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Clip on mic pitfalls & tips?
Old 30th September 2002
  #1
Clip on mic pitfalls & tips?

Steve, you have some cool methods that you use can you share some?

For drums

Any other clip ons?

Old 1st October 2002
  #2
Lives for gear
 
Fibes's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Yeah pony up the info!

I had to use a clip on for sax this weekend in the studio. The player was like a mexican jumping bean possessed by the twisted child of Ornette Coleman. He could also eat a pizza in 2 minutes.
Old 1st October 2002
  #3
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 15 years
I recently had to rely upon some clip-on's for a low profile gig.

I am to record a Jazz Trio (GTR, Bass, Drums), in a small coffeehouse, in a section of the room that is about 7'x7'. The band wants the live of the live in the coffeehouse deal, complete with cup, saucer, and expresso machine noise.

Band wanted to go with a stereo pair of either Schoeps or Neumanns, yet wanted to lay down a few more tracks as "insurance". Bass is easy with taking a direct out of the Walter Woods head, GTR is also a breeze with a Senny 409, yet what to do for drums when there is no room for stands? Senny 604 3-pack actually came to the rescue, these will work for alittle substance on the kik, snr, and floor tom (only tom). Since the stereo pair will be close enough that they will catch most of the drums, and the 604s will only be used at mix if needed...

Planning this future recording definatly opened my eyes about clip-ons.

Steve, any recomendations for something alittle more hi-fi than the 604s?
Old 2nd October 2002
  #4
Steve can you reveal your 'next door drum' clip on technique for the guys?

Old 2nd October 2002
  #5
Moderator emeritus
 
🎧 15 years
And someone should mention the joys of body mikes.
Old 2nd October 2002
  #6
Lives for gear
 
Steve Smith's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Shure Beta 98's ( or even the orginal 98's ) rock for toms live. just make sure you tighten the **** out of the Mic Clip part of the mount... ( lesson learned the hard way.. never again rely on the assistant to check this...)
Old 2nd October 2002
  #7
Super Moderator
 
Remoteness's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally posted by JayCrouch
I recently had to rely upon some clip-on's for a low profile gig.

I am to record a Jazz Trio (GTR, Bass, Drums), in a small coffeehouse, in a section of the room that is about 7'x7'. The band wants the live of the live in the coffeehouse deal, complete with cup, saucer, and expresso machine noise.

Band wanted to go with a stereo pair of either Schoeps or Neumanns, yet wanted to lay down a few more tracks as "insurance". Bass is easy with taking a direct out of the Walter Woods head, GTR is also a breeze with a Senny 409, yet what to do for drums when there is no room for stands? Senny 604 3-pack actually came to the rescue, these will work for alittle substance on the kik, snr, and floor tom (only tom). Since the stereo pair will be close enough that they will catch most of the drums, and the 604s will only be used at mix if needed...

Planning this future recording definatly opened my eyes about clip-ons.

Steve, any recomendations for something alittle more hi-fi than the 604s?
Is it about Hi-Fi or is it about the situation of the moment. Who would think you can make a EV635 sound good on drums? We had no choice, so we had thing work for us...

In the early 80's, I did FOH for a good friend's band (he was the drummer, so it had to sound good or I was out of a gig). They were one of the largest bands (sized, that is) playing around back then. With twelve musicians/singers, we always had a hard time finding enough inputs for all of them. We were lucky to find 12 working channels out of 16 channels, in the clubs back then. The concept was, if I had at least 12 inputs, I could pull it off without Y cords or doubling up on vocal mics.

The band had five singers, two guitars, bass, two percussionists, keys and a drummer. Everyone got a mic or DI, even the drummer. One mic for the drummer you say????

Yes, indeed. I found the perfect place for that one mic. He was a righty drummer and it was placed near his right knee on or near the bass drum. Sometimes we used a stand, sometimes we just placed it on some foam on top of the kick. When you placed a MD211 or EV635 omni mic on top of or near the bass drum, you pretty much got the whole kit.

During sound check, we would move it around to maximize the coverage. I was able to get the kick, snare, toms and cymbals this way. Then I would compress the crap out of it. It sounded larger then it looked. When we had more channels to play with, I added an overhead or hi hat mic.

Back then, I was into Sony ECM50's for hi hats. Strange, but it gave me what I was looking for. The Sony lav mic was clipped to it's own cable, that was wrapped around the microphone preamp barrel, the barrel was placed into a regular Shure mic clip and setup over the bell of the top hi hat.

After a while, even if we had extra inputs, I still just went for the easy one or two mic trip. Sometimes, I added a kick mic to the mix.

We had a gas with this, because most of the other sound guys thought we were nuts. They had a field day with us until they heard how huge the band sounded when they performed.
Old 2nd October 2002
  #8
Super Moderator
 
Remoteness's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally posted by Jules
Steve can you reveal your 'next door drum' clip on technique for the guys?

Ahhh, now I know what you meant.... When you said, 'next door drum technique," I was like... huh??? But yes, I hear you my man and here it goes...

I'm one of those weird guys, that does not mind using LP Claws, or clamps or ROWI clamps for drums. I just use them with a little twist.

Let's say, you got a standard five piece set. Kick, snare, two rack toms, one floor -- when I mic the snare with a Claw, I clamp the Claw on rack one's bottom rim and aim it towards the snare. When I mic rack two, I clamp it on rack one's bottom or top rim and aim it at the second rack tom. Yes, you guessed it, I clamp the last Claw to rack two's rim and direct it towards the floor tom. I've also clamped a Claw on the kick drum or Kick drum hardware for that sweet spot near the right handed drummer's right knee.

The theory is, the clamp device is not vibrated by it's own instrument. Yes, I know, if they hit both toms you WILL get a vibration, but not most of the time. Remember, if it really bothers you, go grab a bunch of stands and do it the "right way".

If you hear something you don't like, change it! Right?
Old 2nd October 2002
  #9
Super Moderator
 
Remoteness's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally posted by Dave Martin
And someone should mention the joys of body mikes.
I'm sure many of us have tried placing a lav mic or PZM on the drummers chest for that perspective. At tmes, it can be very cool.

Lately, I just place an additional mic behind the drummer's head (no not that head) for that perspective. It works well in a live situation. I plan to do that very same thing later today, when I record the Strokes at FleetBoston Pavilion in Boston. Since they got 13 channels coming off the stage, I had to add a few extras to fill up the 24 track.

Not too many artist want taped PZM's or clips on them during a live concert performance.... But it has been done in the past. I just don't push for that stuff anymore. How about you?
Old 2nd October 2002
  #10
Super Moderator
 
Remoteness's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally posted by Steve Smith
Shure Beta 98's ( or even the orginal 98's ) rock for toms live. just make sure you tighten the **** out of the Mic Clip part of the mount... ( lesson learned the hard way.. never again rely on the assistant to check this...)
Unless your assistant is an engineer.

The other thing that really get's me is when PEOPLE DO NOT TIGHTEN DOWN MIC STANDS AND/OR MIC CLIPS.

There I said it. Sorry about the shouting, it just freaks me out more then a little bit. It's just insane in everyway.
Old 3rd October 2002
  #11
Gear Addict
 
🎧 15 years
Steve,

I have to try that trick with the 635a when I get a chance. For such a lo-fi mic, it's so damned useful. I've been dying to put mine to more use in drum micing, but I have first try mics that I tend to use that work most of the time. The single mic thing will be a hard sell, though, when no one wants to let me do a mono overhead. grudge

Bear
Old 3rd October 2002
  #12
Super Moderator
 
Remoteness's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Almost any mic in omni will do. Check it out, it sounds great...
Old 4th October 2002
  #13
One with big hooves
 
Jay Kahrs's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally posted by Gone Fission
The single mic thing will be a hard sell, though, when no one wants to let me do a mono overhead. grudge
I've done the single overhead thing in the studio a few times. Most people don't care what I do as long as it sounds good. I guess I'm lucky. Though some people I've had would complain if I only put up one overhead mic.

FWIW, I put an SM57 in the spot that Steve is talking about all the time and aim it at the snare. In the studio I'll use an omni but since I hardly ever carry mics to a live show I use what they have and it's almost always all 57's and 58's.
Old 4th October 2002
  #14
Gear Maniac
 
🎧 15 years
I've been trying those old EV dymanic omni's (535s?) around the bottom of the snare, gets alittle bit of everything - and it's always suprising how smooth it is when you solo that mic and can hear everything pretty well sans the cymballs...

the mic I speak of is the grey EV omni that has the little dot in the center of it's grille, that you also see alot in press conferences and things of the sort...
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