Quantcast
Noise Canceling Headphones - Gearspace.com
The No.1 Website for Pro Audio
Noise Canceling Headphones
Old 5th February 2009
  #1
Gear Nut
 
Sound Chaser's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Talking Noise Canceling Headphones

I have never monitored on anything buy speakers, but I am finding the need to use headphones as I am doing more production mixing (film) and some classical recording with a compact 'fit in your car' setup. (4Trk recorder and 6 mics)

For symphonic recording especially, I find the source material makes it impossible to judge what is being recorded so I am wondering if noise canceling headphones would do the trick. Note, that while I would never mixdown a product on headphones, for capturing I am at least trying to achieve a balance.

Has anyone used these headphones in a similar working situation?
Does the outside sound actually diminish or is it hidden.
If the principle operates on cancellation, then will there be any phase issues when trying to block out sound that is nearly identical to sound you want to keep. ie: it is one thing to block out unwanted sound such as a construction site, but in this case I want to block out the same sound I am trying to record.
Old 5th February 2009
  #2
Gear Guru
 
John Willett's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Smile

Noise reduction headphones work by having microphones in them that listen to the surroundings and then inject it into the audio feed polarity-reversed at the same level.

You get about a 25 - 30dB reduction in bass noise and the closed-back headphones take care of the highs.

I have not actually used these in a recording situation - I use the closed HD 25-1.
Old 5th February 2009 | Show parent
  #3
Lives for gear
 
NorseHorse's Avatar
As you can tell by my avatar, I dig the Extreme Isolation brand headphones. These are noise REDUCTION headphones, not noise CANCELATION.

Also, you could buy a snake, so you aren't in the same room as the ensemble. However, even if I'm not in the same space, bringing speakers can be a hassle.
Old 6th February 2009 | Show parent
  #4
Lives for gear
 
huub's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
I use bose quietcomfort II headphones for mixing in noisy surroundings.. They sound pretty nice really.. Not as flat as my HD600's but good enough to make eq decisions anyway.. Also, I use em for my Ipod, so I know how commercial mixes sound on em..

The nice thing is, I can keep the speakers on, so a client can listen to the speakers while I can make critical decisions on headphones..
Old 6th February 2009 | Show parent
  #5
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
I just use a pair of closed back headphones. It blocks most of the outside noise anyway. People are always tapping my shoulder and saying, are those noise canceling. But when I pull them off my ears to listen to / answer them they're like I guess not.

My dad used to have a pair of aviator headphone like thing, but no internal speakers, just used to kill all outside noise. And they did it pretty effectively. Those with some ear buds might just be an ideal setup. They were pretty useful when trying to get to sleep in a noisy environment.
Old 6th February 2009 | Show parent
  #6
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
I still have to find someone, who has experience with those, looks like the ultimate closed headphone:
Closed Back type Earspeaker : 4070
Since you need a stax amp with it, it might not be very practical for the small setup location work.
Old 6th February 2009 | Show parent
  #7
Lives for gear
 
huub's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by audio ergo sum ➑️
I still have to find someone, who has experience with those, looks like the ultimate closed headphone:
Closed Back type Earspeaker : 4070
Since you need a stax amp with it, it might be not very practical for the small setup location work.
Wooeey, 2000 dollars ex amp... I'm intrigued though!
Old 6th February 2009 | Show parent
  #8
Lives for gear
 
feyshay's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
I'd go for one of these.
Shure Β  - Earphones

I hardly get any external sound whatsoever from these.
And they're easily portable.
The problem is you can't hear anybody and they are so small that people do not know you have them on and think you are ignoring them.
Old 23rd November 2011
  #9
Gear Nut
 
Liberty Studio's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
I know she's an old thread... but what is the word on this? On noise canceling headphones on location environments – like recording for film/video?

It seems like it could be beneficial, but then again, I could see someone saying that the phase inversion process messes with the perception of the audio, or somehow negatively affects the monitoring, or something in that vein.

Any ideas?
Old 23rd November 2011 | Show parent
  #10
Lives for gear
 
sound_music's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Liberty Studio ➑️
... I could see someone saying that the phase inversion process messes with the perception of the audio, or somehow negatively affects the monitoring, or something in that vein.
i'm no expert on headphones, but this would be my apprehension about NCH's as well... seems like a thing you wouldn't want for critical listening.
Old 23rd November 2011
  #11
Gear Maniac
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sound Chaser ➑️
If the principle operates on cancellation, then will there be any phase issues when trying to block out sound that is nearly identical to sound you want to keep. ie: it is one thing to block out unwanted sound such as a construction site, but in this case I want to block out the same sound I am trying to record.
I was recording a wind ensemble a few years ago and the director had a pair that he asked me to try. Miserable failure. I think it was like you said, the phones kept trying to cancel what was trying to come through them. Really strange sound. I don't recall the brand.

Scott
Old 24th November 2011
  #12
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Artefacts predominate imho.
Old 24th November 2011
  #13
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Noise cancelling headphones sound very unnatural to me, whichever the brand is (tried Bose, Phillips, Sony). I can't believe people wear them outside the airplane.
Old 24th November 2011
  #14
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
There seems to be a lot of criticism based on theory but little criticism from those that actually use them.

Until I bought some, I was doing the 'phase cancellation problems' theory, but it just doesn't exist. I've never listened to them and thought anything sounded odd.

If I could use my HD650s all the time I would. But I can't, they're big, bulky, and as isolating as a piece of tissue paper. I have some Bose QuietComfort 15s and I think they're fantastic. Flying to and fro when working in Dubai I used them on the plane a lot and they made flying so much more enjoyable. Same on the tube in London.

But sat in my room now listening in silence, they still sound good.
Old 24th November 2011 | Show parent
  #15
Gear Nut
 
Liberty Studio's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by therealbigd ➑️
There seems to be a lot of criticism based on theory but little criticism from those that actually use them.

Until I bought some, I was doing the 'phase cancellation problems' theory, but it just doesn't exist. I've never listened to them and thought anything sounded odd.

If I could use my HD650s all the time I would. But I can't, they're big, bulky, and as isolating as a piece of tissue paper. I have some Bose QuietComfort 15s and I think they're fantastic. Flying to and fro when working in Dubai I used them on the plane a lot and they made flying so much more enjoyable. Same on the tube in London.

But sat in my room now listening in silence, they still sound good.
Actually, I want to believe that they WOULD work.

It would be great to have a clearer idea of what all sounds are interfering with the dialog recordings when I'm out on sets; trying to discern how much I'm picking up extra sounds on the recording compared to just hearing the sound outside the earcups of my headphones.

I have no doubt they work on an airplane. I've even had a chance to try some out in this scenario before, and I liked it. Do you know if they'd be accurate or a good representation though out "in the field" in other environments?
Old 24th November 2011 | Show parent
  #16
Lives for gear
 
huub's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Yes.. i think the bose ones are good enough to make critical EQ judgements..

but they're not super sturdy..
Old 24th November 2011 | Show parent
  #17
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Liberty Studio ➑️
Actually, I want to believe that they WOULD work.

It would be great to have a clearer idea of what all sounds are interfering with the dialog recordings when I'm out on sets; trying to discern how much I'm picking up extra sounds on the recording compared to just hearing the sound outside the earcups of my headphones.

I have no doubt they work on an airplane. I've even had a chance to try some out in this scenario before, and I liked it. Do you know if they'd be accurate or a good representation though out "in the field" in other environments?
I would say no - on the grounds of wrong product for the task.

The noise cancelling deals best with ongoing sounds - the whining / droning sounds that go on and just tend to get on your nerves. If you sit at the computer and type, you won't hear such a big reduction. It's just a general noise reduction designed to allow you to listen to music at a more comfortable volume. The Bose ones do sound really nice too, but they're not designed for overcoming sound to a point you can use them for complete isolation to make judgements. Apart from anything, they don't silence ambient sound like many people expect them to, they just reduce it.

If you want isolation and accuracy to make judgements, get some HD-25s. They cost less and will do the job better. But if you want to sit on a plane for 10 hours and listen to music with great clarity and remove all the plane noise, or just sit in the lounge at home and watch TV on your laptop whilst somebody watches something else on the main TV, don't buy HD-25s. They'll give you ear fatigue and make the experience less enjoyable. Buy some nice noise cancelling headphones and enjoy.

They're very much a consumer product. Not consumer in the GS meaning of '****e', just consumer in that there's little application for them in anything other than listening to music because you enjoy it.
Old 24th November 2011
  #18
Gear Nut
 
Liberty Studio's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Thanks for the insight, I think I'll follow my original feeling and stick to non-noise-canceling headphones.

As far as normal headphones though; I spent over a year using what I believe were the HD-25's out on jobs, and I hated them. The earcups swivel all the way around and always get tangled, and they're kind of a pain to put on quickly (I like a pair that you can take on/off easily with one hand). Plus one of the connections to one side just simply quit on me – while I was on location, of course.

For now I'll just stick with the ATH-M50, although they're not exactly perfect for me either.
Old 24th November 2011
  #19
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
HD 25II s have swivelling ear piece for communication,Single cord and velour pads.
The spade connectors must be vaselined to keep the rain out.
Their iso saved my ears on many occasions and the quality is monitor pro level imho.

Bose cans would be laughable Im afraid.
Old 24th November 2011
  #20
Gear Guru
 
John Willett's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Liberty Studio ➑️
Thanks for the insight, I think I'll follow my original feeling and stick to non-noise-canceling headphones.

As far as normal headphones though; I spent over a year using what I believe were the HD-25's out on jobs, and I hated them. The earcups swivel all the way around and always get tangled, and they're kind of a pain to put on quickly (I like a pair that you can take on/off easily with one hand). Plus one of the connections to one side just simply quit on me – while I was on location, of course.
Those are the cheap HD 25-SP and are *not* the professional ones.

The pro version is the HD 25-1 II or the HD 25-13 II - these have a split headband and the earcups don't rotate round and round. One earcup swivels for one-ear use, but does not rotate.

The cheap SP version has a cheap headband, like the old HD 414, and the earcups are free to rotate snd twist the cable.

The pro versions have a split headband and a single-sided cable.

The cheap SP version has a dual-sided cable and a single headband - the capsules are also down-rated and are not as good as the pro version.
Old 24th November 2011 | Show parent
  #21
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rolo 46 ➑️
Bose cans would be laughable Im afraid.
Explain?

By day I work on PMCs and Questeds in a built-for-acoustics room.

When travelling I use my Bose cans.

Can't find any 'laughable' issues myself.

I guess Bose are just one of those brands people will forever assume sound nice because of EQ curves not components. They need to wake up and realise that an EQ curve doesn't make something sound nice.
Old 24th November 2011
  #22
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Travelling is not monitoring
As you explained eloquently.
Old 24th November 2011
  #23
Gear Addict
 
Cinemascope's Avatar
 
1 Review written
🎧 10 years
The Bose Cans are only laughable if your own powers of discernment & expectation are inept
Old 24th November 2011
  #24
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Cans on the road take loads of stick
The issue of discernment is in the ineptitude of the Bose Design
My expectation are zero through experience
Bose 99 % marketing 1% engineering imo
The Bose Wave Guide (TM) is a cardboard tube!
Old 24th November 2011 | Show parent
  #25
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rolo 46 ➑️
Travelling is not monitoring
As you explained eloquently.
So what your saying is, Bose are laughable when used for something they're not designed to be used for?

I think it's you who is laughable not the product.
Old 24th November 2011 | Show parent
  #26
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rolo 46 ➑️
Cans on the road take loads of stick
The issue of discernment is in the ineptitude of the Bose Design
My expectation are zero through experience
Bose 99 % marketing 1% engineering imo
The Bose Wave Guide (TM) is a cardboard tube!
How many pairs of Bose headphones do you own then? Really?

You accuse Bose of being 99% marketing, but you yourself are quite clearly swayed by hype more than actual experience. Most Bose users are happy with their purchase, but the pro audio community have, in their 'authority', decided that Bose are simply over marketed crap that sounds 'nice' more than accurate.

This is simply untrue, but as omore people believe and spread it, it takes a more authoritative stance.

As for the cardboard tube... So what? A baffle is a piece of wood, a cabinet is a wooden box, and a speaker is a piece of paper. Nothing on a speaker is space age, it's just engineered by people who understand how to make primitive products into acoustic devices.

Get over yourself and stop spreading crap you have no idea about!
Old 24th November 2011
  #27
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
He tried to patent a cardboard tube.....
Nothing in a speaker is space age.
Tell that to SkanSpeak.
Its all engineering Dear Boy.
Old 24th November 2011
  #28
Lives for gear
 
🎧 10 years
It does shock me to see so many people unable to accept the principle that you might actually listen to music for fun and not just for work.
Old 25th November 2011 | Show parent
  #29
Lives for gear
 
huub's Avatar
 
🎧 15 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by therealbigd ➑️
It does shock me to see so many people unable to accept the principle that you might actually listen to music for fun and not just for work.
The Bose are really pretty nice headphones for professional use too.. They have a tiny little smile curve, but not too bad really, and the noisecancelling can be useful..
Old 25th November 2011
  #30
Gear Guru
 
John Willett's Avatar
 
🎧 10 years
Smile

Noise-cancelling headphones were first developed by Sennheiser in the mid 1980s and I still remember seeing a prototype back in 1986 with about 3U of active electronics.

They make a range from inexpensive up to Bose beaters.

Yes, I do have noise-cancelling headphones and they can be very good in certain situations.

They are great for travel in aircraft, cars, busses, trains, etc. where they cancel out the low frequency rumble.

Active noise cancellation cuts out low frequencies - you need closed sealed headphones to cut out high frequencies.

Bose headphones are pretty OK, but Bose's marketing budget is huge and this obviously has to be paid for in the price of the goods, which is why many people think they are overpriced.

But - although I use active noise reduction headphones for many things, I would not use them for any professional monitoring situation.
πŸ“ Reply

Similar Threads

Thread / Thread Starter Replies / Views Last Post
replies: 5347 views: 1191696
Avatar for starvingmusician
starvingmusician 18 hours ago
replies: 60 views: 4550
Avatar for projektk
projektk 19th May 2014
replies: 64 views: 44838
Avatar for spnc
spnc 23rd December 2020
replies: 5506 views: 556200
Avatar for The Press Desk
The Press Desk 22nd April 2021
Post Reply

Welcome to the Gearspace Pro Audio Community!

Registration benefits include:
  • The ability to reply to and create new discussions
  • Access to members-only giveaways & competitions
  • Interact with VIP industry experts in our guest Q&As
  • Access to members-only sub forum discussions
  • Access to members-only Chat Room
  • Get INSTANT ACCESS to the world's best private pro audio Classifieds for only USD $20/year
  • Promote your eBay auctions and Reverb.com listings for free
  • Remove this message!
You need an account to post a reply. Create a username and password below and an account will be created and your post entered.


 
 
Slide to join now Processing…

Forum Jump
Forum Jump