 5 additional seconds. And the fact that I can switch my SP12 off without deleting my actual project is also a big plus to me.

Long live the 12!
Old 17th January 2017
  #10
Gear Head
 
B.Minor's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Few days ago I also tried to initiate my first data transfer between a Win7 notebook and the SP-12 using the EMXP application; unfortunately with not much success. The transfer immediately hung after the SP-12 command was entered...

I guess my "cheapo" USB MIDI interface cable from China is the problem, but I'm not 100% sure. Even if being "USB MIDI class compliant" I've heard about the fact that some of these cheap cables cannot really handle large SysEx dumps, especially if packets are larger than 3 bytes. Or there might be buffer problems if the legacy hardware is slower than the device which sends the information etc.

As these SP-12-related sound and sequence dumps are also not following any official MIDI data rate and seem to be E-mu proprietary, I wonder which MIDI interfaces you Guys have been using for that purpose and if it would pay off to buy a "quality" interface cable. Or are there eventually any additional settings necessary in EMXP which have to be applied first in order to avoid such communication problems?
Old 17th January 2017
  #11
Lives for gear
 
viewing's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
the cheap usb/midi adapters are missing the connection that carries sysex. i found a roland um-one on kijiji
Old 17th January 2017 | Show parent
  #12
Gear Nut
 
KlangGenerator's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by B.Minor ➑️
Few days ago I also tried to initiate my first data transfer between a Win7 notebook and the SP-12 using the EMXP application; unfortunately with not much success. The transfer immediately hung after the SP-12 command was entered...

I guess my "cheapo" USB MIDI interface cable from China is the problem, but I'm not 100% sure. Even if being "USB MIDI class compliant" I've heard about the fact that some of these cheap cables cannot really handle large SysEx dumps, especially if packets are larger than 3 bytes. Or there might be buffer problems if the legacy hardware is slower than the device which sends the information etc.

As these SP-12-related sound and sequence dumps are also not following any official MIDI data rate and seem to be E-mu proprietary, I wonder which MIDI interfaces you Guys have been using for that purpose and if it would pay off to buy a "quality" interface cable. Or are there eventually any additional settings necessary in EMXP which have to be applied first in order to avoid such communication problems?
Yep, I also experienced this with my cheap ESI Midi Mate II interface. I tried out all kinds of settings, but I always got an error message (I think it was "1048"). Then I switched to a Motu Micro Lite which is one of the recommended interfaces from the developer of EMXP (see manual for a list of interfaces). I bought the Motu used for 70 Euro, so not that pricey. EMXP works like a charm now with the Motu!
Old 17th January 2017
  #13
Lives for gear
 
1 Review written
🎧 15 years
Twelves are three gees now
Old 17th January 2017 | Show parent
  #14
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by viewing ➑️
the cheap usb/midi adapters are missing the connection that carries sysex. i found a roland um-one on kijiji
There is no 'missing connection that carries sysex'.

Sysex goes through the same connection as all other MIDI.
Old 17th January 2017 | Show parent
  #15
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by earwolf ➑️
Twelves are three gees now
What someone speculatively asks for equipment on eBay is not necessarily what they actually sell for.
Old 17th January 2017 | Show parent
  #16
Lives for gear
 
1 Review written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by SimonInAustralia ➑️
What someone speculatively asks for equipment on eBay is not necessarily what they actually sell for.
What about sold items?
Old 17th January 2017 | Show parent
  #17
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by earwolf ➑️
What about sold items?
Yes, and they seem to have been selling for between $1500 and $2000, not $3000.

Did you actually look at the completed listings for the SP12?
Old 17th January 2017 | Show parent
  #18
Lives for gear
 
viewing's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by SimonInAustralia ➑️
There is no 'missing connection that carries sysex'.

Sysex goes through the same connection as all other MIDI.
i didn't know how to word that. i believe they are missing one of the wires or something on the circuit board to cut costs
Old 17th January 2017 | Show parent
  #19
Lives for gear
 
abruzzi's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by viewing ➑️
i didn't know how to word that. i believe they are missing one of the wires or something on the circuit board to cut costs
No, there is only one data pin on midi, and that carries notes, ccs, SYSEX, everything. Though it is true a lot of cheap midi interfaces don't work with SYSEX. It's most likely the device firmware that doesn't pass certain kinds of messages, including SYSEX.
Old 17th January 2017 | Show parent
  #20
Gear Nut
 
KlangGenerator's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by SimonInAustralia ➑️
Yes, and they seem to have been selling for between $1500 and $2000, not $3000.

Did you actually look at the completed listings for the SP12?
I paid 1250 Euro for my SP12 Turbo 2 months ago. Don't believe the hype!
Old 17th January 2017 | Show parent
  #21
Lives for gear
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by SimonInAustralia ➑️
Yes, and they seem to have been selling for between $1500 and $2000, not $3000.

Did you actually look at the completed listings for the SP12?
Relatively 'cheap' in the UK. One sold in Crystal Palace recently for Β£1100 & I remember one selling for Β£900 in Tottenham last summer. The key is using gumtree and not eBay. Unfortunately for those outside the UK the cheaper gumtree ads are mainly local pick up only
Old 17th January 2017 | Show parent
  #22
Lives for gear
 
1 Review written
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by SimonInAustralia ➑️
Yes, and they seem to have been selling for between $1500 and $2000, not $3000.

Did you actually look at the completed listings for the SP12?
No. I knew you'd do it for me.
Old 18th January 2017 | Show parent
  #23
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by earwolf ➑️
No. I knew you'd do it for me.
Old 18th January 2017 | Show parent
  #24
Gear Head
 
B.Minor's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by KlangGenerator ➑️
Yep, I also experienced this with my cheap ESI Midi Mate II interface. I tried out all kinds of settings, but I always got an error message (I think it was "1048"). Then I switched to a Motu Micro Lite which is one of the recommended interfaces from the developer of EMXP (see manual for a list of interfaces). I bought the Motu used for 70 Euro, so not that pricey. EMXP works like a charm now with the Motu!
Thanks KlangGenerator for your information! I knew someone would confirm...

I will skip through the list of recommended interfaces and look what I can afford. After all I thought an ordinary MIDI interface cable would also do...

To all the other contributors: thank you as well.

It sounds strange, but there really seems to be a kind of crux related to E-mu-specific data dumps based on SysEx. I even investigated together with Steve Makohin, maker of the "SP-12 Librarian" software for the 68k/PPC Mac, what could be the problem, as also his application written in 1993 won't work with certain Mac MIDI interfaces (the ones with 8-pin modem/printer port cables). It seems that in this case "intelligent" MIDI interfaces, like the Opcode Studio 5 LX will *NOT* properly work with such E-Mu related bulk SysEx dumps (this also applies to Sound Designer II used as librarian tool for Emax/Emulator II dumps etc.). Intelligent MIDI interfaces seem to be trying to "interpret and check" the SysEx data against the MIDI spec while being transmitted. However, as E-mu Systems seems to send some non-MIDI compliant strings using non-MIDI data rates, in fact only "dumb" Mac interfaces made for the 68k/PPC Macs are able to handle such large E-mu data dumps. So here we have the opposite situation because "dumb" is better in this case than "intelligent". That's why I hoped an ordinary USB MIDI cable interface would also be sufficient in case of using EMXP instead on the PC. Well, my assumption was wrong as it seems...
Old 20th January 2017
  #25
Gear Head
 
B.Minor's Avatar
 
🎧 5 years
Just an update which might be also interesting for other EMXP users who might have been trying to get the application working with "cheap" USB MIDI interface cables:

To be honest, I should have read the (600 pages long) EMXP reference manual first before complaining.

In the communication settings chapter 10.6.4 it is strongly recommended that the data packet size for any MIDI interfaces which are exclusively working with generic MS drivers like usbaudio.sys should be set to 293 or 298 instead of 256. In my opinion, EMXP's default setting should be 293 anyway, as this might be applicable to the majority of windows users for whom this application was primarily made for.

However, after changing that setting as explained, the data transfers will work in either direction flawlessly; so I can only recommend to try this setting in case of using such "MIDI class compliant" cheap interface cables not relying on any vendor-specific MIDI driver. At least it worked out for me now...
Old 4th June 2018
  #26
Deleted 299b064
Guest
Bumping this thread to know whether someone managed to make this work using EMXP on Mac. Just got the SP-12 Turbo and while the guy who sold it to me showed everything was working on his setup, MIDI transfers seem not to work with my setup no matter the settings.

EMXP on Mac High Sierra using Wine and a cheap Bespeco USB/MIDI interface

BMUSB100 - Bespeco Professional s.r.l.


My MOTU's are in the studio and I habe not tried wth those but I need a quick setup to pre-produce banks when I am home.
Old 4th June 2018
  #27
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 15 years
I tried it with a SP12 Turbo too but it didn't work.
Old 6th June 2018
  #28
Deleted 299b064
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Stuck with a small Acer Aspire One D260. No problems on PC using even the cheapest MIDI interface. Maybe in the future at this point.
Old 21st August 2018
  #29
Gear Head
 
🎧 10 years
Stuck with a small Acer Aspire One D260. No problems on PC using even the cheapest MIDI interface. Maybe in the future at this point.
Old 10th December 2018
  #30
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Hi all
SP12 user here and excited to have just discovered the EMXP software. However, Im running a Mac here in my studio so curious to knowhow OSX users are getting on with EMXP/SP12 with the current version of EMXP that was released earlier this year.

Also, having had a look through the online EMXP manual I can see that it provides the option to save/load individual SP12 samples, sequences, and also the program data (not including the sound data), but does it provide the option to save/load an entire bank of sounds/samples from the SP12 that exist within a program?
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